Is this classed as Undertaking?

[Collaudatore]

Oh yeah motorways are just two one way roads running in the opposite direction

Let's solve this one

[jimmy156]

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

[saaby93]

curlie467 said:

roadsmash said:

I’m so sorry but the stupidity of this one way street debate has compelled me to double post.

How on Earth you can suggest the rules and laws of a one way street are comparable to the rules and laws of a motorway defeats me. What are you smoking?

Smoking the same st as the people driving on motorways staring at the front wheels of other vehicles

Someone'll be along next to say a nornal road is like two one way streets in opposite directions next to each other

Back to thread topic is there another name for undertakers?

[Collaudatore]

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Travelling down a motorway I'd not be looking at someone else's wheels. At a roundabout...Maybe, that coupled with where the driver is looking and the positioning of the car on relation to exits.

[Collaudatore]

saaby93 said:

a nornal road is like two one way streets in opposite directions next to each other

Glad you're catching on

[Pica-Pica]

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Really? Try a few more years of driving.

[jimmy156]

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Really? Try a few more years of driving.

Why? So by then my eyesight will be as bad as yours and i will think i can see the 1/32 turn of lock required to change lane, whilst driving at 70mph down a dual carriageway?

[Pica-Pica]

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Really? Try a few more years of driving.

Why? So by then my eyesight will be as bad as yours and i will think i can see the 1/32 turn of lock required to change lane, whilst driving at 70mph down a dual carriageway?

Ha! You are not looking for turn, but a reduced wheel arch to tyre gap at front of tyre, pretty easy.

[curlie467]

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Really? Try a few more years of driving.

Why? So by then my eyesight will be as bad as yours and i will think i can see the 1/32 turn of lock required to change lane, whilst driving at 70mph down a dual carriageway?

Ha! You are not looking for turn, but a reduced wheel arch to tyre gap at front of tyre, pretty easy.

have a word with yourself, you honestly drive along looking at the front wheels of cars?
fking dead safe
More PH holier than thou ste

[pingu393]

curlie467 said:

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

jimmy156 said:

Pica-Pica said:

curlie467 said:

pingu393 said:

I always watch the front wheels of any car that I undertake. I am ready to react if the wheels start to steer towards me. I do this during overtakes as well, but I am particularly aware when undertaking as the MLM is just that, a Middle Lane Moron and they might do anything.

wtf?
bks.

No, watching the front wheels is extremely valid, and additionally so at roundabouts where indicating is a lost art.
(Let’s assume front wheel steer only, to avoid any wise-guys)

Yes but unless the MLM in question has just put a whole turn of lock on (in which case you and he are probably fked anyway) there is now way you can perceive the wheels actually turning towards your lane

Really? Try a few more years of driving.

Why? So by then my eyesight will be as bad as yours and i will think i can see the 1/32 turn of lock required to change lane, whilst driving at 70mph down a dual carriageway?

Ha! You are not looking for turn, but a reduced wheel arch to tyre gap at front of tyre, pretty easy.

have a word with yourself, you honestly drive along looking at the front wheels of cars?
fking dead safe
More PH holier than thou ste

If the gap between the other car and the white line is narrowing, the wheels have turned towards me. Is that easier to understand?

[jimmy156]

pingu393 said:

If the gap between the other car and the white line is narrowing, the wheels have turned towards me. Is that easier to understand?

Yeah! So you watch the car, not the wheels! Thats makes a lot more sense

[curlie467]

pingu393 said:

If the gap between the other car and the white line is narrowing, the wheels have turned towards me. Is that easier to understand?

You really are a PH patronising aren't you
Plus you've gone from watching the wheels to looking at the car which is surprisingly enough what everyone else does

Edited by curlie467 on Saturday 18th August 09:15

[Peter911]

saaby93 said:

Someone'll be along next to say a nornal road is like two one way streets in opposite directions next to each other

Back to thread topic is there another name for undertakers?

