RE: Hyundai i30 N Fastback vs Skoda Octavia vRS 245

[Limpet]

westernlancia said:

What you're basically saying is that VAG couldn't make an interesting car if their lives depended on it. They just turn out grey, efficient, predictable, dull washing machines on wheels, with coalmine black interiors and powered by the same capable but staggeringly tedious group of engines, and any 'difference' between a Skoda and a Bentley is just 'engineered' in by a bloke with a mouse.

I really want to disagree with this, but it's difficult to. Being a designer at Skoda or Seat must be one of the most frustrating jobs on earth. "Here's a list of things you are not allowed to do, and tech you're not allowed to use, in case the end result competes with another one of our brands, and here's a list of the exact parts you have to work with. Right, knock yourselves out, and come up with something amazing." It must be soul destroying.

[Dale487]

jm28 said:

Are these two really getting considered by buyers at the same time though? There’s a throwaway line about the i30 being ‘pokier’. The crucial question is to what extent? Can I still get a young family and all the associated guff in and is the ride actually going to be too rough for them? Because it sounds like a second car at best, and great though I’m sure it is it’s no more use than a Golf or Leon. Why not just go all out, get the hatch and park it up next to your SUV? I can’t afford to do that so unless my life fits in the i30, I’ll get another Skoda.

I agree that neither of the i30Ns have a large enough boot for a young family (read, having to lug around push chairs, travel cots and the other rubbish) but when I was lucky enough to go to Millbrook to drive the hatch, it felt no worse than a Golf GTI, Leon Cupra hatch etc. And I felt the back seats were better than most in class for adults.

I personally felt the ride, even in N mode on the Millbrook concrete surfaces, was as good as my Leon FR ST which runs the optional 18" wheels - which is the best riding car I've owned.

I agree that that the Skoda wins on boot size & accommodation. But in 3-4 years time, when I'm free of pushchairs & the like, I'd go for the i30N Fastback - it seems fun but still more practical than your average hatch, so I could make it work as a family car for me (not sure what my wife will think about it though). It nice to have a different option & a very good one at that.

[SunsetZed]

Dale487 said:

jm28 said:

Are these two really getting considered by buyers at the same time though? There’s a throwaway line about the i30 being ‘pokier’. The crucial question is to what extent? Can I still get a young family and all the associated guff in and is the ride actually going to be too rough for them? Because it sounds like a second car at best, and great though I’m sure it is it’s no more use than a Golf or Leon. Why not just go all out, get the hatch and park it up next to your SUV? I can’t afford to do that so unless my life fits in the i30, I’ll get another Skoda.

I agree that neither of the i30Ns have a large enough boot for a young family (read, having to lug around push chairs, travel cots and the other rubbish) but when I was lucky enough to go to Millbrook to drive the hatch, it felt no worse than a Golf GTI, Leon Cupra hatch etc. And I felt the back seats were better than most in class for adults.

I personally felt the ride, even in N mode on the Millbrook concrete surfaces, was as good as my Leon FR ST which runs the optional 18" wheels - which is the best riding car I've owned.

I agree that that the Skoda wins on boot size & accommodation. But in 3-4 years time, when I'm free of pushchairs & the like, I'd go for the i30N Fastback - it seems fun but still more practical than your average hatch, so I could make it work as a family car for me (not sure what my wife will think about it though). It nice to have a different option & a very good one at that.

The first and last paragraphs there ring completely true to me. I got the Octavia (very similar to the tested one, glad they picked the best colour as well ) because with a young family nothing else in the price bracket comes close.

Without pushchairs then I'd absolutely consider the N but right now, for me and many others, the practicality trumps the thrills and that's why they've been around for 20 years!

[Dale487]

Limpet said:

westernlancia said:

What you're basically saying is that VAG couldn't make an interesting car if their lives depended on it. They just turn out grey, efficient, predictable, dull washing machines on wheels, with coalmine black interiors and powered by the same capable but staggeringly tedious group of engines, and any 'difference' between a Skoda and a Bentley is just 'engineered' in by a bloke with a mouse.

