RE: One (of many) careful owner(s)
Discussion
I had a look at a car at one of a certain large UK dealer chain.
The V5 had the name of a company on it, and when I asked about it was told that was the UK HQ of one of the big rental corps (can't remember which one), but was reassured repeatedly that it wasn't a hire car, but rather was used to drive visiting executives around.
I passed and ended up buying a similar car from a different UK chain, that was ex-motability, in perfect condition with a 1/5 of the mileage, a perfect service history and £3k cheaper.
The V5 had the name of a company on it, and when I asked about it was told that was the UK HQ of one of the big rental corps (can't remember which one), but was reassured repeatedly that it wasn't a hire car, but rather was used to drive visiting executives around.
I passed and ended up buying a similar car from a different UK chain, that was ex-motability, in perfect condition with a 1/5 of the mileage, a perfect service history and £3k cheaper.
Edited by JuniorD on Wednesday 10th January 11:35
JB! said:
So many people have 8-4/9-5 manufacturing or office jobs, split your staff and get more punters in.
You don't get more punters in though, there are no more people in the market at a point in time because dealerships are open longer, the demand is unchanged. You just get the same number of people coming in over a longer period.
I wouldn't mind working 10:00am-8:00pm as I hate mornings generally and that would suit me well. But it'd end up being a week on earlies, a week on lates etc
Same phenomenon as when I worked in a dealership that only opened Mon-Sat. Every couple of years the MD would have the brainwave to trial Sunday opening. It played havoc with the rotas, staff were more tired and less motivated and the increase in a) footfall and b) deals done was - nil.
People who turned up on Sundays expecting us to be open (having not bothered to use the internet to check first, 10 seconds effort) would go home and we'd have web enquiries waiting on Monday morning, or a load of phone enquiries up to midday booking appointments for during the week or on Saturday following.
Likewise most places usually the sales staff finish at 6:00pm and each day one person stays behind an extra hour of opening. It's a good time to do admin or hand over a car as the only calls or walk-ins you tend to get are people dropping their car off/picking it up from Service, looking for Parts or company car people on their way home.
People who work the shifts you mention tend to do that Mon-Fri. They have all weekend to visit dealerships and the vast majority are open. Those 16-18 hours of business are far more productive than an extra 2 hours on weekday evenings. The general rule is what you sell Mon-Fri is the number that you'll sell over the following weekend.
That hasn't changed in the 18 years I've been in dealerships, from the pre-internet age to now.
Like supermarkets being open 24 hours - they didn't suddenly double their sales. The same number of people only need the same amount of groceries. But now your overheads are increased.
Turbobanana said:
TBH, those on this forum are probably not so much in this market, which is mostly populated by bread-and-butter white goods-type cars, rather than anything interesting. If you were almost in the market for a Ferrari / Lamborghini, would you buy an ex-rental one from one of those high-end rental companies?
We owned a Company that traded high end ex rental cars including many from Accident Exchange.For the most part these vehicles were well maintained with full md history and in the trade their value was no different to any other similar vehicles.
Never ceases to amaze me how people get on their high horse regarding previous ownership of in particular mainstream bread and butter stuff. If it wasn't for the abundance of ex rental cars and the like, Joe public would not benefit from bargain basement prices and huge depreciation borne by the first user.
On another aspect don't forget that all the ex Silverstone Porsche track cars end up at Official Porsche dealers retailed at top money as one owner including 2 year old GT3 and GT3 RS over £200k most of which have benefited from constant 9000rpmragging, doughnuts
and literally 1000s of launch starts by 1000s of drivers. Doesn't seem to do them any harm either.
Fast Bug said:
Article said:
affected by the scourge of cars previously sat in by dirty, cackling fleet drivers rather than normal human beings
Really? A chimp with a typewriter could write better articles than the dirty tab smoking free loading journos (as we're stereotyping).I'd rather have an ex fleet car that's spent it's life up and down the motorway being driven by someone in a suit than a Mum that's done lots of short journeys bouncing up and down kerbs with young kids in the back leaving the car covered in a film of snot and raisins, scuffed wheels, bumpers and McD's wrappers (again as we're stereotyping).
Those in the know, knew that the old (orange) sodium street lamp light, used to show up paint differences very well and buying in the dark was less of a risk
Street lights these days are super crisp LED light which flatters by shadow and contrast. Buyer beware.
Regardless, never buy a wet car.
Street lights these days are super crisp LED light which flatters by shadow and contrast. Buyer beware.
Regardless, never buy a wet car.
4941cc said:
JB! said:
So many people have 8-4/9-5 manufacturing or office jobs, split your staff and get more punters in.
You don't get more punters in though, there are no more people in the market at a point in time because dealerships are open longer, the demand is unchanged. You just get the same number of people coming in over a longer period.