,
Funeral directors?

[Tomo1971]

Someone made a comment on here after attending a driver or speed awareness course, that 75% of the other attendees on the course believed that L1 on a motorway was ONLY for HGV's and caravans and they must move out of it as soon as possible.

Its no wonder that opportunities for undertaking are there.

I frequently travel a short section of the M1 (15 miles from Luton North) where there are several sections of managed motorway/hard shoulder running - L1 (the shoulder) just becomes a private lane with hardly any traffic in it - ironically something that L3 or L4 should be if motorways were used correctly.

Its no wonder that many people do use Lane 1 to under take especially when the other lanes are so bumper to bumper and the concertina effect happening every few hundred yards.

[nonsequitur]

pingu393 said:

vonhosen said:

pingu393 said:

I read on another thread a post from a BiB. He said that an overtake starts with a lane change.

An undertake isn't explained, but the start of the explanation could be reasonably be assumed to be the same as an overtake.

That's

Look at rule 268 I've copied above & look at the 'OR' in the first sentence.

Rule 268
Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. - Pretty clear, until I read the caveats...

In congested conditions, - define "congested"
where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds - define "similar",
traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. - so I can "undertake"
Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake. - the "undertaker" in this example hasn't changed lanes.


I'm glad that this is so clear.

If you have to query the caveats in a HC ruling, which would be patently obvious to all on PH, well I'm speec

[nonsequitur]

7heGeneral said:

Unfortunately it is undertaking. I was doing as you describe with a marked police car behind me thinking i was doing no wrong. It was a 50 mph limit (A road) and I'd stayed on the limit, completely oblivious that they were counting how many cars I'd been undertaking. They had me pull over shortly after I'd moved in to the middle lane (the inside lane was soon going to turn off the main carriageway).

I got lucky that the officers understood that I'd "misunderstood" the rule about staying in the inside lane if it was free so let me off with a warning. Essentially if you are in the inside lane, you are not supposed to pass vehicles in the outside lane(s) unless the other lanes are stationary / coming to a halt.

Or travelling at a similar speed to those in lane 1

[nonsequitur]

Reffro said:

MalcolmSmith said:

I was under the impression that you had to indicate to return to the left if on a motorway, dual carriageway or other one way system?

Nope. As you are only in lane 2,3 or 4 to complete an overtake, you are expected to return to the left lanes to continue normal driving. Indicating is required when you are doing something unexpected to alert other road users to this.

Yes, you are expected to return to lane 1 after OT, but so many don't, so a quick indication is a confirmation that you are actually moving back. How difficult is it to indicate? Not at all.

[MalcolmSmith]

I was joining (in a queue) the other night from an ‘on and off’ lane when a bell end in a Corsa on the motorway we are trying to join to my right crossed the solid double lines before the start of the merge point to go through the gap behind me and proceeded to drive up the hard shoulder for 10 car lengths, in heavy rain, with no lights on at rush hour.

If you get away with that I wouldn’t worry about the odd undertake of a lane 2 hogging tt, as the gentleman above had also chosen not to indicate. Obviously in a rush to return his mums car.

[robinessex]

Collaudatore said:

saaby93 said:

a nornal road is like two one way streets in opposite directions next to each other

Glad you're catching on

Er, no he didn't. Try driving PERMANTELY in the R.H. side of a normal street!

[saaby93]

nonsequitur said:

es, you are expected to return to lane 1 after OT, but so many don't, so a quick indication is a confirmation that you are actually moving back. How difficult is it to indicate? Not at all.

It didnt used to be that way
There used to be a slow lane for slow traffic, a faster lane for faster traffic , and an overtaking lane
So if you were 'fast traffic' you could stay in that lane without joining the slow lane
But what is slow?
If no-one else is about you are the slow traffic ( or are you the fast traffic)
Is that a more useful discussion than a motorway is a one way street