ULEZ charge in 2021

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kiethton

13,883 posts

179 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
I know there have been dozens of threads on this, but if you work in the highlighted central area here ( https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge...) and commute by car, you deserve to be financially disincentivised.

London is already much too congested and polluted, without the selfishness of individuals driving their cars into the heart of it at peak hours. The public transport infrastructure gives ample opportunity to make journeys inside that zone 24/7, and I can't see any good argument for driving in.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 12:09
Far from it - Tell me how to get from Lee Green - Sydenham (my GF's old commute) without a car.....or even the prior one - Lee - Ramsden (Orpington) on public transport that is in any way time effective or allows her to carry a colleague and equipment?
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
But then add the extra 5 minute walk at the start, the 5-10 minutes waiting in the rain for a bus to turn up and the 10 minute walk at the other end, without considering the 10 minute time saving driving yourself there would give you. That totals up to over an extra hour a day out of the house, and costs the same, without having your face in an unwashed catford residents armpit. It's far safer too, knowing Catford would you as a youngish woman want to be on a bus with a load of semi-mental patients? Taking it together why would you travel on a bus?

Equipment is: Class books, folders & files, messy play activities and products etc.

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
captainaverage said:
C70R said:
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
how much do you use public transport?
Every single weekday (from Z2 SE to Z2 North), and most weekends.

Why do you ask?

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
Rovinghawk said:
C70R said:
What is this spurious "equipment" you're talking about?
In my case a theodolite, tripod, survey staff, coupla cans of spraypaint, sledgehammer & a few steel pins plus a laptop & a packed lunch.
That's a ridiculous amount of stuff (particularly a sledgehammer) for any individual to be expected to carry on public transport.
It's your employer you should take umbrage with, not TfL.

TheAngryDog

12,394 posts

208 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
C70R said:
Rovinghawk said:
C70R said:
What is this spurious "equipment" you're talking about?
In my case a theodolite, tripod, survey staff, coupla cans of spraypaint, sledgehammer & a few steel pins plus a laptop & a packed lunch.
That's a ridiculous amount of stuff (particularly a sledgehammer) for any individual to be expected to carry on public transport.
It's your employer you should take umbrage with, not TfL.
I don't recall seeing Rovinghawk complaining...

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
I know there have been dozens of threads on this, but if you work in the highlighted central area here ( https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge...) and commute by car, you deserve to be financially disincentivised.

London is already much too congested and polluted, without the selfishness of individuals driving their cars into the heart of it at peak hours. The public transport infrastructure gives ample opportunity to make journeys inside that zone 24/7, and I can't see any good argument for driving in.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 12:09
Far from it - Tell me how to get from Lee Green - Sydenham (my GF's old commute) without a car.....or even the prior one - Lee - Ramsden (Orpington) on public transport that is in any way time effective or allows her to carry a colleague and equipment?
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
But then add the extra 5 minute walk at the start, the 5-10 minutes waiting in the rain for a bus to turn up and the 10 minute walk at the other end, without considering the 10 minute time saving driving yourself there would give you. That totals up to over an extra hour a day out of the house, and costs the same, without having your face in an unwashed catford residents armpit. It's far safer too, knowing Catford would you as a youngish woman want to be on a bus with a load of semi-mental patients? Taking it together why would you travel on a bus?

Equipment is: Class books, folders & files, messy play activities and products etc.
That was actually door-to-door and including waiting times, via CityMapper. However, I acknowledge that there may be some variance in it. I'm not sure how "10min" vs. 30min saves you an hour a day, particularly when you apply your logic of delays via traffic/parking etc.
I say "10min" because Waze is currently predicting 19min by car to cover the same Lee-Sydenham journey I checked on CityMapper. Think there might be a bit of creative licence going on here... laugh

What you're effectively saying is that your OH carries enough to work which could fit into a large rucksack (as many others would typically carry), and doesn't like taking the bus because of the smelly locals. The latter is almost a viable reason to drive, if you felt strongly enough, in spite of sounding a bit snobby about the area you chose to live in.
But crucially, it doesn't give you licence to whine when alternatives are readily available (and doubtless cheaper) - particularly when your OH, like many others, is contributing to the current issue of road congestion in London.