I wouldn't mind working 10:00am-8:00pm as I hate mornings generally and that would suit me well. But it'd end up being a week on earlies, a week on lates etc
Same phenomenon as when I worked in a dealership that only opened Mon-Sat. Every couple of years the MD would have the brainwave to trial Sunday opening. It played havoc with the rotas, staff were more tired and less motivated and the increase in a) footfall and b) deals done was - nil.
People who turned up on Sundays expecting us to be open (having not bothered to use the internet to check first, 10 seconds effort) would go home and we'd have web enquiries waiting on Monday morning, or a load of phone enquiries up to midday booking appointments for during the week or on Saturday following.
Likewise most places usually the sales staff finish at 6:00pm and each day one person stays behind an extra hour of opening. It's a good time to do admin or hand over a car as the only calls or walk-ins you tend to get are people dropping their car off/picking it up from Service, looking for Parts or company car people on their way home.
People who work the shifts you mention tend to do that Mon-Fri. They have all weekend to visit dealerships and the vast majority are open. Those 16-18 hours of business are far more productive than an extra 2 hours on weekday evenings. The general rule is what you sell Mon-Fri is the number that you'll sell over the following weekend.
That hasn't changed in the 18 years I've been in dealerships, from the pre-internet age to now.
Like supermarkets being open 24 hours - they didn't suddenly double their sales. The same number of people only need the same amount of groceries. But now your overheads are increased.
MDMetal said:
I think your missing the point, demand doesn't change what changes is more aggressively targeting the demand. Yes that's possibly only speculative buyers vs someone who knows they want car X that you have. Anyone who wants something reasonably common and searches around finds 5 of them and goes to look at the on a Sunday probably picks out what they want and makes a choice, if your number 5 and your not open on a Sunday sucks to be you.
That's the commercial risk you take and weigh up when you're setting and reviewing your opening hours. You'll never win them all. That one deal might be the only one you do on a Sunday in a month, meanwhile you've potentially had to take on one extra member of sales staff all year - not exactly worthwhile use of resources. The majority of dealerships are open for considerably more hours than most people work as it is, including Sundays.A few have policies about not working on Sundays, some for business reasons as above, having made that judgment and run a trial period. One that I know of doesn't open on Sundays because the MD and family that own the business are Christians and believe their workers should observe the Sabbath (irrespective of the workers' faith) as a moral standpoint, spend time with their family instead as it's not ALL about chasing the last buck.
Look at any Manufacturers dealer forecourt and many of the late used cars have the same reg area prefix think 'OE' Oxford JLR, 'KP' Milton Keynes, Audi, VW, Mercedes Benz etc.These are all ex HQ- manufacturer cars driven by (HQ staff, courtesy cars, rentals, experience day cars and worse of all press(journalist) cars 
). Yes how many episodes of Top Gear have you seen Clarkson & Co ripping up a car on a test track and 3 months later it is been de-fleeted and sold onto the dealer network. Press cars and 'Experience day' cars are the most abused and need the most TLC to get them back to a sellable state
). Yes how many episodes of Top Gear have you seen Clarkson & Co ripping up a car on a test track and 3 months later it is been de-fleeted and sold onto the dealer network. Press cars and 'Experience day' cars are the most abused and need the most TLC to get them back to a sellable state Domf said:
Look at any Manufacturers dealer forecourt and many of the late used cars have the same reg area prefix think 'OE' Oxford JLR, 'KP' Milton Keynes, Audi, VW, Mercedes Benz etc.These are all ex HQ- manufacturer cars driven by (HQ staff, courtesy cars, rentals, experience day cars and worse of all press(journalist) cars ). Yes how many episodes of Top Gear have you seen Clarkson & Co ripping up a car on a test track and 3 months later it is been de-fleeted and sold onto the dealer network. Press cars and 'Experience day' cars are the most abused and need the most TLC to get them back to a sellable state
I bought an E92 M3 (a 2007 manual car) years back. ). Yes how many episodes of Top Gear have you seen Clarkson & Co ripping up a car on a test track and 3 months later it is been de-fleeted and sold onto the dealer network. Press cars and 'Experience day' cars are the most abused and need the most TLC to get them back to a sellable state Using the vin decoder I found out it had a 'press preparation' option. Subsequent reading found that it was originally a press car (obviously haha) and had no doubt had it balls kicked in from day one.
I was gutted initially then reality kicked in and I was happy with the car as there was nothing wrong with it - looked and drove first class.
JuniorD said:
it wasn't a hire car, but rather was used to drive visiting executives around.
