RE: 700hp Shelby GT500 unveiled at Detroit
Discussion
FerdiZ28 said:
With this and the new corvette the US really are dominating the accessible sports/supercar market.
The only reason a real petrolhead would choose anything else would be vanity and undeserved prejudice.
Some of us have been thinking more or less the same thing -- but for the last 25+ years.The only reason a real petrolhead would choose anything else would be vanity and undeserved prejudice.
unsprung said:
it's a dual-clutch automatic for a number of reasons
for example:
the GT500 customer is more premium-minded and less interested in a manual transmission; see elsewhere online for GT500 specifications such as the magnetorheological / adjustable suspension having a driver-selectable grand touring mode which is more compliant than on the GT350
this particular automatic also allows for comprehensive and highly-detailed tuning of the entire powertrain, both to maximise performance and to limit stress on components; emissions are similarly best managed
as mentioned earlier by others, the massive output of this supercharged engine tends to favour the characteristics of an automatic, even a manually-shiftable automatic, over a traditional manual transmission; it's worth to remember: torque is instant and almost unimaginable -- a rumoured 650 lb-ft of torque and very likely most of it available off-idle
if it hasn't got a torque converter, its not an automatic. I know it sounds pedantic, but this is a difference you can feel- with a dual clutch box, there is a direct connection between the engine and transmission. With a torque converter, its only fluid dynamics that provide drive- its basically 2 fans facing each other in oil and as the oil gets compressed by the fan driven by the engine, it starts turning the fan thats connected to the transmission.for example:
the GT500 customer is more premium-minded and less interested in a manual transmission; see elsewhere online for GT500 specifications such as the magnetorheological / adjustable suspension having a driver-selectable grand touring mode which is more compliant than on the GT350
this particular automatic also allows for comprehensive and highly-detailed tuning of the entire powertrain, both to maximise performance and to limit stress on components; emissions are similarly best managed
as mentioned earlier by others, the massive output of this supercharged engine tends to favour the characteristics of an automatic, even a manually-shiftable automatic, over a traditional manual transmission; it's worth to remember: torque is instant and almost unimaginable -- a rumoured 650 lb-ft of torque and very likely most of it available off-idle
This is why no matter how good a ZF automatic is, there is a slurring between gears and a delay- you can't make fluids as stiff/direct as a mechanical connection. However, the torque converter is also a torque multiplier, as for the drag strip you could specify a "high stall" torque converter, where the point that maximum drive transfer occurs is at a higher RPM; on a drag strip or traffic light race, you can "load" the torque converter by raising the revs with your accelerator, but holding the car still with the brake, and then slingshotting of the line. like when you sidestep a clutch with a full manual (launch control in single and dual clutch self shifting transmissions does this precisely).
I own two single clutch self shifters (Maserati quattroporte duo-select, which is the same as the Ferrari F1 gearbox, and an e-gear lamborghini) and they do feel like "real" manual cars to drive. I've driven a few dual clutch cars, and while they are MUCH smoother between gears, they still feel like a manual.
I don't see that there would be much demand for a GT500 with a "stick" shift, as a dual clutch would be quicker at the drag strip, as well as the track, and still "feels" better than a slushbox (torque converter auto).
unsprung said:
Some of us have been thinking more or less the same thing -- but for the last 25+ years.
Well you’ve been wrong. And I’ve had several yanks (with always at least one in the fleet) over the last 20 years but I’d be the first to admit they haven’t been competitive until very recently.stavers said:
donkmeister said:
WCZ said:
I was under the impression there's loads of 700hp+ fords out there and it's not even a heavy tune for these engines
But this one has a warranty, hot weather testing, NVH testing etc.However, surely the highest horsepower from a factory-warrantied Ford V8 would be the 4.6l, 16v unit fitted to the MG ZT (following a pricey excursion down the MG Xpower options list)
The MG XPower was meant to come with all sorts but I think the most powerful official version of the 4.6L was the SV with 320hp and there was a 5.0L SVR with 385hp.
FerdiZ28 said:
Well you’ve been wrong. And I’ve had several yanks (with always at least one in the fleet) over the last 20 years but I’d be the first to admit they haven’t been competitive until very recently.
What your comment actually reveals is that V8 performance has always been easy and affordable on one side of the Atlantic, but not the other.It's not like UK households, with lower incomes and higher operating costs, were given the choice of US V8 performance and, in response, said, "Nope. We're going to hold out for something that costs 100 percent more, because it's a bit better."
SydneySE said:
if it hasn't got a torque converter, its not an automatic. I know it sounds pedantic, but this is a difference you can feel-
right you areand Ford, with this robotic gearbox, are able to better manage not just performance, but also fuel economy and emissions
the modern torque converter does have a direct lockup, though, so things are bit different than years ago
unsprung said:
What your comment actually reveals is that V8 performance has always been easy and affordable on one side of the Atlantic, but not the other.
It's not like UK households, with lower incomes and higher operating costs, were given the choice of US V8 performance and, in response, said, "Nope. We're going to hold out for something that costs 100 percent more, because it's a bit better."
Always blows my mind when I visit the USA, more or less double the average take home income and half the house prices/daily living costs.It's not like UK households, with lower incomes and higher operating costs, were given the choice of US V8 performance and, in response, said, "Nope. We're going to hold out for something that costs 100 percent more, because it's a bit better."
And a good chunk of Europe spends it's life bemoaning the stupidity of US citizens, the US is not perfect but we can learn a lot from the standard of living.
epom said:
GroundEffect said:
epom said:
Should they not call it the GT700 ?
The original GT500 wasn't named for its horsepower....This new Shelby Mustang needed a name. Carroll Shelby has told the story many times of how the GT350 name came to be. Shelby wasn’t enamored with the name “Cobra-Mustang” that Ford had been tossing around. Nor was he impressed with any other names that his team kicked around, like “Mustang Gran Sport” and “Skunk.” In fact, he wasn’t really concerned with naming the car at all, but Ford needed a name for legal and marketing reasons. According to Shelby, nobody could agree on any of the many names thrown about, and in one of numerous meetings held on the subject, Shelby, no doubt frustrated with corporate politics, turned to Phil Remington and asked him what the distance between the race and production shops at Shelby American was. Remington’s response was “about three hundred and fifty feet,” to which Shelby said, “That’s what we’ll call it–GT350.”
Shelby’s reasoning for such a hasty decision? “The name wouldn’t make the car, and if it is a bad car, the name won’t save it.”
A generic alphanumeric name that signified nothing also had practical applications: Shelby could upgrade and improve the car whenever it wanted without having to change the name and let the competition know what it was up to.
Sometimes ignorance is bliss.
Published yesterday... Here's an overview of the robotic gearbox:
"...can deliver a ripping fast upshift in as little as 80 milliseconds..."
article here
https://www.slashgear.com/this-trick-transmission-...
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