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
TheAngryDog said:
C70R said:
Rovinghawk said:
C70R said:
What is this spurious "equipment" you're talking about?
In my case a theodolite, tripod, survey staff, coupla cans of spraypaint, sledgehammer & a few steel pins plus a laptop & a packed lunch.
That's a ridiculous amount of stuff (particularly a sledgehammer) for any individual to be expected to carry on public transport.
It's your employer you should take umbrage with, not TfL.
I don't recall seeing Rovinghawk complaining...
Then why is he replying to a comment about people carrying too much "equipment" to make public transport viable?

kiethton

13,883 posts

179 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
I know there have been dozens of threads on this, but if you work in the highlighted central area here ( https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge...) and commute by car, you deserve to be financially disincentivised.

London is already much too congested and polluted, without the selfishness of individuals driving their cars into the heart of it at peak hours. The public transport infrastructure gives ample opportunity to make journeys inside that zone 24/7, and I can't see any good argument for driving in.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 12:09
Far from it - Tell me how to get from Lee Green - Sydenham (my GF's old commute) without a car.....or even the prior one - Lee - Ramsden (Orpington) on public transport that is in any way time effective or allows her to carry a colleague and equipment?
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
But then add the extra 5 minute walk at the start, the 5-10 minutes waiting in the rain for a bus to turn up and the 10 minute walk at the other end, without considering the 10 minute time saving driving yourself there would give you. That totals up to over an extra hour a day out of the house, and costs the same, without having your face in an unwashed catford residents armpit. It's far safer too, knowing Catford would you as a youngish woman want to be on a bus with a load of semi-mental patients? Taking it together why would you travel on a bus?

Equipment is: Class books, folders & files, messy play activities and products etc.
That was actually door-to-door and including waiting times, via CityMapper. However, I acknowledge that there may be some variance in it. I'm not sure how "10min" vs. 30min saves you an hour a day, particularly when you apply your logic of delays via traffic/parking etc.
I say "10min" because Waze is currently predicting 19min by car to cover the same Lee-Sydenham journey I checked on CityMapper. Think there might be a bit of creative licence going on here... laugh

What you're effectively saying is that your OH carries enough to work which could fit into a large rucksack (as many others would typically carry), and doesn't like taking the bus because of the smelly locals. The latter is almost a viable reason to drive, if you felt strongly enough, in spite of sounding a bit snobby about the area you chose to live in.
But crucially, it doesn't give you licence to whine when alternatives are readily available (and doubtless cheaper) - particularly when you OH, like many others, is contributing to the current issue of road congestion in London.
I'm adding the extra to allow for the walks at either end of the journey - she didn't live/work in the centre of each location/by the bus route and the times you quote don't include the wait for the bus, missing one = a 10 minute wait....

Her parents house was a 5 minute walk to where she is able to take the bus, her work a 10 minute walk (away from bus routes) in Sydenham - it doesn't work.

Yes zones 1&2 do likely work on public transport, outside doesn't.

What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.

NickCQ

5,392 posts

95 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
I'm adding the extra to allow for the walks at either end of the journey - she didn't live/work in the centre of each location/by the bus route and the times you quote don't include the wait for the bus, missing one = a 10 minute wait....

Her parents house was a 5 minute walk to where she is able to take the bus, her work a 10 minute walk (away from bus routes) in Sydenham - it doesn't work.

Yes zones 1&2 do likely work on public transport, outside doesn't.

What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.
I don't understand why you are pursuing this argument when the journey your OH makes is totally outside the zone and thus not affected by either the proposals or C70R's post.

Pica-Pica

13,621 posts

83 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
I know there have been dozens of threads on this, but if you work in the highlighted central area here ( https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge...) and commute by car, you deserve to be financially disincentivised.

