RE: Shed of the Week: Audi TT Roadster
Discussion
What utter tosh regarding clutches and coil packs.
I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
JMF894 said:
What utter tosh regarding clutches and coil packs.
I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
So, based on a sample size of one, with a different car with a less powerful engine variant you determine that a lot of the last 20 years conceived wisdom and experience is is "Tosh" ?I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
J4CKO said:
JMF894 said:
What utter tosh regarding clutches and coil packs.
I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
So, based on a sample size of one, with a different car with a less powerful engine variant you determine that a lot of the last 20 years conceived wisdom and experience is is "Tosh" ?I did 126k in my vRS with this engine and a revo remap. Never needed a single coil pack, a clutch, or even an exhaust. I wasn't shy with it either. I'll agree with the comment on front arb bushes mind. Plastic collars on the arb crack, the arb rusts and the bushes dry out and squeak.
kambites said:
daytona111r said:
Still shocks me that Audi could release a car like the TT as recently as 1999 with such lethal handling!
It actually handled rather well, in a way that was the problem - a lot of people who wouldn't know "throttle adjustability" if it spat them backwards into a hedge bought it and tried to drive it fast. OK the aerodynamics were a bit iffy as well but a bit of rear-end lift is hardly rare on road cars. The original TT was certainly a far less "lethal handling" car than, for example, the Elise.
It's tragic really because the whole saga lead Audi to change the setup to make it understeer like a pig and since then they've never really looked back.
Article said:
How dodgy was the pre-fix TT? Well, in February 2000 German car mag Autobild magazine tested modified and unmodified versions of the 225hp all-wheel-drive TT Coupe against BMW's Z3 2.8, Porsche's Boxster, Subaru's Impreza GT, VW's Golf V6 4Motion and er a 1988 Porsche 911 Carrera (?). The unmodified TT propped up the group on handling control, scoring a measly if not actually shocking 2 out of 10. The 'fixed' ESP TT by contrast scored 10 out of 10, whizzing it up to first spot alongside the similarly-equipped Golf V6
CAR magazine UK
Filibuster said:
Regarding the handling of the original one, Walter Röhrl famously said about the cars handling: "Not bad, but way too dangerous for the normal driver. If you take off the throttle at 200 km/h in a fast bend it will go backwards and there is only one person that can drive like this and that is Walter Röhrl."
Interesting parallels between Audi and PorschePorsche Carrera GT article said:
Due to the recent tragic car accident that killed Paul Walker, the Porsche Carrera GT has gotten a lot of heat for being a “dangerous” car. Apparently, famed Porsche test driver Walter Rohrl called the car, “the most dangerous car on the road”.
So how dangerous is this car, really?
Given that the car is the ultimate Porsche supercar, it takes a lot of willpower to deny yourself the satisfaction of flooring the gas pedal and taking off into the sunset. So, common sense states that the responsibility of safe driving lies in the hands of the person behind the wheel, rather than the vehicle itself. Car manufacturers have to test and retest their vehicles to meet specific road safety standards to keep its passengers, and drivers around them, safe before its cars ever make it onto the production lineup.
During the development of the Carrera GT, Porsche test driver Walter Rohrl told writers at Drive that it was the first time in his life he was ever scared of a car. He had even suggested to Porsche engineers to fit a traction control switch due to the car’s unpredictable behavior for wet road conditions at high speeds
That of course, didn’t happen
Instead, Porsche headquarters issued a memo to automobile dealers in 2004 to warn potential customers about the car’s powerful engine and sensitivity to road conditions
In efforts to protect “everyday” drivers, the memo stated, “I think it is very important that the man who has gone to technical training, at least is consulted before anyone drives this vehicle. Carrera GT is as close to a racecar as we will ever get. This car has all the disadvantages of a racecar.”
