When will you own an electric car?
Discussion
Oddly, Toyota who have a large range of hybrids, have ruled out doing the same to the gt86 which is about the ideal car for me to be a hybrid.
Though, I would probably have a none hybrid version in preference at the moment if the hybrid was significantly more expensive or weighty as my commute is only 14 miles a day, and I'm not in need of saving.
But ideally, for me to get into a hybrid or an ev, it's not got to be of the type for the sandal wearing quiche eating brigade, or the highly affluent fashion accessory owning mob.
A nice coupe, rwd, short ev only range but with hybrid Eco mode and electric boost sports mode would start to interest me.
Though, I would probably have a none hybrid version in preference at the moment if the hybrid was significantly more expensive or weighty as my commute is only 14 miles a day, and I'm not in need of saving.
But ideally, for me to get into a hybrid or an ev, it's not got to be of the type for the sandal wearing quiche eating brigade, or the highly affluent fashion accessory owning mob.
A nice coupe, rwd, short ev only range but with hybrid Eco mode and electric boost sports mode would start to interest me.
I test drove the Leaf, i3 and Zoe and ended up buying a Zoe for the following reasons.
i3
Pros:
Fast in a straight line
Looks quite nice
Cons:
Range is poor even with rex
Tiny boot, had to fold a seat to get a small pushchair in
Only 4 seats
Rear doors are useless if you are parked next to something
Over complex i drive
Made me and everybody else who went in it feel a bit ill, the salesman told me that this is common
Expensive
Leaf
Pros:
Spacious
Fast around town
Cons:
Very ugly inside and out
I found the seat very uncomfortable
Terrible touch screen
Limited range
Handling
Zoe
Pros:
Range, I am getting around 140 miles even at sub zero temperatures
looks quite good
5 seats
decent boot
Handles ok
Cheap
Fast around town
Cons:
Build quality is poor, no rattles but it all feels quite cheap.
Ride quality is bad over big bumps, it hates speed bumps.
Lack of safety kit, why no curtain airbags?
A bit slow above 60mph.
For me the Zoe won but I understand that not everybody will agree.
i3
Pros:
Fast in a straight line
Looks quite nice
Cons:
Range is poor even with rex
Tiny boot, had to fold a seat to get a small pushchair in
Only 4 seats
Rear doors are useless if you are parked next to something
Over complex i drive
Made me and everybody else who went in it feel a bit ill, the salesman told me that this is common
Expensive
Leaf
Pros:
Spacious
Fast around town
Cons:
Very ugly inside and out
I found the seat very uncomfortable
Terrible touch screen
Limited range
Handling
Zoe
Pros:
Range, I am getting around 140 miles even at sub zero temperatures
looks quite good
5 seats
decent boot
Handles ok
Cheap
Fast around town
Cons:
Build quality is poor, no rattles but it all feels quite cheap.
Ride quality is bad over big bumps, it hates speed bumps.
Lack of safety kit, why no curtain airbags?
A bit slow above 60mph.
For me the Zoe won but I understand that not everybody will agree.
Pooh said:
I test drove the Leaf, i3 and Zoe and ended up buying a Zoe for the following reasons.
i3
Pros:
Fast in a straight line
Looks quite nice
Cons:
Range is poor even with rex
Tiny boot, had to fold a seat to get a small pushchair in
Only 4 seats
Rear doors are useless if you are parked next to something
Over complex i drive
Made me and everybody else who went in it feel a bit ill, the salesman told me that this is common
Expensive
Leaf
Pros:
Spacious
Fast around town
Cons:
Very ugly inside and out
I found the seat very uncomfortable
Terrible touch screen
Limited range
Handling
Zoe
Pros:
Range, I am getting around 140 miles even at sub zero temperatures
looks quite good
5 seats
decent boot
Handles ok
Cheap
Fast around town
Cons:
Build quality is poor, no rattles but it all feels quite cheap.
Ride quality is bad over big bumps, it hates speed bumps.
Lack of safety kit, why no curtain airbags?
A bit slow above 60mph.
For me the Zoe won but I understand that not everybody will agree.
Haven’t driven the Leaf yet but that’s a good summary of the other two. The i3 and the Zoe both hate bumps in the road i3
Pros:
Fast in a straight line
Looks quite nice
Cons:
Range is poor even with rex
Tiny boot, had to fold a seat to get a small pushchair in
Only 4 seats
Rear doors are useless if you are parked next to something
Over complex i drive
Made me and everybody else who went in it feel a bit ill, the salesman told me that this is common
Expensive
Leaf
Pros:
Spacious
Fast around town
Cons:
Very ugly inside and out
I found the seat very uncomfortable
Terrible touch screen
Limited range
Handling
Zoe
Pros:
Range, I am getting around 140 miles even at sub zero temperatures
looks quite good
5 seats
decent boot
Handles ok
Cheap
Fast around town
Cons:
Build quality is poor, no rattles but it all feels quite cheap.
