RE: Manual, rear-drive BMW M3 'Pure' rumoured

[anonymous-user]

Triumph Man said:

Terminator X said:

Robmarriott said:

How BMW have managed for so long with paint that bad I just don't know.

Same for any robot painted cars surely?

TX.

There is a notable difference in the quality of the paintwork between my 1995 E34 and my 2001 E39. The older car was painted far better. Clearly age has taken its toll, but there is no "orange peel" that the newer car has.

You know the "orange peel" effect is bad when it's that obvious even on the ultra low resolution that PH still has in 2019.

[Mike335i]

PaulD86 said:

Ordinarily I'd think this was great news.... OK, to be fair I still think it's a good thing, however, I have yet to drive any BMW with a nice feeling manual gearbox. I'm a big BMW fan but I've found all their manual boxes somewhat unpleasant to use. The thought of a manual M4 does still massively appeal though.

The manual M235i seemed decent and I have driven a modified E92 320d (SE) that had a nice shift action.

Mine isn't great though, I'm glad I went for the manual box though, I drive a lot of autos now and they are very competent, but not exactly fun, even with paddles.

[LaurasOtherHalf]

sideways man said:

PaulD86 said:

Ordinarily I'd think this was great news.... OK, to be fair I still think it's a good thing, however, I have yet to drive any BMW with a nice feeling manual gearbox. I'm a big BMW fan but I've found all their manual boxes somewhat unpleasant to use.

This.
Driven lots of BMW over the years, Not one has had a decent gearchange

I'd agree (having owned a manual ///M in the past too) but let's be honest, beggars simply can't be choosers these days. Plus there's noting to say they won't get better.

[MattOz]

So long as BMW sort out the annoying rev hang between gear changes with the manual, then yes, it's a great idea. Totally ruined the driving experience for me on my F31 335i.

[Timbergiant]

For all the talk of purists buying these cars the current crop of M3 and M4s seem to be about 90% autos, my manual was one of only two sold by my dealer, I’ll keep it incase its a “rare classic” one day.

[9k rpm]

First two paragraphs:

“Less equipment for more money is hardly a new concept”

“One manufacturer yet to embrace the trend is BMW, with M cars”

Who writes this drivel? What was the M3 CSL?

[lord trumpton]

dme123 said:

Triumph Man said:

Terminator X said:

Robmarriott said:

How BMW have managed for so long with paint that bad I just don't know.

Same for any robot painted cars surely?

TX.

There is a notable difference in the quality of the paintwork between my 1995 E34 and my 2001 E39. The older car was painted far better. Clearly age has taken its toll, but there is no "orange peel" that the newer car has.

You know the "orange peel" effect is bad when it's that obvious even on the ultra low resolution that PH still has in 2019.

Its due to water based paint and manufacturers applying less coats of paint than of old. Goes on thicker in a single layer (to reduce emissions)

It's been st since the E90 genre tbh.

[cerb4.5lee]

Tea Pot One said:

sideways man said:

This.
Driven lots of BMW over the years, Not one has had a decent gearchange

My view too !

I loved the Z4M I had but got rid of it as I just found the box horrible. Their autos are great - DCT and 8 speed ... but I will never get another BMW manual.

That was the same for me and I hated my Z4M's gearbox. The manual gearbox in my E92 M3 was better but still poor. Although I would still buy the current M4 with a manual gearbox(I've heard its a little better) because I enjoy the extra involvement. I appreciate that the DCT/Auto are quicker/better on fuel though.

[lord trumpton]

cerb4.5lee said:

Tea Pot One said:

sideways man said:

This.
Driven lots of BMW over the years, Not one has had a decent gearchange

My view too !

I loved the Z4M I had but got rid of it as I just found the box horrible. Their autos are great - DCT and 8 speed ... but I will never get another BMW manual.

That was the same for me and I hated my Z4M's gearbox. The manual gearbox in my E92 M3 was better but still poor. Although I would still buy the current M4 with a manual gearbox(I've heard its a little better) because I enjoy the extra involvement. I appreciate that the DCT/Auto are quicker/better on fuel though.

The problem with all BMW manual gearboxes are remedied by the CDV removal and fluid change with friction modifier added.

[Sion111R]

Manual gearbox in my Z4 and M2 are OK once warm.
Never a second thought about the gearbox. Unlike the markedly “offset to the right” pedals in the M2 which aren’t great for my lower back.

[nickfrog]

slipstream 1985 said:

Until bmw can design proper brakes for their road cars I doubt I will ever buy another again.