With a top speed of 208 miles per hour, a V10 engine and more than 600 horsepower, this car is clearly not your run-of-the-mill commuter car. Also, the engine is located in the center of the vehicle, making it more agile, but also very unforgiving with mistakes. The car is also lacking any sort electronic stability control, so the slightest driver error can lead to slides.
Conservatively, there are about 1,300 Carrera GTs produced, and we keep hearing about nasty car crashes involving them. Late night TV host and known car enthusiast, Jay Leno, spun out of control driving one at Talladega. In 2005, there was a fatal crash at California Speedway where the vehicle lost control, slammed into a concrete wall, and claimed the lives of two men, driver Ben Keaton and passenger Corey Rudl. This same crash led to a lawsuit, and Keaton’s widow received a $4.5 million settlement. Now, the most recent tragedy is the death of Fast and Furious actor Paul Walker and driver Roger Rodas from a fiery CGT crash. Clearly, this car is getting terrible PR time and time again.
So, based on this information, is the Porsche Carrera GT the most dangerous car on the road? Many factors may point to YES. However in my opinion, this car is a supercar built for car enthusiasts who love the style, speed, and power. If you’re inexperienced in the art of agility, you shouldn’t be driving this car. Also, as the driver, you are responsible for making conscious decisions while maneuvering. At high speeds, any car can be dangerous if the driver loses control. When you choose to drive a car like the Carrera, you better be ready for it.
So how dangerous is this car, really?
Given that the car is the ultimate Porsche supercar, it takes a lot of willpower to deny yourself the satisfaction of flooring the gas pedal and taking off into the sunset. So, common sense states that the responsibility of safe driving lies in the hands of the person behind the wheel, rather than the vehicle itself. Car manufacturers have to test and retest their vehicles to meet specific road safety standards to keep its passengers, and drivers around them, safe before its cars ever make it onto the production lineup.
During the development of the Carrera GT, Porsche test driver Walter Rohrl told writers at Drive that it was the first time in his life he was ever scared of a car. He had even suggested to Porsche engineers to fit a traction control switch due to the car’s unpredictable behavior for wet road conditions at high speeds
That of course, didn’t happen
Instead, Porsche headquarters issued a memo to automobile dealers in 2004 to warn potential customers about the car’s powerful engine and sensitivity to road conditions
In efforts to protect “everyday” drivers, the memo stated, “I think it is very important that the man who has gone to technical training, at least is consulted before anyone drives this vehicle. Carrera GT is as close to a racecar as we will ever get. This car has all the disadvantages of a racecar.”
With a top speed of 208 miles per hour, a V10 engine and more than 600 horsepower, this car is clearly not your run-of-the-mill commuter car. Also, the engine is located in the center of the vehicle, making it more agile, but also very unforgiving with mistakes. The car is also lacking any sort electronic stability control, so the slightest driver error can lead to slides.
Conservatively, there are about 1,300 Carrera GTs produced, and we keep hearing about nasty car crashes involving them. Late night TV host and known car enthusiast, Jay Leno, spun out of control driving one at Talladega. In 2005, there was a fatal crash at California Speedway where the vehicle lost control, slammed into a concrete wall, and claimed the lives of two men, driver Ben Keaton and passenger Corey Rudl. This same crash led to a lawsuit, and Keaton’s widow received a $4.5 million settlement. Now, the most recent tragedy is the death of Fast and Furious actor Paul Walker and driver Roger Rodas from a fiery CGT crash. Clearly, this car is getting terrible PR time and time again.
So, based on this information, is the Porsche Carrera GT the most dangerous car on the road? Many factors may point to YES. However in my opinion, this car is a supercar built for car enthusiasts who love the style, speed, and power. If you’re inexperienced in the art of agility, you shouldn’t be driving this car. Also, as the driver, you are responsible for making conscious decisions while maneuvering. At high speeds, any car can be dangerous if the driver loses control. When you choose to drive a car like the Carrera, you better be ready for it.