I really want to disagree with this, but it's difficult to. Being a designer at Skoda or Seat must be one of the most frustrating jobs on earth. "Here's a list of things you are not allowed to do, and tech you're not allowed to use, in case the end result competes with another one of our brands, and here's a list of the exact parts you have to work with. Right, knock yourselves out, and come up with something amazing." It must be soul destroying.

Be the best.......you're allowed to be.

Edited by Dale487 on Tuesday 12th February 13:03

[Hub]

Yes, I was going to say that the USP of the Skoda is that it is fast AND very practical. The Hyundai is just a different body shape to the original hatch, but not deliberately practical (and smaller than the Skoda anyway) - but more fun. It depends where on the fun vs practicality scale you need to be.

That said, I am very interested in the i30 fastback!

[dunnoreally]

Great stuff in general, I think. Octavia's a cracking car, but the VRS has had the affordable fast saloon/hatch thing niche to itself for too long. Competition and variety are always a good thing.

I could easily see myself owning either of these.

[aaron_2000]

I'd have the Skoda. I'm not a badge snob, but I still couldn't own a Korean car, not yet. M140i money is the Hyundai though.

[kambites]

aaron_2000 said:

I'm not a badge snob,

Just a nationality snob?

[aaron_2000]

kambites said:

aaron_2000 said:

I'm not a badge snob,

Just a nationality snob?

No. More that from my experience, build quality and cabin materials on Kia/Hyundai's have been absolutely horrific. To this day, the worst car I've ever driven was a Hyundai i30, the steering on that made my old 7 Series feel like an Alfasud.

[kambites]

I've experienced bad German cars... that doesn't mean German cars are bad. Each to their own but it seems utterly bizarre to me to discount an entire nation's products just because of one bad experience in the past.

[jm28]

SunsetZed said:

Dale487 said:

jm28 said:

Are these two really getting considered by buyers at the same time though? There’s a throwaway line about the i30 being ‘pokier’. The crucial question is to what extent? Can I still get a young family and all the associated guff in and is the ride actually going to be too rough for them? Because it sounds like a second car at best, and great though I’m sure it is it’s no more use than a Golf or Leon. Why not just go all out, get the hatch and park it up next to your SUV? I can’t afford to do that so unless my life fits in the i30, I’ll get another Skoda.

I agree that neither of the i30Ns have a large enough boot for a young family (read, having to lug around push chairs, travel cots and the other rubbish) but when I was lucky enough to go to Millbrook to drive the hatch, it felt no worse than a Golf GTI, Leon Cupra hatch etc. And I felt the back seats were better than most in class for adults.

I personally felt the ride, even in N mode on the Millbrook concrete surfaces, was as good as my Leon FR ST which runs the optional 18" wheels - which is the best riding car I've owned.

I agree that that the Skoda wins on boot size & accommodation. But in 3-4 years time, when I'm free of pushchairs & the like, I'd go for the i30N Fastback - it seems fun but still more practical than your average hatch, so I could make it work as a family car for me (not sure what my wife will think about it though). It nice to have a different option & a very good one at that.

The first and last paragraphs there ring completely true to me. I got the Octavia (very similar to the tested one, glad they picked the best colour as well ) because with a young family nothing else in the price bracket comes close.

Without pushchairs then I'd absolutely consider the N but right now, for me and many others, the practicality trumps the thrills and that's why they've been around for 20 years!

We're all in violent agreement then! Just to clarify, I'm not knocking the Hyundai - I ran one when i was in South Korea (a Veloster) and loved it. I only had one kid then and access to a Genesis, an Avante and, erm, a Porter flatbed from the family fleet. It's good looking, by all accounts is a great steer and it WILL be unbreakable and probably offer good residuals. Come to think about it, in two or three years when the wife's back in work it'd make a great used buy with that warranty to sit alongside the Octavia. Still think Skoda have the practical perfomance parentmobile sown up though...

[kambites]

jm28 said:

Still think Skoda have the practical perfomance parentmobile sown up though...

Pretty much, bar big SUVs and estates.

