BMW 1-series Timing Chain snapped

[freedomdriver]

Hi, in need of some advice from all you knowledgable pistonheads. My wife has a BMW 1-Series 61 plate, diesel, 80K mileage. Last week the timing chain (aka Cam belt) broke without any prior warning/noise while the car was in motion. The car was towed to a nearby independent garage. The car is out of warranty hence i figured the independent garage repair bill would be far less than taking it to BMW. However as expected still a hefty garage bill to repair the damage to the engine, valves and a new chain. Question I have is that the car has been serviced regularly by BMW (last full service Dec 2016 and no issues with timing chain noted) can BMW be held liable for the repair or funding part of the repair given if it was checked then the wear of the chain may have been spotted and replacement advised. I rang BMW and cited that at the last full service was the Timing Chain checked? Response given the chain is expected to run the life of the car despite mileage or years (hard to believe) and they do not check the chain on a service unless there is a reason to. I find it difficult to understand why the timing chain is not checked at full services given the crucial part it plays and extensive damage it can cause when it snaps. Currently the car is being repaired and I am wondering if its worth my while pursuing this with BMW - suggestions welcome please, thanking you all in advance.

[anonymous-user]

If the car has done average miles and serviced by BMW on schedule, it might be reasonable to expect the timing chain to last longer than it has.

Might be worth a polite communication through the supplying dealer/ BMW to see if a contribution to the repair cost would be a reasonable outcome.

[Sebring440]

freedomdriver said:

I am wondering if its worth my while pursuing this with BMW.

No. As you stated yourself, the car is out of warranty.

freedomdriver said:

the timing chain (aka Cam belt).

That's a new one on me. I thought a cam belt was a different thing to a timing chain.

[MG CHRIS]

And how do you suppose they check the chain? Also its a very known issue for timing chain failure on these engines and fail at any time. You can go to BMW for any good will but as its already been fixed by a independent garage not much chance.

Oh and sell the pos BMW and get something not built with bottom rate parts.

[F355GTS]

Seem to recall there being a recall on 1 series due to timing chains, worth doing a search on here fro previous threads

[98elise]

freedomdriver said:

Hi, in need of some advice from all you knowledgable pistonheads. My wife has a BMW 1-Series 61 plate, diesel, 80K mileage. Last week the timing chain (aka Cam belt) broke without any prior warning/noise while the car was in motion. The car was towed to a nearby independent garage. The car is out of warranty hence i figured the independent garage repair bill would be far less than taking it to BMW. However as expected still a hefty garage bill to repair the damage to the engine, valves and a new chain. Question I have is that the car has been serviced regularly by BMW (last full service Dec 2016 and no issues with timing chain noted) can BMW be held liable for the repair or funding part of the repair given if it was checked then the wear of the chain may have been spotted and replacement advised. I rang BMW and cited that at the last full service was the Timing Chain checked? Response given the chain is expected to run the life of the car despite mileage or years (hard to believe) and they do not check the chain on a service unless there is a reason to. I find it difficult to understand why the timing chain is not checked at full services given the crucial part it plays and extensive damage it can cause when it snaps. Currently the car is being repaired and I am wondering if its worth my while pursuing this with BMW - suggestions welcome please, thanking you all in advance.

Chains should last the life of a car. They are not something you expect to charge at a set interval. They are also not something I would expect to be checked on a service as there is nothing to check.

Cam belts are a different matter. They normally have a set interval.

[dai1983]

Best thing about the chain is that it's at the back of the engine so the whole lot needs to come out. Awesome!

[Brainpox]

I think as you've already gone to an independent any chance of goodwill has gone out the window.

Had you gone to BMW you probably could have quite easily argued they should foot at least some of the bill. 80k miles in 6 years isn't excessive.

[rallycross]

Sadly since about 2008 BMW 4 cylinder engines (petrol and diesel) are a liability.

Any good will from the main dealer will be minimal and will still end up costing you so much more than finding a good 2nd hand engine or getting an engineering firm to rebuild your engine (if it can be saved).

where are you located?

Just google bmw N47 timing chain (diesel) or N43 (petrol) to see how common this problem is.

[MG CHRIS]

98elise said:

freedomdriver said:

Hi, in need of some advice from all you knowledgable pistonheads. My wife has a BMW 1-Series 61 plate, diesel, 80K mileage. Last week the timing chain (aka Cam belt) broke without any prior warning/noise while the car was in motion. The car was towed to a nearby independent garage. The car is out of warranty hence i figured the independent garage repair bill would be far less than taking it to BMW. However as expected still a hefty garage bill to repair the damage to the engine, valves and a new chain. Question I have is that the car has been serviced regularly by BMW (last full service Dec 2016 and no issues with timing chain noted) can BMW be held liable for the repair or funding part of the repair given if it was checked then the wear of the chain may have been spotted and replacement advised. I rang BMW and cited that at the last full service was the Timing Chain checked? Response given the chain is expected to run the life of the car despite mileage or years (hard to believe) and they do not check the chain on a service unless there is a reason to. I find it difficult to understand why the timing chain is not checked at full services given the crucial part it plays and extensive damage it can cause when it snaps. Currently the car is being repaired and I am wondering if its worth my while pursuing this with BMW - suggestions welcome please, thanking you all in advance.

