RE: Honda NSX: Spotted
Discussion
LasseV said:
V8 FOU said:
A bit bland to drive. Very good handling, but not that fast. I really wanted to love them, but just found them un-engaging. I've driven 2 or 3 but they just don't feel that special.
First time ever i seen someone saying that nsx is un-engaging...- It depends on what model he drove. An EPAS model has steering which at low speeds and low inputs feels pretty lifeless. Assistance bleeds-off at speed so you get a very natural* 'weight' when you need it, but very little of the 'patter' through the wheel which certain other (Norfolk-based) mfrs excel in. A non-assisted model has more detailed steering feel but you DO need some muscle at low speeds.
- It depends how he drove it. Week before last I used mine all week for the commute, and it was arguably even easier to drive than my daily driver (FD2 Civic Type R). On two evenings though I took the back-roads home, which livened things up significantly.
- It depends what his expectations were. If you judge the car by a very 1990s Italian yardstick, then you will come away underwhelmed...there's no effort required on your part to drive it, no compromises required. But that (very much like the GT-R) doesn't mean it's not engaging nor that the car does it all for you. It just means the car takes away all the unnecessary frippery from driving - what the Italians would probably term theatre and TVR or Lotus would term 'character'. And leaves you clear to deal with the road, NOT the car.
...and surely that last sentence DEFINES 'supercar'?!?
* unlike all these modern artificial "sport" modes.
Whilst I haven't driven one, anecdotally the NSX is the perfect sports car for me. Exciting to drive with a unique V6 screamer powerplant, sublime handling and plenty of feedback. Enough power to be usable and exciting for road driving without so much that you need to get into license-losing territory just to feel it come alive. I think they look fantastic too and love the interiors. I am in the process of collecting some of the 90s JDM classics and the NSX is top of my list, though might take a bit more saving given how prices have gone.
In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
hondansx said:
I have a few - you may guess from the username I'm a bit of a fan.
Here's the latest
This is the original one (pop up, but a later one with the 3.2 6 Speed)
Don't have any recent pictures of the race car on this computer, but below is one that gives an example of just how low they are as you can see compared to a 993 GT2.
It's something you don't appreciate unless in the flesh - it's lower than a Lotus Elise. It can also be made light - 1000kg is not out of reach and that's with a cage in. The difficult is getting parts; development costs are huge, unlike a Porsche which you can pluck bits off a shelf.
I think last year EVO recently rated the NSX above a Cayman GT4 for overall experience. Even I was surprised by that, but I certainly of course think they are great cars. I have had GT3s etc. and always come back to the NSX. Driving one today is a wonderful analogue experience (ironic given the ridiculous story that seems to have stuck that they are lacking character). It's also a very personal experience - to hear it you need to close the windows and enjoy the induction noise. Unlike modern cars with their exhaust flaps and sound generators, you have to dial yourself in. I find it tremendously rewarding to drive.
Love this. Here's the latest
This is the original one (pop up, but a later one with the 3.2 6 Speed)
Don't have any recent pictures of the race car on this computer, but below is one that gives an example of just how low they are as you can see compared to a 993 GT2.
It's something you don't appreciate unless in the flesh - it's lower than a Lotus Elise. It can also be made light - 1000kg is not out of reach and that's with a cage in. The difficult is getting parts; development costs are huge, unlike a Porsche which you can pluck bits off a shelf.
I think last year EVO recently rated the NSX above a Cayman GT4 for overall experience. Even I was surprised by that, but I certainly of course think they are great cars. I have had GT3s etc. and always come back to the NSX. Driving one today is a wonderful analogue experience (ironic given the ridiculous story that seems to have stuck that they are lacking character). It's also a very personal experience - to hear it you need to close the windows and enjoy the induction noise. Unlike modern cars with their exhaust flaps and sound generators, you have to dial yourself in. I find it tremendously rewarding to drive.
Edited by hondansx on Monday 30th April 12:50
I don't suppose you will be bringing any of them to Japfest at Silverstone this coming weekend will you?