Ah yes the 'visiting executives' old chestnut.Edited by JuniorD on Wednesday 10th January 11:35
Sales reps usually drive themselves....instantly recognisable by the scourge of our motorway network...the badly driven ubiquitous aspirational
white 2.0 tdi whatever hogging everyones s
tter in the outside lane.Whilst having an ex press car is a downer for most vehicles, if the car is old or something interesting then it can actually add to the value or history of the car.
I have an ex demo fleet Land Rover that is featured in an Autocar road test from 1982. This has provided not only a valuable reference for details during restoration, but a considerable point of historic interest that has boosted the value of the car. Interestingly, the article mentions achieving a top speed of 80mph, which according to gearing charts is 100rpm over the stated maximum of that engine. Despite this, the engine was found to be in excellent condition when taken apart during restoration... Weird I know, but go figure.
In a more relevant note, a friend has a Freelander that appeared on 5th gear when new. He takes pride in its fame, and again it seems to be in excellent condition despite its former life.
In both cases, the vehicles are top spec with all the toys added, but due to their former lives were sold for under market value to the next owner. So, if you don't mind the history.l, a bit of a win-win.
I have an ex demo fleet Land Rover that is featured in an Autocar road test from 1982. This has provided not only a valuable reference for details during restoration, but a considerable point of historic interest that has boosted the value of the car. Interestingly, the article mentions achieving a top speed of 80mph, which according to gearing charts is 100rpm over the stated maximum of that engine. Despite this, the engine was found to be in excellent condition when taken apart during restoration... Weird I know, but go figure.
In a more relevant note, a friend has a Freelander that appeared on 5th gear when new. He takes pride in its fame, and again it seems to be in excellent condition despite its former life.
In both cases, the vehicles are top spec with all the toys added, but due to their former lives were sold for under market value to the next owner. So, if you don't mind the history.l, a bit of a win-win.
ChemicalChaos said:
In a more relevant note, a friend has a Freelander that appeared on 5th gear when new. He takes pride in its fame, and again it seems to be in excellent condition despite its former life.
Was it the one Tom Ford compared to an X-Trail? All else being equal (I.e. price and condition), I’d take the car from the show. Good differentiator in an ad and there are plenty of people chasing Jon (John) Voight’s LeBaron.Cars ‘n booze, can’t help thinking there’s a flaw here.....
On the subject of ex daily rentals there’s a school of thought that believes they are a sound buy;
Nearly new
No ownership/hp/cat c or d worries
Maintenance done in full on time
Normally very low miles
And run in by a variety of different drivers which on modern engines is a good thing.
And you can tell a lot about a car from the visible stuff;
Tyre wear, especially fronts
Steering wheel condition, is the leather still matt, with grain or smooth and shiny
Ditto gear knob
Kick plates and sills, are they unmarked.
I looked at a 61 plate Honda Civic Type R a few weeks ago. It belied it’s 40k miles, every place where you’d expect wear was perfect. My comment to my wife was ‘ this has been driven by a woman ‘ The fairer sex are much easier on cars, and from experience of running LGVS the tyre wear, fuel consumption and damage are all lower, much lower. So my advice is buy a car from a lady. Make sure she was the driver not merely the ‘owner’.
On the subject of ex daily rentals there’s a school of thought that believes they are a sound buy;
Nearly new
No ownership/hp/cat c or d worries
Maintenance done in full on time
Normally very low miles
And run in by a variety of different drivers which on modern engines is a good thing.
And you can tell a lot about a car from the visible stuff;
Tyre wear, especially fronts
Steering wheel condition, is the leather still matt, with grain or smooth and shiny
Ditto gear knob
Kick plates and sills, are they unmarked.
I looked at a 61 plate Honda Civic Type R a few weeks ago. It belied it’s 40k miles, every place where you’d expect wear was perfect. My comment to my wife was ‘ this has been driven by a woman ‘ The fairer sex are much easier on cars, and from experience of running LGVS the tyre wear, fuel consumption and damage are all lower, much lower. So my advice is buy a car from a lady. Make sure she was the driver not merely the ‘owner’.
I think it's a positive thing if salespeeps are stopped from describing cars as "Management Cars" when they are from BRAC/ARAC/HRAC/ERAC etc.
If you don't want an ex-rental get them to write on the invoice: "THE DEALER & SALESPERSON WILL JOINTLY OFFER A FULL REFUND IF THE VEHICLE IS MISREPRESENTED AND IS FROM A RENTAL COMPANY."
Just remember my mantra: If a salesperson opens their mouth they are lying.
If you don't want an ex-rental get them to write on the invoice: "THE DEALER & SALESPERSON WILL JOINTLY OFFER A FULL REFUND IF THE VEHICLE IS MISREPRESENTED AND IS FROM A RENTAL COMPANY."
Just remember my mantra: If a salesperson opens their mouth they are lying.
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