Ride quality is bad over big bumps, it hates speed bumps.
Lack of safety kit, why no curtain airbags?
A bit slow above 60mph.
For me the Zoe won but I understand that not everybody will agree.
I currently drive a 1.5 DCI Megane, road tax is £30 a year and on my 100 mile M25 commute it can easily do 65MPG (72MPG being my best).
I recently watched a video of a ZOE 40 being driven around the M25 and it did it (117 Miles) with I think 18 miles spare.
Put it this way, if my Megane said it had a range remaining of 135 Miles I would not do the trip.
So a 40KW renault is going to cost 40 * £0.13 to fully charge which is £5.20 for 135 miles
To do 135 miles in my diesel will cost roughly £11.10 or just over twice as much. Add in the cost of renting the battery (£99 a month for the ZE40 and 10,500 miles a year) and I suspect it is no cheaper to run.
I recently watched a video of a ZOE 40 being driven around the M25 and it did it (117 Miles) with I think 18 miles spare.
Put it this way, if my Megane said it had a range remaining of 135 Miles I would not do the trip.
So a 40KW renault is going to cost 40 * £0.13 to fully charge which is £5.20 for 135 miles
To do 135 miles in my diesel will cost roughly £11.10 or just over twice as much. Add in the cost of renting the battery (£99 a month for the ZE40 and 10,500 miles a year) and I suspect it is no cheaper to run.
I get charging data in an excel report each month. 900 miles in January has cost about £23. So, maybe 200-250 miles in a good diesel ?? In winter, my wife has every electric device going. Eg heated seat, steering wheel plus, obviously Heater. So kWh use is up for the month. I know in better weather it’s down to £16/17, a month.
Not arguing with yr Zoe video, but my experience of a leaf is different. As for cost of battery lease, every car deal is different. Not sure that many people Are leasing batteries now anyway. Who knows what the purchase price of anyone’s chosen car, or its running costs really are. A lot of ev drivers also pick up free charging, which seems to be available as of course it’s an enticement into the experience.
Not arguing with yr Zoe video, but my experience of a leaf is different. As for cost of battery lease, every car deal is different. Not sure that many people Are leasing batteries now anyway. Who knows what the purchase price of anyone’s chosen car, or its running costs really are. A lot of ev drivers also pick up free charging, which seems to be available as of course it’s an enticement into the experience.
Joey Deacon said:
I and on my 100 mile M25 commute it can easily do 65MPG (72MPG being my best).
really? "easily" ?What happens when you get stuck in traffic (which on the M25 is everyday surely) if you really average a genuine 65 mpg all year round then i salute you (and hope to never get stuck behind you ..........)
RobDickinson said:
Too Drunk to Funk said:
The trouble is everyone wants an SUV these days. Aside from the stupidly expensive and ugly Model X, where are the EV SUVs?
Coming. Soon. Jaguar, Volvo , Kia and Hyundai all launching ev suv this year, vw etc 2020
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftVNa7R-nMw&fe...
There's plug-in hybrid versions right now of:
Audi Q7
Range Rover
Range Rover Sport
Porsche Cayenne (between models - outgoing one, coming v soon on new one)
Mitsubishi Outlander
BMW X5
Mercedes GLC (oddly, not offered in the UK yet, but is elsewhere)
Mercedes GLE
Volvo XC60
Volvo XC90
Kia Niro
I think pretty much all of them will within a few years, and future platforms are being planned around supporting full EV as well as PHEV or plain old ICE engines.
Audi Q7
Range Rover
Range Rover Sport
Porsche Cayenne (between models - outgoing one, coming v soon on new one)
Mitsubishi Outlander
BMW X5
Mercedes GLC (oddly, not offered in the UK yet, but is elsewhere)
Mercedes GLE
Volvo XC60
Volvo XC90
Kia Niro
I think pretty much all of them will within a few years, and future platforms are being planned around supporting full EV as well as PHEV or plain old ICE engines.
Pvapour said:
RobDickinson said:
Too Drunk to Funk said:
The trouble is everyone wants an SUV these days. Aside from the stupidly expensive and ugly Model X, where are the EV SUVs?
Coming. Soon. Jaguar, Volvo , Kia and Hyundai all launching ev suv this year, vw etc 2020
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftVNa7R-nMw&fe...