James Junior said:
Whilst I haven't driven one, anecdotally the NSX is the perfect sports car for me. Exciting to drive with a unique V6 screamer powerplant, sublime handling and plenty of feedback. Enough power to be usable and exciting for road driving without so much that you need to get into license-losing territory just to feel it come alive. I think they look fantastic too and love the interiors. I am in the process of collecting some of the 90s JDM classics and the NSX is top of my list, though might take a bit more saving given how prices have gone.
In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
This is exactly the reason why i bought a n/a Supra. Mine was mildly tuned and it is now gettin more aggressive camshafts, invidual throttle bodies and new ecu. Aim is that engine feels more free flowing and more special. I was surprised how friggingly fast 400hp-ish Turbo Supra is, you just cant use that kind of performance anymore... It has so much torque that it will accelerate rapidly in every situation, so you can't use higher rev band that often.In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
TonyF55 said:
As someone mentioned, when standing next to one they do look quite special. In 1990 as a kid they never really appealed as you would have a Ferrari all day everyday, but as I'm now a lot older, I would quite appreciate the precise panel gaps, great reliability and usability that the rival F348 could not match.
Am I correct in thinking, that only the early automatics had PAS, the manual had no assistance until the revised models much later?
Correct!Am I correct in thinking, that only the early automatics had PAS, the manual had no assistance until the revised models much later?
3.2s came with EPAS too.
James Junior said:
Whilst I haven't driven one, anecdotally the NSX is the perfect sports car for me. Exciting to drive with a unique V6 screamer powerplant, sublime handling and plenty of feedback. Enough power to be usable and exciting for road driving without so much that you need to get into license-losing territory just to feel it come alive. I think they look fantastic too and love the interiors. I am in the process of collecting some of the 90s JDM classics and the NSX is top of my list, though might take a bit more saving given how prices have gone.
In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
You might never have driven one, but you've got that about right!In the meantime I recently picked up one of it's contemporaries; a Supra TT 6spd. I drove it on some good back roads for the first time yesterday and whilst I really like it, I have to wonder where I am going to be able to use it's performance anywhere other than the track. Even in only a mild state of tune it is putting out around 400bhp and there was rarely enough road to use much more than a little squirt here and there.
I suspect an NSX would be better suited to enjoying on the public road.
They feel 'alive' at even traffic speeds, in a way that some other cars don't unless you're really thrashing them.
Hardly anyone mentions the excellent ride quality; it's more a luxury GT car, than a pugnacious 'supercar'. The unusual 'walking' front suspension takes a lot of the shock out of road tits and such.
LasseV said:
This is exactly the reason why i bought a n/a Supra. Mine was mildly tuned and it is now gettin more aggressive camshafts, invidual throttle bodies and new ecu. Aim is that engine feels more free flowing and more special. I was surprised how friggingly fast 400hp-ish Turbo Supra is, you just cant use that kind of performance anymore... It has so much torque that it will accelerate rapidly in every situation, so you can't use higher rev band that often.
It's a real sledge hammer of a car and as you say, torque is everywhere. Agree completely about the higher part of the rev range - I could hardly find enough room to use much of the second turbo last night. Most of the drive was spent on a partial throttle surfing the mid range and short shifting. Hope you are enjoying yours. Black S2K said:
You might never have driven one, but you've got that about right!
They feel 'alive' at even traffic speeds, in a way that some other cars don't unless you're really thrashing them.
Hardly anyone mentions the excellent ride quality; it's more a luxury GT car, than a pugnacious 'supercar'. The unusual 'walking' front suspension takes a lot of the shock out of road tits and such.
Correct. the ride is excellent. I'm used to wincing as I go over pot holes, so always smile to myself when I find they are shrugged off when I've already done a instinctive wince and buttock clench! I'd argue this isn't necessarily an NSX 'thing'; just a reminder that we're all now in cars with huge wheels and precious little tyre.They feel 'alive' at even traffic speeds, in a way that some other cars don't unless you're really thrashing them.
Hardly anyone mentions the excellent ride quality; it's more a luxury GT car, than a pugnacious 'supercar'. The unusual 'walking' front suspension takes a lot of the shock out of road tits and such.
