What car has the best ever build quality?

What car has the best ever build quality?

Author
Discussion

BGarside

1,564 posts

136 months

Thursday 8th November 2018
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Merc W123 Shirley?

dimots

3,012 posts

89 months

Thursday 8th November 2018
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BGarside said:
Merc W123 Shirley?
I’ve owned a w114, w123 and w124 as well as more modern Mercs. W124 is pick of the bunch but only pre-facelift with chrome grille!

belleair302

6,835 posts

206 months

Thursday 8th November 2018
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Peugeot 504's must be in with a shout when you travel across the world and see these running in the most barren locations. Certain Nissans and Toyotas too. Lexus LS 400, German Taxi's with 600,000 km on the clock. BMW E39 is in with a shout as mentioned and clearly Land Rovers pre JLR days.

Chestrockwell

2,624 posts

156 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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Julian Thompson said:
So yesterday, I was asked by my trader pal to ferry him to a garage in a 110k mike e39 diesel. The car owes him about £1000.

I sat in it, remembered how compact cars used to feel and drove off.

Four miles later, my jaw was sat on my knees and I was literally laughing to myself. The car felt like it was carved out of a solid block of “vehicle” - when I hit a bump, nothing moved. The steering, although weighty, was perfectly precise and alive. Every control, although primitive compared to modern designs, had the feel of an installation just completed and happy to go on indefinite duty.

I got into my 2k mile 2017 m4 tonight. I love the M4 but by comparison the steering felt less impressive, and the build quality not even in the same game - never mind ball park. Every hard bump yields a slightly plastic edged sound as things that might be giving evidence of costing less and might be less well installed move together. They’re not rattles, but they are signals that the old car was, for sure, a better made machine.

I don’t know what that makes me feel about the M4 but it does raise the question - what car is the all time build quality king?

(Bonus points can be awarded for experience on the spanners where cars are intelligently constructed making working on them a pleasure - or where the manufacturer of the mainstream vehicle has gone out of its way to overspecify mechanical things that you might have noticed. Doesn’t have to be just interior construction quality)
I have a 4 series and my brother has a E39 523i manual run around and I echo your thoughts.

Steering is weighty, almost tiring when doing a 3 point turn, the clutch is heavy but there’s something satisfying about it. I think the exact same thing as you every time I drive it, I literally give my brother the keys smiling, never fails to impress. If petrol was cheap, I would honestly give up my 4 series and find a clean 540i M sport in black, pay whatever it is, 10 grand if I have to and use it forever, nothing like them. E46’s are just as good but the 30i’s don’t cut it for me anymore in terms of power.

alabbasi

2,469 posts

86 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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I don't know what anyone sees in the pre-GM Saabs (or the post GM ones for that matter). I bought a 92 900S convertible when I first moved to the US in 2001. It was the only car where the prices compared to Europe so I felt like i knew how to negotiate it. I drove that POS for 3 years and tried so hard to like it. I'd owned an E30 BMW when I lived in UK and compared to the E30, the 900S was not impressive. The fit and finish was not great. There was lots of cheaper plastic and every one of them had an electric seat cable that was broken and had warped the seat back.

The turbo cars had redeeming qualities but the non turbo cars were really slow. Like Mercedes diesel slow. It also broke down every 10 mins. I tried so hard to be a Saab enthusiast but as soon as I bought my 97 Mercedes Benz E420, I was done with it. I think that their reputation is much better than their reality.

BMW's are well built cars but nothing compared to Mercedes Benz. 80's MB's like the W126 were really over built and made from great materials. I thought that they were the best built cars until the beginning of the year. Then I bought a Rolls Royce / Bentley product and my world view changed again.

As far as I'm concerned, there's nothing on this planet that's built like a Rolls Royce or Bentley from the pre merger era.

sparta6

3,689 posts

99 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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Pre-90 Merc, including G Wagon, and Porsche 928.
Another level of engineering.

Roger Irrelevant

2,898 posts

112 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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hp7 said:
ITP said:
LS400 or RX400h
This
I thought the LS400 was the generally recognised answer to this question - it was when Toyota (who generally don't turn out shoddy motors), let their engineers and quality control bods get really obsessive. For example the 1UZ-FE engine is one of the few used in cars to also be approved for use in light aircraft by the US Federal Aviation Authority.