I found myself in Cribbs Causeway just outside Bristol earlier this week with half an hour to kill, and popped into the Tesla showroom there to have a nose. I was pleasantly surprised, to be honest.
They had a Model X and a Model S which were open to look around.
I will reserve comment on driving until I've tried one, but as things , the Teslas are fabulous, in my opinion. I don't see how anyone who likes technology could fail to be impressed by the gadgetry on display. There's a light hearted side to these things that really appeals. I also found the interiors to be nicely trimmed and finished, and even the Model X, which is a big old lump when you stand next to it, looks clean and elegant.
It was good to be able to ask some questions of someone knowledgeable and dispel some preconceived ideas I had about EVs. Some things I learned:
1) It isn't possible for someone else (another EV driver or bored 'yoof') to unplug your car while charging.
2) To recharge a 100kW/h model from flat would cost you somewhere around a tenner in electricity, and get you somewhere around 350 real world miles.
3) If you charge it overnight (like your phone), the vast majority of roadside recharging would be 'top ups' rather than complete recharges. Still not IC quick, but not hours either.
4) To encourage maximum throughput on the free Tesla chargers, you are charged if you leave the car connected after recharging is complete.
5) You get an 8 year, unlimited mileage 'drive unit' warranty that includes the batteries.
6) Servicing is not required, just 'recommended'. Because of the regenerative braking, brake friction material lasts a long time. There is of course no engine oil, coolant or fuel system that needs filters or fluids changing. combined with a ten quid for 300 mile recharge, it won't be an expensive car to run, even if it is eye-wateringly expensive to buy.
7) There is still no confirmed UK pricing, spec or delivery dates for the Model 3.
The price is the blocker for me. I simply cannot afford to spend £100k+ on a car, and probably never will be able to, but if the Model 3 has the gadgetry and a sensible range for £30-something grand, I would be seriously interested.
They had a Model X and a Model S which were open to look around.
I will reserve comment on driving until I've tried one, but as things , the Teslas are fabulous, in my opinion. I don't see how anyone who likes technology could fail to be impressed by the gadgetry on display. There's a light hearted side to these things that really appeals. I also found the interiors to be nicely trimmed and finished, and even the Model X, which is a big old lump when you stand next to it, looks clean and elegant.
It was good to be able to ask some questions of someone knowledgeable and dispel some preconceived ideas I had about EVs. Some things I learned:
1) It isn't possible for someone else (another EV driver or bored 'yoof') to unplug your car while charging.
2) To recharge a 100kW/h model from flat would cost you somewhere around a tenner in electricity, and get you somewhere around 350 real world miles.
3) If you charge it overnight (like your phone), the vast majority of roadside recharging would be 'top ups' rather than complete recharges. Still not IC quick, but not hours either.
4) To encourage maximum throughput on the free Tesla chargers, you are charged if you leave the car connected after recharging is complete.
5) You get an 8 year, unlimited mileage 'drive unit' warranty that includes the batteries.
6) Servicing is not required, just 'recommended'. Because of the regenerative braking, brake friction material lasts a long time. There is of course no engine oil, coolant or fuel system that needs filters or fluids changing. combined with a ten quid for 300 mile recharge, it won't be an expensive car to run, even if it is eye-wateringly expensive to buy.
7) There is still no confirmed UK pricing, spec or delivery dates for the Model 3.
The price is the blocker for me. I simply cannot afford to spend £100k+ on a car, and probably never will be able to, but if the Model 3 has the gadgetry and a sensible range for £30-something grand, I would be seriously interested.
Edited by Limpet on Friday 23 February 12:39
Joey Deacon said:
So a 40KW renault is going to cost 40 * £0.13 to fully charge which is £5.20 for 135 miles
To do 135 miles in my diesel will cost roughly £11.10 or just over twice as much. Add in the cost of renting the battery (£99 a month for the ZE40 and 10,500 miles a year) and I suspect it is no cheaper to run.
You're probably right. To do 135 miles in my diesel will cost roughly £11.10 or just over twice as much. Add in the cost of renting the battery (£99 a month for the ZE40 and 10,500 miles a year) and I suspect it is no cheaper to run.
We've just switched to a company that uses a smart-meter to provide "time-of-day" usage, a bit like economy 7, but it can have multiple rates. At night it is 4.9p, which is £2.00 for a full charge
In summer that is 1.1p per mile
In winter that is 1.5p per mile
Battery Rental is £110 for Unlimited mileage, we are currently doing 1600 per month in that car which is 6.8p per mile for battery rental
Therefore it costs 7.9p per mile in summer and 8.3 per mile in winter. Yours, based on £11.20 and 135 miles is 8.3p per mile
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