RE: Jaguar F-Type 2.0 vs. Porsche 718 Cayman

[Oso]

Argh the problem with you journos going on about price is that you never actually have to buy a car!!!

If you got into the detail of negotiating a deal, you'd know that whereas it's very hard to get money off a new Porsche, you can get 10% of an F-type as well as 0% finance if you put down a one-third deposit. Once you take that into account the prices of the two cars is broadly comparable.

[leakymanifold]

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Jag's in the golf club car park, shall we shag now or shall we shag later?

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports might help dispel the stereotype.

Not sure old men shag in car parks? I think you have a confused picture of jag owners - they avoid taxes, and "forget" their wallets when its their turn to pay whilst wearing brogues. A broad statement, but true.

[craigjm]

leakymanifold said:

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Jag's in the golf club car park, shall we shag now or shall we shag later?

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports might help dispel the stereotype.

Not sure old men shag in car parks? I think you have a confused picture of jag owners - they avoid taxes, and "forget" their wallets when its their turn to pay whilst wearing brogues. A broad statement, but true.

Someone has been listening to too much Clarkson

[Rovinghawk]

kostas_miata said:

ash73 said:

Isn't that a bit cheapskate compared to the V8?

Ha in a way it is, but the V8 a lot more expensive!

In your own words: " might as well spend a bit more and get a proper one "

[Oso]

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports coupe might help dispel the stereotype.

You can get a manual V6 F-type...

I guess they've decided the 2.0 Jag needs the auto to get the best out it, as it needs to be revved hard - to be fair, I'd say the turbo Porsches are similar in that respect, PDK gets the best out them.

I am a serial Porsche owner and only just the wrong side of 40, but have borrowed a V8 and an V6 F-type, they are both a blast, certainly I'd say not too old for someone at 45... For sure Jag is still struggling to shake off the old-man image but with F-type, XE and F-pace in the last five years I think they deserve a lot of credit for broadening the appeal of the marque.

[HighwayStar]

Yipper said:

Good review.

The biggest problem with buying a cheap Porker or Jag is that you're gonna get beat at some point by a Golf R or Audi S3 on a lease and then you'll be left with horrific buyer's remorse.

Why? Says more about you than anything else me thinks... Me personally I couldn't give sh!t. I've driven both and I wouldn't walk pass my 981 for either of those. If it's all about pure speed, then knock yourself out. I would imagine but for kids, flexibility and family duties some of those drivers would prefer to be in the Jag or 718.

[David87]

Where do people see the Mustang GT in line with this pair? It's not as 'posh', obviously, but it has more engine than the Jag and 718 added together.

[leakymanifold]

craigjm said:

leakymanifold said:

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Jag's in the golf club car park, shall we shag now or shall we shag later?

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports might help dispel the stereotype.

Not sure old men shag in car parks? I think you have a confused picture of jag owners - they avoid taxes, and "forget" their wallets when its their turn to pay whilst wearing brogues. A broad statement, but true.

Someone has been listening to too much Clarkson

I quite like the caricature, I could see me in a Jag.

I see you are a jag owner. Out of interest, what shoes do you wear most days?

[craigjm]

leakymanifold said:

I quite like the caricature, I could see me in a Jag.

I see you are a jag owner. Out of interest, what shoes do you wear most days?

I don't own a single pair of brogues My sense of style in shoes is rather broad with a large collection of fairly avantgarde offerings often discussed in the shoes thread.

I am not your stereotypical Jag owner but then my Jag is not a stereotypical car either. Check out the readers car section.

[The Surveyor]

David87 said:

Where do people see the Mustang GT in line with this pair? It's not as 'posh', obviously, but it has more engine than the Jag and 718 added together.

The Mustang is a great car but it is still very 'blue collar' IMHO, it'll be driven by the chap who washed Porsche and Jaguars for a living.

[paralla]

I'm actually wearing brouges at work today, admitadly they have a chunky rubber "comando sole" but I'm still too young for a Jaaaag.

[TameRacingDriver]

craigjm said:

Why are people equating price to engine size with comments like "50k for 2 litre engine is too much". There is a vast difference between say a 2.0 Mondeo of 20 years ago and these cars here. I don't hear people make the same argument against the likes of the Alfa 4C or the Lotus Elise / Exige that are about the same money with 1800cc. Are those cars "not sports cars" because of their engines too?

The comparison is flawed.