Despite the relatively low power output, it's nicely geared. I jumped out of my Performante into the NSX and it doesn't feel slow by any means; you just have to use all of the revs which is hardly a chore.
The thing that takes getting used is the slow steering. Fine for track, as it's safer when correcting oversteer (mid-engined, after all). And indeed, there are various things you only really appreciate with miles.
The 'is it a supercar' argument has gone on forever. I don't care what people think, but for me it looks more exotic than a 911 due to its proportions. As I said early, just how low it is being a big factor.
Sadly won't be there for Japfest - I'm racing a Mustang at Donington. Fun event though, did some passenger rides a few years back (at Combe) and enjoyed putting smiles on faces.
Dave Hedgehog said:
Great looking and iconic car, but drives far to much like a civic for my liking
55k gets a decent R8 which is a vastly better steer / sounding mid engined car
I think you may be gilding the lily somewhat with 'vastly':-55k gets a decent R8 which is a vastly better steer / sounding mid engined car
https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/features/1991-...
That said, a V10 R8, IF you can stomach the running costs*, does make a rather compelling alternative to a 3.0 NSX...the V8 a little less-so as the real-world performance isn't that much quicker.
* Which are going to be probably close to an order of magnitude greater than the NSX, don't forget...
Forgetting prices for a moment (even though values are similar), i think if anyone on the planet stepped from a similar age Ferrari or Porsche and into the Honda, they would be gobsmacked at how much better it is in almost every measurable way. Does being 'measurably' better mean it has less soul? Maybe, but I still catch myself making childish noises everytime I use all of the revs. NSX owners choose with their heads but still enjoy a thrill.
Dave Hedgehog said:
Great looking and iconic car, but drives far to much like a civic for my liking
what the hell kind of civics have you been driving? :SI really fail to understand people who say the nsx is un-engaging to drive. Ignoring everything else, I couldn't see how a car would be more engaging without cutting the floor out and pedalling, Flintstones style.
The looks somewhat interested me many years ago, however the lack of outright grunt was a distinct disappointment. And even that was years ago.
Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
big_rob_sydney said:
The looks somewhat interested me many years ago, however the lack of outright grunt was a distinct disappointment. And even that was years ago.
Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
The door's over there, by the way...Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
More seriously, since when did outright pace determine how 'good' a car was? The original Elan is widely lauded as one of the best if not THE best handling car ever (and they're more expensive than NSXs are), yet that'd be outpaced by a Suzuki Swift Sport. So I'm not sure I'm getting your point...
havoc said:
big_rob_sydney said:
The looks somewhat interested me many years ago, however the lack of outright grunt was a distinct disappointment. And even that was years ago.
Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
The door's over there, by the way...Fast forward to today, and there are loads of faster cars for much less money on the second hand market.
I think I'm more interested in a high end washing machine.
More seriously, since when did outright pace determine how 'good' a car was? The original Elan is widely lauded as one of the best if not THE best handling car ever (and they're more expensive than NSXs are), yet that'd be outpaced by a Suzuki Swift Sport. So I'm not sure I'm getting your point...
And today its a slug.
big_rob_sydney said:
More simply then; I'm disappointed because it seems like a case of more show than go.
It's less than 7% behind the Ferrari 348 on power/weight - would you say the same about the Italian car? And the Honda is 11% ahead of the contemporary 911 Carrera 2. In 1990 when it launched, the NSX was entirely competitive with its European rivals in a straight line.Fascinating thread!
A mate of mine had one for a year or so about 15 years ago and loved it - he did a few track days with his without any issues. And sold it when they weren't worth much.
But I just couldn't get over it's looks - you could nearly land a helicopter on the engine cover! And that did seem a lot of space for a V6 of less than 3 litres!
I'd much rather have had a Supra Turbo!
A mate of mine had one for a year or so about 15 years ago and loved it - he did a few track days with his without any issues. And sold it when they weren't worth much.
But I just couldn't get over it's looks - you could nearly land a helicopter on the engine cover! And that did seem a lot of space for a V6 of less than 3 litres!
I'd much rather have had a Supra Turbo!
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