Decent cars
But piss poor article and severe lack of research shed
Having had most of the vag MK4 golf in various frocks in the family the TT really is a peach
Albeit has to be a 225 personally preffered the Leon Cupra R for handling and most of the parts can be stuck straight on to a 180 TT if you buy fwd.
4wd handling is tunable via a haldex controller and really does make a huge difference to feel.
3.2 is the go to option but hold their money better than the 4 pot cars and a mapped 225 will leave it for dead.
But piss poor article and severe lack of research shed
Having had most of the vag MK4 golf in various frocks in the family the TT really is a peach
Albeit has to be a 225 personally preffered the Leon Cupra R for handling and most of the parts can be stuck straight on to a 180 TT if you buy fwd.
4wd handling is tunable via a haldex controller and really does make a huge difference to feel.
3.2 is the go to option but hold their money better than the 4 pot cars and a mapped 225 will leave it for dead.
Alfa Workshop's review of the Alfa Romeo GTV when it was still current said the following; "This car is very comparable both in price and performance with the Audi TT, however the Audi TT feels like a tarted up golf and the engines are not even in the same league, it does not have a soul. Along your favourite roads an Alfa Romeo GTV will worm your way into your affections you to will become infected with virus Alfa Romeo and I am afraid there is little chance of a cure". A Busso V6 GTV or a series 1 TT - no contest.
I had my first MK1 in 2004, it covered 88,000 miles with no issues what so ever, I bought a replacement Mk1 in 2014 again no issues and always starts first time, Peugeot tried to replicate the TT with the RCZ didn` quite get it right, in my view the MK1 is still a fantastic looking car almost 20 years after it was first produced, the interior is classic and I love it. In todays market I don`t have a clue what 90% of the models are, they all look the same.
I had two of these, both 225s; the first was a denim blue coupe (I still think these look the best) which I had for a few years and I traded it in for a roadster, which I kept for 15 years. It had 90,000 miles on it and never really gave me any grief. Just as cheap to run as any other car I've had. I gave it to my mum earlier this year because I wasn't really driving it that much (kids, basically). Yes, it has the missing pixel issues but so what? Engine never missed a beat despite being remapped.
I've never really got those who find the handling wooden, although I think the few that have called it too grippy have a point. It does grip well, and it's essentially a FWD car so you need to drive it like one. If you can't get enjoyment out of it then frankly you're not doing it right. I do concede that you need to drive it hard and you need to be careful as a result as you can end up doing stupid speeds before you know it.
I loved mine. The driving position was great, the design inside and out was simple and easy to use; no sodding touch screens or any of that b
ks. The roadster did suffer from being a bit flexible and the coupe is a better drive but any half decent driver can adapt to that. I always felt very much in control.
I don't hugely miss mine, mainly because I've had a mk7 Golf R for the last few years, which is a better car, but I know I will next summer.
I've never really got those who find the handling wooden, although I think the few that have called it too grippy have a point. It does grip well, and it's essentially a FWD car so you need to drive it like one. If you can't get enjoyment out of it then frankly you're not doing it right. I do concede that you need to drive it hard and you need to be careful as a result as you can end up doing stupid speeds before you know it.
I loved mine. The driving position was great, the design inside and out was simple and easy to use; no sodding touch screens or any of that b
ks. The roadster did suffer from being a bit flexible and the coupe is a better drive but any half decent driver can adapt to that. I always felt very much in control. I don't hugely miss mine, mainly because I've had a mk7 Golf R for the last few years, which is a better car, but I know I will next summer.
QBee said:
Lovely article, though every time I read about known issues on a 20(ish) year old convertible, my 1999 TVR Chimaera suddenly looks like the pinnacle of reliability.
It was the only car I had that actually worked over Christmas 2014 - both my (newer) German cars were off the road with electrical problems.
That doesn't surprise me as I can't recall ever hearing of a TVR that has broken down.It was the only car I had that actually worked over Christmas 2014 - both my (newer) German cars were off the road with electrical problems.