London is already much too congested and polluted, without the selfishness of individuals driving their cars into the heart of it at peak hours. The public transport infrastructure gives ample opportunity to make journeys inside that zone 24/7, and I can't see any good argument for driving in.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 12:09
Far from it - Tell me how to get from Lee Green - Sydenham (my GF's old commute) without a car.....or even the prior one - Lee - Ramsden (Orpington) on public transport that is in any way time effective or allows her to carry a colleague and equipment?
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
But then add the extra 5 minute walk at the start, the 5-10 minutes waiting in the rain for a bus to turn up and the 10 minute walk at the other end, without considering the 10 minute time saving driving yourself there would give you. That totals up to over an extra hour a day out of the house, and costs the same, without having your face in an unwashed catford residents armpit. It's far safer too, knowing Catford would you as a youngish woman want to be on a bus with a load of semi-mental patients? Taking it together why would you travel on a bus?

Equipment is: Class books, folders & files, messy play activities and products etc.
That was actually door-to-door and including waiting times, via CityMapper. However, I acknowledge that there may be some variance in it. I'm not sure how "10min" vs. 30min saves you an hour a day, particularly when you apply your logic of delays via traffic/parking etc.
I say "10min" because Waze is currently predicting 19min by car to cover the same Lee-Sydenham journey I checked on CityMapper. Think there might be a bit of creative licence going on here... laugh

What you're effectively saying is that your OH carries enough to work which could fit into a large rucksack (as many others would typically carry), and doesn't like taking the bus because of the smelly locals. The latter is almost a viable reason to drive, if you felt strongly enough, in spite of sounding a bit snobby about the area you chose to live in.
But crucially, it doesn't give you licence to whine when alternatives are readily available (and doubtless cheaper) - particularly when you OH, like many others, is contributing to the current issue of road congestion in London.
I'm adding the extra to allow for the walks at either end of the journey - she didn't live/work in the centre of each location/by the bus route and the times you quote don't include the wait for the bus, missing one = a 10 minute wait....

Her parents house was a 5 minute walk to where she is able to take the bus, her work a 10 minute walk (away from bus routes) in Sydenham - it doesn't work.

Yes zones 1&2 do likely work on public transport, outside doesn't.

What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.
Yes it is. Do a local shop. You end up buying what you need, not what they want to sell you.
Go by bus, heavens knows you may meet people with wider viewpoints - too cosy a comfort zone?

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
kiethton said:
C70R said:
I know there have been dozens of threads on this, but if you work in the highlighted central area here ( https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/congestion-charge...) and commute by car, you deserve to be financially disincentivised.

London is already much too congested and polluted, without the selfishness of individuals driving their cars into the heart of it at peak hours. The public transport infrastructure gives ample opportunity to make journeys inside that zone 24/7, and I can't see any good argument for driving in.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 12:09
Far from it - Tell me how to get from Lee Green - Sydenham (my GF's old commute) without a car.....or even the prior one - Lee - Ramsden (Orpington) on public transport that is in any way time effective or allows her to carry a colleague and equipment?
Erm...
Not sure if you're serious or not.
  • Lee (only "Lee Green" if you're embarrassed to live next to Catford laugh) to Sydenham appears to be half an hour on a bus (the 202)
  • Lee to Ramsden appears to be ~45min, by bus/train/bus
  • I assume your OH (and her colleague) is capable of the above, and the "equipment" isn't a cement-mixer
  • None of these places are in the current T-Zone (did you look at my link?)
  • The proposed (i.e. unconfirmed) ULEZ rollout may not include any of those areas, or may offer exemption for living inside, and is likely to limit only to "Euro 4/5" compliance for cars - hardly a major hurdle if she was hell-bent on driving
Can't quite figure out exactly what your issue is.
But then add the extra 5 minute walk at the start, the 5-10 minutes waiting in the rain for a bus to turn up and the 10 minute walk at the other end, without considering the 10 minute time saving driving yourself there would give you. That totals up to over an extra hour a day out of the house, and costs the same, without having your face in an unwashed catford residents armpit. It's far safer too, knowing Catford would you as a youngish woman want to be on a bus with a load of semi-mental patients? Taking it together why would you travel on a bus?

