What happened to the bubble?

What happened to the bubble?

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Discussion

mollytherocker

Original Poster:

14,365 posts

208 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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Evening all!

Its been a while, I havent been on here for maybe a year?

So, did that pesky little bubble pop yet?

FocusRS3

3,411 posts

90 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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Pop!

Fl0pp3r

859 posts

202 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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nothing to see here...

tumbleweed

SRT Hellcat

7,017 posts

216 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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Not as yet. Good cars are still fetching good money. Average to crap is hanging around a bit. I think people might have become a little bit more discerning as to what they buy.

MDL111

6,892 posts

176 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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Mini datapoint - I have been watching 2 CGTs, both at official dealers, that have been sitting for more than a year, both with price reductions - I"d say the market has slowed down a bit. From what I read re auction results, the "can you believe this price" type deals seem to have also gotten less.
New car sales still strong though judging by the waiting lists/ability to get a car

Koln-RS

3,849 posts

211 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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The economy remains steady, so confidence is holding together, but I'd say prices have eased back and it's much more of a buyer's market. Think the euphoria peaked in 2015.

Cheib

23,110 posts

174 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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MDL111 said:
New car sales still strong though judging by the waiting lists/ability to get a car
I've got a Mini Datapoint about that...I am not sure demand is quite as strong as it was. I've been watching 991.2 GTS's...Quite a few OPC's seems to have ordered 991.2 GTS's as stock/showroom cars in addition to demo's....which surely means they didn't have customers banging down the doors to spec a car themselves ? A couple of PH'ers bought brand new cars that dealers had in stock and my OPC has had two stock cars through in addition to it's demonstrator. These cars don't find their way to the Porsche Approved Used site but do get advertised on their dealer group's "used" car site.

And there are definitely a lot more 991 GTS's on the used market than there were at the beginning of the year.

Market is definitely cooling a bit I think. Which is a good thing!

mollytherocker

Original Poster:

14,365 posts

208 months

Wednesday 13th September 2017
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What the chuffle McChuff is a mini datapoint?


MDL111

6,892 posts

176 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Cheib said:
MDL111 said:
New car sales still strong though judging by the waiting lists/ability to get a car
I've got a Mini Datapoint about that...I am not sure demand is quite as strong as it was. I've been watching 991.2 GTS's...Quite a few OPC's seems to have ordered 991.2 GTS's as stock/showroom cars in addition to demo's....which surely means they didn't have customers banging down the doors to spec a car themselves ? A couple of PH'ers bought brand new cars that dealers had in stock and my OPC has had two stock cars through in addition to it's demonstrator. These cars don't find their way to the Porsche Approved Used site but do get advertised on their dealer group's "used" car site.

And there are definitely a lot more 991 GTS's on the used market than there were at the beginning of the year.

Market is definitely cooling a bit I think. Which is a good thing!
fair point, I was more referring to the likes of GT / RS Porsches, which seem to be impossible to get nowadays.


MDL111

6,892 posts

176 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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mollytherocker said:
What the chuffle McChuff is a mini datapoint?
Establishing new expressions - a real life input that is non-representative due to insignificant sample size ... smile

well or some such wording anyway

ORD

18,086 posts

126 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Have a look at 997 prices through OPCs! Unbelievable prices for cooking models.


Fokker

3,460 posts

221 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Cheib said:
I've got a Mini Datapoint about that...I am not sure demand is quite as strong as it was. I've been watching 991.2 GTS's...Quite a few OPC's seems to have ordered 991.2 GTS's as stock/showroom cars in addition to demo's....which surely means they didn't have customers banging down the doors to spec a car themselves ? A couple of PH'ers bought brand new cars that dealers had in stock and my OPC has had two stock cars through in addition to it's demonstrator. These cars don't find their way to the Porsche Approved Used site but do get advertised on their dealer group's "used" car site.

And there are definitely a lot more 991 GTS's on the used market than there were at the beginning of the year.

Market is definitely cooling a bit I think. Which is a good thing!
The 991.1 GTS is at the same price point as it was this time last year as I bought one in Sept 2016 at £90500 from an OPC.

There are quite a few 991.2 GTS' on the locator and as you say there are a few dealers who ordered cars in addition to the demo items.
The 991.1 GTS wasn't selling particularly well when new and there were up to £10 - £15k discounts at one point where cars were just languishing in the showrooms. Same could well happen to the 991.2 version if dealers are just ordering as many cars as they're allowed which will oversupply the market.