Get with the programme grand dad ;-). Even a seven year old M135i comes with 4 pot Brembo and huge discs as std. Managed a few sessions at Spa on stock pads without any problems despite 3:00 lap times.

[cologne2792]

mrbarnett said:

And here it is...

Perfect !

[SidewaysSi]

cerb4.5lee said:

Tea Pot One said:

sideways man said:

This.
Driven lots of BMW over the years, Not one has had a decent gearchange

My view too !

I loved the Z4M I had but got rid of it as I just found the box horrible. Their autos are great - DCT and 8 speed ... but I will never get another BMW manual.

That was the same for me and I hated my Z4M's gearbox. The manual gearbox in my E92 M3 was better but still poor. Although I would still buy the current M4 with a manual gearbox(I've heard its a little better) because I enjoy the extra involvement. I appreciate that the DCT/Auto are quicker/better on fuel though.

Yes BMW manuals are not great as standard. But there are options for improvement if you want to.

UUC do a quickshift and combined with the CDV delete and a lightweight flywheel makes a great shift action.

I always modify cars though as I tend to find standard cars a little boring.

[myhandle]

Triumph Man said:

There is a notable difference in the quality of the paintwork between my 1995 E34 and my 2001 E39. The older car was painted far better. Clearly age has taken its toll, but there is no "orange peel" that the newer car has.

Two of the finest M cars , what great cars!

[Davidonly]

sideways man said:

PaulD86 said:

Ordinarily I'd think this was great news.... OK, to be fair I still think it's a good thing, however, I have yet to drive any BMW with a nice feeling manual gearbox. I'm a big BMW fan but I've found all their manual boxes somewhat unpleasant to use.

This.
Driven lots of BMW over the years, Not one has had a decent gearchange

That's why I loved my E46M3 - SMG Had it for well 96,000 miles never went wrong and I loved the thump of rapid shifting.

[CraigyMc]

Robmarriott said:

How BMW have managed for so long with paint that bad I just don't know.

Apparently the buyers of these cars don't care about what you care about.

[jjr1]

I have an M4 Competition and nothing would make me want it in a manual version. I had a Gt86 and loved that in manual and it really suited the car but an M4 is so much bigger and more powerful that the thought of swapping cogs in it manually makes me feel ill.

In fact i can't think of any big powerful car i would want in manual form.

Manual is for small sports cars like an Elise or Gt86 etc.

[DP33]

Having driven the F8X M3 and M4s on the road and at Oulton (6spd and DCT), IMO the cars with manual boxes were much better. Certainly no complaints about shift quality and the interaction levels on offer were just much better. What was disappointing was the lack of rev range vrs the old E9X Ms. The newer cars are, of course ultimately quicker, but I do miss that V8.

[cerb4.5lee]

jjr1 said:

I have an M4 Competition and nothing would make me want it in a manual version. I had a Gt86 and loved that in manual and it really suited the car but an M4 is so much bigger and more powerful that the thought of swapping cogs in it manually makes me feel ill.

In fact i can't think of any big powerful car i would want in manual form.

I'm the opposite and the thought of a V8 Mustang(for example) with an Auto would ruin it for me, the V8 engine and a manual gearbox really appeals to me. That is why I had a manual in my V8 M3(even though the DCT is the much better choice for that engine).

I'm in the minority though, and manual gearboxes are pretty much dead and buried in performance cars now. Everyone wants a DCT/Auto currently for sure.

[Julian Thompson]

Another manual M4 comp owner here. I’m on my second one and I really enjoy the manual change - I think it works brilliantly on the road with such a huge spread of torque.

I fully accept that it is inferior technically, and that I’m a “car pervert” for my preference - but I just like it!

Can I see bmw making a “pure” edition as described here? Well did they make a “pure” M5? I think not. And if you wanted a rear drive M3/4 next year there will be plenty on the used market. It just doesn’t make sense. They can CS or CSL or GTS or Competition it for up-sell. They don’t need to start reworking the drive train to that extent to garner those sales. Just turn the boost up a bit and fit some ceramic brakes. Then put some decent tyres on with some more camber and dial in a slightly more pointy front - probably replacing a few bushes with something a bit more solid at the same time. Then replace the door pulls with some string, whack in a set of race seats, some inside-out cow look material and a worse stereo and boom. Job done.

Edited for spectacular grammatical fails. It has been a tough week!

Edited by Julian Thompson on Friday 18th January 22:06