Equipment is: Class books, folders & files, messy play activities and products etc.
That was actually door-to-door and including waiting times, via CityMapper. However, I acknowledge that there may be some variance in it. I'm not sure how "10min" vs. 30min saves you an hour a day, particularly when you apply your logic of delays via traffic/parking etc.
I say "10min" because Waze is currently predicting 19min by car to cover the same Lee-Sydenham journey I checked on CityMapper. Think there might be a bit of creative licence going on here... laugh

What you're effectively saying is that your OH carries enough to work which could fit into a large rucksack (as many others would typically carry), and doesn't like taking the bus because of the smelly locals. The latter is almost a viable reason to drive, if you felt strongly enough, in spite of sounding a bit snobby about the area you chose to live in.
But crucially, it doesn't give you licence to whine when alternatives are readily available (and doubtless cheaper) - particularly when you OH, like many others, is contributing to the current issue of road congestion in London.
I'm adding the extra to allow for the walks at either end of the journey - she didn't live/work in the centre of each location/by the bus route and the times you quote don't include the wait for the bus, missing one = a 10 minute wait....

Her parents house was a 5 minute walk to where she is able to take the bus, her work a 10 minute walk (away from bus routes) in Sydenham - it doesn't work.

Yes zones 1&2 do likely work on public transport, outside doesn't.

What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.
Haha. I love how the goalposts start to shift as soon as you scratch the surface in these threads - it's always the same. People try to pick holes in anything that they think impinges upon their "right" to drive, without really reading the details.

Let me just shut down your spurious arguments for a moment:
  • Shopping - Taking an Uber (other taxis are available) once a week is over a short journey is probably cheaper than a year's road tax on a post-2006 car
  • Bulky items - Unless you absolutely must have that weekly supermarket visit experience, every single supermarket offers a delivery service, and Lee (not "Lee Green") is littered with local supermarkets - there's no need to buy in ridiculous bulk in person
  • Cars - It's likely that the proposed area will only limit users to Euro 4+ compliant cars, rather than banning them completely - they aren't stopping you from driving
  • Inside/outside Z1&2 - We've just proven that we could get your OH to work (even with the spurious extra "15min" walking) via public transport in around the average London commute time (~45min) against her "20min" drive (not including traffic etc.). If she doesn't want to take public transport because it's smelly/cramped, big cities are not the place for her.
So, basically, much ado about nothing.

gavsdavs

1,203 posts

125 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.
You ever heard of Uber ? Or any other preferred cab firm?

Alternatives to private car transport in London exist.

It sounds a bit like if you didn't have a car you wouldn't leave the house (light hearted - not meant to be a dig)

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
NickCQ said:
kiethton said:
I'm adding the extra to allow for the walks at either end of the journey - she didn't live/work in the centre of each location/by the bus route and the times you quote don't include the wait for the bus, missing one = a 10 minute wait....

Her parents house was a 5 minute walk to where she is able to take the bus, her work a 10 minute walk (away from bus routes) in Sydenham - it doesn't work.

Yes zones 1&2 do likely work on public transport, outside doesn't.

What about other activities - doing the weekly food shop?, no way of carrying enough food to where we currently live (12 min walk to a bus stop) - try carrying enough food for the week, a 15 pack of bog roll and a crate or 2 of beer home. Its not possible.
I don't understand why you are pursuing this argument when the journey your OH makes is totally outside the zone and thus not affected by either the proposals or C70R's post.
I've just remembered that he had a similar whinge on a related thread a while back. He basically lives on the South Circular, so has the hump that his OH might need to rub shoulders with the locals. Seems to complain about any potential driving restrictions in London - basically lives in the wrong part of the country.