Wouldn't surprise me if the 991.1 GTS is the new 993 Carrera S in terms of desirability due to the N/A engine and amazing soundtrack. I think its still a very good second hand buy.

Cheib

23,110 posts

174 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Fokker said:
Wouldn't surprise me if the 991.1 GTS is the new 993 Carrera S in terms of desirability due to the N/A engine and amazing soundtrack. I think its still a very good second hand buy.
I agree with that about the 991.1.

I am just surprised that dealers needed to/could order cars for themselves because they didn't have customers that wanted the delivery slots. Especially when the model is under a year old!

Fokker

3,460 posts

221 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Cheib said:
I agree with that about the 991.1.

I am just surprised that dealers needed to/could order cars for themselves because they didn't have customers that wanted the delivery slots. Especially when the model is under a year old!
It is nice though to walk into a dealer to see lots of 911's in the showroom instead of Cayennes and Macans!
The .2 has had superb reviews which is great news so I hope it continues to sell well.

I just love the howl of the 991.1. Its one of the truly great sounding Porsches. smile

Maxige

327 posts

203 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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MDL111 said:
Mini datapoint - I have been watching 2 CGTs, both at official dealers, that have been sitting for more than a year, both with price reductions - I"d say the market has slowed down a bit. From what I read re auction results, the "can you believe this price" type deals seem to have also gotten less.
New car sales still strong though judging by the waiting lists/ability to get a car
May I ask details on those 2 cars?

ORD

18,086 posts

126 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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My impression is that 997.2 prices (at least for manual cars) are increasing already, which is pretty bonkers.

No 2010 car is as cheap as mine was 2 years ago.

That suggests to me that the 991.1 prices will hold up very well.

MDL111

6,892 posts

176 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Maxige said:
MDL111 said:
Mini datapoint - I have been watching 2 CGTs, both at official dealers, that have been sitting for more than a year, both with price reductions - I"d say the market has slowed down a bit. From what I read re auction results, the "can you believe this price" type deals seem to have also gotten less.
New car sales still strong though judging by the waiting lists/ability to get a car
May I ask details on those 2 cars?
Sure - a black one at the southern Porsche dealer in Munich and a silver one at Porsche Inntal - from memory now at c 680k and 640k euros. I think the black one was at c 740k last winter and the silver one had various prices, I think in the high 600s and low 700s

isaldiri

18,411 posts

167 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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MDL111 said:
Sure - a black one at the southern Porsche dealer in Munich and a silver one at Porsche Inntal - from memory now at c 680k and 640k euros. I think the black one was at c 740k last winter and the silver one had various prices, I think in the high 600s and low 700s
Thing is, especially for the cgt (and to a lesser extent the 4.0) people have been putting up cars for dreamer amounts both in the continent and here in the UK. The fact that they have come down in asking prices from silly numbers doesn't really mean the market has shifted recently. Imo the cgt market has stalled around mid £500 ish k for a while already given what happened in the last couple of auctions iirc.

MDL111

6,892 posts

176 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
quotequote all
isaldiri said:
MDL111 said:
Sure - a black one at the southern Porsche dealer in Munich and a silver one at Porsche Inntal - from memory now at c 680k and 640k euros. I think the black one was at c 740k last winter and the silver one had various prices, I think in the high 600s and low 700s
Thing is, especially for the cgt (and to a lesser extent the 4.0) people have been putting up cars for dreamer amounts both in the continent and here in the UK. The fact that they have come down in asking prices from silly numbers doesn't really mean the market has shifted recently. Imo the cgt market has stalled around mid £500 ish k for a while already given what happened in the last couple of auctions iirc.
True that is probably a fair point - those 2 cars are just easy to remember as I saw both in person. i do think though that quite a few Porsches and Ferraris that had large price uplifts in the last few years don't seem to be moving as quickly - quite a few cars that Feel like I have been seeing listed for ages - likely though not motivated sellers having their car on cosnignment and it does not hurt them to just sit there and wait

Solarized

436 posts

140 months

Thursday 14th September 2017
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Yeah I'd agree that the so called bubble hasn't burst however prices have stabilised for some cars. I'd expect that good cars will slowly appreciate or at least hold for the immediate foreseeable future.