I must take issue with 'gearbox is tough' or whatever the OP said. The selector fork below is from a 225 Quattro TT (W plate). It is weak in the extreme - it should not be possible to break a fork with enthusiastic gear changes. After this was replaced the clutch pedal broke. The pedal FFS!
Look at the thin section where it fractured.
Look at the thin section where it fractured.
Pedal_Loud said:
Interesting to draw the comparison with the 944.
I had 2 x 944's in the early/mid 2000s, a 250 turbo and an S2. I now have a mk1 Audi TT. Everything that has been said is correct. From a handling perspective the 944 is very hard to beat.
The 944 is/was and probably always will be THE perfect car for me. It fitted me like a glove and ticked all my boxes. I miss both of them to this day.
However, when I came to want a cheap, quick, Germanic, 2+2 coupe with convenience as a daily driver nothing other than the Mk1 TT was coming back in my search results for the budget I had. This was annoying as I had always hated them.
Slowly I looked into them, did my research and after a lousy few months dailying a flimsy Mazda 3 Sport I finally found one. Sure I've been hit my a big service bill, the dash repair (which I was expecting), a new wing to fix a dent etc but really so far for the money the old TT is delivering.
It's been reliable (I know some aren't), it's well made, it has a good turn of pace, the boot is huge, I can get the kids in (just), its 4WD and it just has that VAG charisma that I really like.
OK, so it handles nothing like the 944's did but for 99% of my journeys it really doesn't need to. So all in all I'm super happy with it. It even has factory fitted sat nav that still works (red dot matrix arrows anyone?!).
I did a few vids for YT on it (one is even called 'why I bought a mk1 audi tt') and so far they've had more views than anything else such is the popularity of the things.
Sure the TT is no 944 but then it is a fraction of the cost and you still get a well made, Germanic, characterful, 2+2 coupe.
Refreshing to get a balanced view based on ownership rather than internet hearsay.I had 2 x 944's in the early/mid 2000s, a 250 turbo and an S2. I now have a mk1 Audi TT. Everything that has been said is correct. From a handling perspective the 944 is very hard to beat.
The 944 is/was and probably always will be THE perfect car for me. It fitted me like a glove and ticked all my boxes. I miss both of them to this day.
However, when I came to want a cheap, quick, Germanic, 2+2 coupe with convenience as a daily driver nothing other than the Mk1 TT was coming back in my search results for the budget I had. This was annoying as I had always hated them.
Slowly I looked into them, did my research and after a lousy few months dailying a flimsy Mazda 3 Sport I finally found one. Sure I've been hit my a big service bill, the dash repair (which I was expecting), a new wing to fix a dent etc but really so far for the money the old TT is delivering.
It's been reliable (I know some aren't), it's well made, it has a good turn of pace, the boot is huge, I can get the kids in (just), its 4WD and it just has that VAG charisma that I really like.
OK, so it handles nothing like the 944's did but for 99% of my journeys it really doesn't need to. So all in all I'm super happy with it. It even has factory fitted sat nav that still works (red dot matrix arrows anyone?!).
I did a few vids for YT on it (one is even called 'why I bought a mk1 audi tt') and so far they've had more views than anything else such is the popularity of the things.
Sure the TT is no 944 but then it is a fraction of the cost and you still get a well made, Germanic, characterful, 2+2 coupe.
The TT is a bit of a marmite car isn't it. I must admit I never really cared for them, but now they're nearly 20 years old they're starting to grab my attention simply because they offer quite a lot really for the bargain basement prices being asked for. According to Car magazine in their 2000 feature, the TT was a match in a straight-line for the UK Impreza Turbo and whilst they may not offer much in the way of handling feedback I bet they're still a quick car point to point.
So I reckon compared with a lot of over-priced modern classics out there right now, they actually offer quite a bang for your buck. I can actually see myself getting one of these one day as a cheap weekend car. But a Coupe not the convertible.
Edited by greenarrow on Monday 10th December 09:34
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