ETA - I live much more centrally than OP, and am therefore much more likely to be limited by any driving restrictions. However, I'm not a selfish sod and recognise that there is far too much traffic/pollution on the roads currently.

kiethton

13,883 posts

179 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
NickCQ said:
I don't understand why you are pursuing this argument when the journey your OH makes is totally outside the zone and thus not affected by either the proposals or C70R's post.
Lee is inside the proposed 2021 extension.....

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
NickCQ said:
I don't understand why you are pursuing this argument when the journey your OH makes is totally outside the zone and thus not affected by either the proposals or C70R's post.
Lee is inside the proposed 2021 extension.....
So buy a Euro 4 compliant car for your OH and stop whingeing (£10 says she owns one already laugh).
Or move further out. Either works.

mgv8

1,631 posts

270 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
They are going to have to give Uber back there license or it's going to be very hard.

I see some people are saying it will not work for them, my question is do you have a choice?

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
mgv8 said:
They are going to have to give Uber back there license or it's going to be very hard.

I see some people are saying it will not work for them, my question is do you have a choice?
You realise that taxis (including Private Hires) worked before Uber arrived.
The people who say it "won't work" for them are those who don't want it to work.

Hoofy

76,253 posts

281 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
Anyone got a map of the 2021 extension?

It's probably easier to just buy a hybrid nearer the time. You have 2-3 years. smile

I hump around disco and sports kit; I suppose I could use a taxi or fit it all in a small man bag. wobble

kiethton

13,883 posts

179 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
C70R said:
mgv8 said:
They are going to have to give Uber back there license or it's going to be very hard.

I see some people are saying it will not work for them, my question is do you have a choice?
You realise that taxis (including Private Hires) worked before Uber arrived.
The people who say it "won't work" for them are those who don't want it to work.
But at what cost - you have to be at x location at x time

Even driving a pre-'06 or '15 car it'll still be cheaper to drive (assuming free parking) vs. a taxi...

Thing is although I'm now compliant (for the car only) after a change a huge number of people aren't, beyond that how long will it be before they tighten the restrictions further?

C70R

17,596 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
C70R said:
mgv8 said:
They are going to have to give Uber back there license or it's going to be very hard.

I see some people are saying it will not work for them, my question is do you have a choice?
You realise that taxis (including Private Hires) worked before Uber arrived.
The people who say it "won't work" for them are those who don't want it to work.
But at what cost - you have to be at x location at x time

Even driving a pre-'06 or '15 car it'll still be cheaper to drive (assuming free parking) vs. a taxi...

Thing is although I'm now compliant (for the car only) after a change a huge number of people aren't, beyond that how long will it be before they tighten the restrictions further?
So you're effectively saying that your currently scenario was a complete smokescreen, (which failed) to highlight the issue?
As for the "huge number of people", TfL isn't proposing a reduction in public transport or cutting their legs off - they still have all of the same options that I've spent the past two pages highlighting.

As for the taxi thing, we were talking about your imaginary, mandatory, once-weekly shopping trip - where you couldn't possibly carry everything you needed on public transport. A tenner a week (assuming your imaginary schedule - remember, you can take the bus there!) is the same as just taxing a 2006 car, without even thinking about petrol, insurance etc.

You still haven't made a single compelling argument.

Edited by C70R on Monday 23 October 14:38

Hoofy

76,253 posts

281 months

Monday 23rd October 2017
quotequote all
kiethton said:
But at what cost - you have to be at x location at x time

Even driving a pre-'06 or '15 car it'll still be cheaper to drive (assuming free parking) vs. a taxi...

Thing is although I'm now compliant (for the car only) after a change a huge number of people aren't, beyond that how long will it be before they tighten the restrictions further?
Oh, your wife can just increase her rate to cover the cost, too. Probably the easiest way. Doesn't solve jackst in terms of pollution but more money for TfL. biggrin
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