Chains should last the life of a car. They are not something you expect to charge at a set interval. They are also not something I would expect to be checked on a service as there is nothing to check.

Cam belts are a different matter. They normally have a set interval.

You have obviously never heard about the issues on BMW timing chains failing or Vauxhall engine timing chain to wear and rattle like mad. Also they can stretch and several engines Peugeot 1.6 petrol found in the newer minis have common issue with the timing chain tensioner unscrewing itself at really low miles.

Timing chain are not last life of engine.

[TooMany2cvs]

This is not exactly news.

The official line is that the N47 camchain issues were isolated to 2008-9 production, and the recall stopped in 2015.

It's four years now since it was covered on Watchdog.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/23p5j5wzP...

I'd say your hope of any goodwill is all but zero, and unless you've got an absolutely on-the-button franchise dealer service history, you can forget the "all but".

[freedomdriver]

Thanks for prompt responses already. My mistake timing chain is different to cam belt. In hindsight maybe it would have been better to tow the car to the BMW garage though the garage it is in now though not BMW is reputable. From my research I see that there has been problems with the timing chains on some models of BMW's in the past though this was a few years prior the 61 plate. Maybe a polite letter to BMW may be worth doing..nothing ventured nothing gained

[daemon]

freedomdriver said:

Thanks for prompt responses already. My mistake timing chain is different to cam belt. In hindsight maybe it would have been better to tow the car to the BMW garage though the garage it is in now though not BMW is reputable. From my research I see that there has been problems with the timing chains on some models of BMW's in the past though this was a few years prior the 61 plate. Maybe a polite letter to BMW may be worth doing..nothing ventured nothing gained

This is a damned if you dont and damned if you do scenario sadly.

If you go to a reputable indy, it might cost say, £3,000. If you go to a BMW dealer it might cost £5,000 but you "might" get a "contribution" from BMW for the repair (which will amount to a discount).

[anonymous-user]

The fact that the issue is common supports the OPs position rather than harming it. He relies in proving the fault was present when he bought the car, the widespread occurance of it helps demonstrate that.

The OP would rely on convincing a court that the car was not of the expected quality. The fact it is a BMW, considered a premium product, that it had a full service history, that its mileage is in line with normaility and not particluarly high and that the timing chain is not normally a consumable all help.

Washing machines are expected to last for years, well beyond warranty. A premium car should also.

Saying something is 'out of warranty' is not a catch all to remove responsibility for premature failures, as many manufacturers of many products have found to their cost.

[NelsonM3]

Checking an N47 timing chain properly is an engine out job. Not something that could be done as part of a service.

Based on your age and mileage you'd get a decent contribution from BMW as long as the vehicle has been serviced on time and has a full BMW history. The only issue is that in order to obtain goodwill the cause of failure needs to be determined. This may involve a dealer requiring prior authority to strip the engine to check.

I've had 100% goodwill on engines with more mileage recently so it's definitely worth getting it to a dealer.

[rallycross]

TooMany2cvs said:

This is not exactly news.

The official line is that the N47 camchain issues were isolated to 2008-9 production, and the recall stopped in 2015.
".

Its a much bigger problem than that, it affects a wider year range, a simple summary is avoid any 2.0 D 177 bhp model BMW, however newer ones are also failing.

There was never a proper recall, BMW have sneakily sidestepped their responsibility for building crap engines.

[GroundEffect]

I wonder what they got wrong in their engine durability work to miss this one.

Supplier issue so their DV signoff wasn't valid?
Oil level or quality in testing vs production?
Vibrational or torsional loads different?

[StottyGTR]

I called BMW once to ask about engine codes as my less than 4year old 1 series had st itself spectacularly and I needed a new engine. They told me that even though the car was out of warranty bring it in and they would most likely offer a goodwill price. Not free, but not full whack. Since you've taken it to an indy this may well be out of the window now but it could still be worth an ask.

[NelsonM3]

GroundEffect said:

I wonder what they got wrong in their engine durability work to miss this one.

Supplier issue so their DV signoff wasn't valid?
Oil level or quality in testing vs production?
Vibrational or torsional loads different?

The common link (excuse pun) I have seen in most timing chain failures has been a non-genuine oil filter. That's Audi and BMW only though.

[F10RRSVR]

NelsonM3 said:

The common link (excuse pun) I have seen in most timing chain failures has been a non-genuine oil filter. That's Audi and BMW only though.

Oil filter?
I had thought it to be linked to CBS services and long life oil service...

My N47 powered 5 series is on 154,000 miles on its original chain.. My secret?

Change the oil every 8,000 miles, oil is cheap, it shouldn't be an issue doing it regularly. Obviously new filter every change but I use BOSCH filters which do their job fine.