Thinking about it a Toyota Century is probably even better, can't let the emperor of Japan be bothered by rattling trim!

coppice

8,561 posts

143 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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From what I have read the Rolls Royce Silver Ghost - made pre and post WW1 - was near indestructible. I hear its climate control and ABS was a bit iffy though.

Jimmy Recard

17,540 posts

178 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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belleair302 said:
Peugeot 504's must be in with a shout when you travel across the world and see these running in the most barren locations. Certain Nissans and Toyotas too. Lexus LS 400, German Taxi's with 600,000 km on the clock. BMW E39 is in with a shout as mentioned and clearly Land Rovers pre JLR days.
Land Rover!?

p4cks

6,885 posts

198 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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K11 Micra?

lowdrag

12,868 posts

212 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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Judging by what certain members of the community have bought and run for starship mileages, the original Lexus 400(?) was hewn from rock. And in the USA the Toyota Camry (which they stopped selling here about 1990 from memory because it was too pricey) should get a mention. Personally, my W124 Mercedes was solid and reliable if a bit boring, but it felt like a tank.

POORCARDEALER

8,523 posts

240 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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W126 Mercedes hands down

Thankyou4calling

10,595 posts

172 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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A new car bought now from Audi, BMW, Merc will be built to a far higher standard than an 80’s car surely.

Better materials, rust proofing, closer shutlines, less rattles and niggles.

This leads to cars being way more reliable than previously.

Many look back with rose tinted specs but any decent journey even in a high end car used to involve a gamble as to whether you’d arrive.





Edited by Thankyou4calling on Friday 9th November 08:24

lowdrag

12,868 posts

212 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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Thankyou4calling said:
A new car bought now from Audi, BMW, Merc will be built to a far higher standard than an 80’s car surely.

Better materials, rust proofing, closer shut lines, less rattles and niggles.

This leads to cars being way more reliable than previously.

Many look back with rose tinted specs but any decent journey even in a high end car used to involve a gamble as to whether you’d arrive.
I should be in agreement but am not convinced. Safety ratings yes, but if you have a car that "fails to proceed" that is hardly relative. The Mercedes service chief told me that todays cars are built down to a price and not up to a quality, and this was certainly proved by their models of the start of this century. I look at various forums and so many seem to have complaints about reliability and niggles. And Jaguar seem worse than most, but that could be me not researching enough.


otolith

55,899 posts

203 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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I suspect that this is mostly about perceived rather than actual build quality. I wonder how much the tendency to fit "sporty" suspension and rubber band tyres has been shaking the interiors of modern cars to bits.

aeropilot

34,289 posts

226 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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I'd say best ever build quality would be a toss-up between pre-WW2 Rolls-Royce, Mercedes and of course Duesenberg. Maybe pre-WW2 Bugatti as well?

Post WW2, maybe the Merc 600's....?



Ynox

1,702 posts

178 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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kapiteinlangzaam said:
I had a 96 W140 S Class. One that is usually held up as the pinnacle of everything.

Interior was lovely, ride was great etc, it definitely was a quality car.... However they are not without fault, far from it. Mine died of likely HG failure at only 150k miles, the gearbox was stting itself too.
I was going to say a W140, maybe not...! My uncle had an S600 in the late 90s. It was an awesome car. I still find myself looking at them every so often - I'd love a nice S500 (probably go for the V8 over the V12), but then my sensible side comes out and I decide against it frown

Dusty964

6,919 posts

189 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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For me the 964 is the best made car I've owned, no creaks, rattles and felt utterly solid despite its years.

Harji

2,196 posts

160 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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Sebring440 said:
Harji said:
these were designed by engineers.
Most cars, are, I think you'll find.
You know very well what I mean.

The Surveyor

7,576 posts

236 months

Friday 9th November 2018
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richs2891 said:
Modern cars do seem to be built down to a price these days, some pre 2000 cars do have better build quality.
Eg W124 Mercedes, W201 Mercedes, Toyota Landcruiser 80 series
Modern cars are also built down to a weight too. The need for better fuel efficiency and the addition of heavy safety features means materials need to be lighter and more flimsy. The OP's M4 wouldn't be anywhere near as quick and exciting if it was built like a tank.