The Jag is a heavy coupe / GT car which deserves a sonorous engine. It's not getting that from a blown 4-pot. The last time I checked, a 50K Lotus Exige is fitted with a 3.5 V6. However, if we're simply on about the cheaper variants, then they are firstly cheaper (obviously) and secondly they are all about their light weight and handling. The two cars couldn't possibly be more diametrically opposed. The Cayman is kind of a half way house between the Jag and something like an Elise or 4C, in that it is mid-engined and perhaps a bit lighter than the Jag but its still no stripped out sports car, and when we had a lovely 6-pot before it seems like a retrograde step (unless you are only bothered about outright performance).

The problem I've got with this Jaguar is that it looks like a supercar, but then you will get in it, start that engine and be greeted by something that sounds similar to a Ford Focus or Golf. That would completely ruin it for me.Particularly with the knowledge that less than £30K would buy me a brand new 3.7 litre V6 Sports coupe instead, just with the wrong badge (Nissan 370Z). Before anyone bothers commenting on tax or fuel economy, I doubt that would be a concern to anyone able to fork out over £50K on a car...

[HighwayStar]

Mr Tidy said:

F1GTRUeno said:

Because people who are after an F-Type or Cayman are going to be swayed by the fact that a hatchback has the same numbers from a similar engine and think y'know what? I'll have one of them instead.

Don't be bloody ridiculous.

Thanks for that!

The point I was trying to make was that I wouldn't pay a 50+ per cent premium just to get a Porker or Shaguar that didn't do anything much that an Audi/Seat/Skoda/BMW/Ford couldn't do!

Every manufacturer can make a 2 litre 4-pot turbo with 300 ish bhp these days (even Honda have managed it) - so what is so special about the F-Type/Cayman?

Is that really a serious question!!!??
Anyone looking at a F-Type/Cayman isn't gone come to be considering a Audi/Seat/Skoda/BMW/Ford as an option. I didn't... Those cars are considered if you want something fast and practical, family steed where obviously a 2 seater is never going to cut it. If 2 seats is all I need why would I entertain a Golf R or a Focus RS...? Surely you can see that?

[The Surveyor]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Something maybe like a Lotus Elise?

[craigjm]

HighwayStar said:

Is that really a serious question!!!??
Anyone looking at a F-Type/Cayman isn't gone come to be considering a Audi/Seat/Skoda/BMW/Ford as an option

Are you saying that the Audi TTRS and the BMW Z4 etc are not competitors to the Cayman? OK the current Z4 isn't great but there is a new one on the way.

[Paddy78]

The Surveyor said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Something maybe like a Lotus Elise?

Not really comparable. As weekend toys maybe, but the idea of the Porker and Jag is that you can drive them every day without needing to spend the £15k you saved on a chiropractor.

[BenjiS]

Oso said:

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports coupe might help dispel the stereotype.

You can get a manual V6 F-type...

I guess they've decided the 2.0 Jag needs the auto to get the best out it, as it needs to be revved hard - to be fair, I'd say the turbo Porsches are similar in that respect, PDK gets the best out them.

More likely they looked as the sales figures for the manual F-Type (roughly two of them), and decided nobody would bother buying a manual.

[Oso]

BenjiS said:

Oso said:

paralla said:

In my mind Jaguars are old mens cars and Porsches arent.

Not ever having driven a Jaguar I have no idea if there's anything to this thought process but at 45 I still consider myself far too young to be driving a Jaguar of any kind.

Offering a manual transmission in your affordable sports coupe might help dispel the stereotype.

You can get a manual V6 F-type...

I guess they've decided the 2.0 Jag needs the auto to get the best out it, as it needs to be revved hard - to be fair, I'd say the turbo Porsches are similar in that respect, PDK gets the best out them.

More likely they looked as the sales figures for the manual F-Type (roughly two of them), and decided nobody would bother buying a manual.

Yeh on howmanyleft looks like at most there are about 120 out of c. 7k UK cars...

[craigjm]

The view of a Jaguar as being an old mans car is interesting. I guess it depends on when you grew up as to your view.

[The Surveyor]

Paddy78 said:

The Surveyor said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Something maybe like a Lotus Elise?

Not really comparable. As weekend toys maybe, but the idea of the Porker and Jag is that you can drive them every day without needing to spend the £15k you saved on a chiropractor.

Maybe not and they are a little compromised as a daily (to say the least ) compared to the tested Jag or Porsche, but in response to the question "a bit more special, cheaper and had some special character" the Elise fits that requirement. Or spend even less and get a GT86.