Before the facelift it was a good looking car, too.

[rob.e]

Cars like this are most likely to be used for family duties.. so space is very important as is the price. A family purchaser on a budget isn't going to spec up the octavia with options like the test car so in the real world its a good chunk cheaper than the hyundai, factor in the extra space you get and it's a no brainer for the skoda surely?

I've had three vRS's and everything written in the article here fits with my experience - you want more "fun" with your Octavia then spend some money on decent suspension upgrade (H&R monotubes /bilsteins plus upgraded ARB's) and some light wheels and you'l transform the car.

[Ajax Treesdown]

Dale487 said:

I agree that neither of the i30Ns have a large enough boot for a young family (read, having to lug around push chairs, travel cots and the other rubbish) but when I was lucky enough to go to Millbrook to drive the hatch, it felt no worse than a Golf GTI, Leon Cupra hatch etc. And I felt the back seats were better than most in class for adults.

I personally felt the ride, even in N mode on the Millbrook concrete surfaces, was as good as my Leon FR ST which runs the optional 18" wheels - which is the best riding car I've owned.

I agree that that the Skoda wins on boot size & accommodation. But in 3-4 years time, when I'm free of pushchairs & the like, I'd go for the i30N Fastback - it seems fun but still more practical than your average hatch, so I could make it work as a family car for me (not sure what my wife will think about it though). It nice to have a different option & a very good one at that.

I have the I30N Performance hatchback and have had it since May 18. I have a toddler (well coming up to 2 years old) and the boot space has been plenty big enough for pushchair, travel cot and all the other stuff that we have needed for trips away etc.
I'm not disagreeing that the boot coould maybe be bigger but you do get a bit more room removing the rear strut brace (I know you shouldn't have to) but i have found it to be adequate for our needs. I haven't seen the size of the fastback boot so couldn't comment on that.
I agree with your comment about it being fun to drive though. The pressing of the N button will always make you smile.

[kambites]

People get by with kids and tiny cars. The main advantage I've found with something like the Octavia is not that you can fit everything you need for children in it, but that you can leave everything you need for children in it and still go to Ikea/Makro/whatever without having to worry about it. It's a minor quality of life improvement rather than a step change in what you can do with the car.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 12th February 14:29

[Richard-390a0]

That Hyundai is the blandest most generic looking car I've seen in a long time... it actually makes the Octy look interesting!!!

[Limpet]

kambites said:

People get by with kids and tiny cars. The main advantage I've found with something like the Octavia is not that you can fit everything you need for children in it, but that you can leave everything you need for children in it and still go to Ikea/Makro/whatever without having to worry about it. It's a minor quality of life improvement rather than a step change in what you can do with the car.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 12th February 14:29

Nails it, IMO. 100% agreement.

Also the nature of the space required changes as the kids grow.

When they're babies and toddlers it's all about the boot, due to the need to cart prams and pushchairs about. This is when you can end up having to juggle stuff to go shopping, as above..
When they're children (and mobile), you can pretty much get away with anything with useable rear seats. My then eight year old used to love riding in the back of my old Puma project.
As they get towards teenage years, and become small adult sized, rear legroom becomes a bigger consideration.

[Dale487]

Ajax Treesdown said:

Dale487 said:

I agree that neither of the i30Ns have a large enough boot for a young family (read, having to lug around push chairs, travel cots and the other rubbish) but when I was lucky enough to go to Millbrook to drive the hatch, it felt no worse than a Golf GTI, Leon Cupra hatch etc. And I felt the back seats were better than most in class for adults.

I personally felt the ride, even in N mode on the Millbrook concrete surfaces, was as good as my Leon FR ST which runs the optional 18" wheels - which is the best riding car I've owned.

I agree that that the Skoda wins on boot size & accommodation. But in 3-4 years time, when I'm free of pushchairs & the like, I'd go for the i30N Fastback - it seems fun but still more practical than your average hatch, so I could make it work as a family car for me (not sure what my wife will think about it though). It nice to have a different option & a very good one at that.

I have the I30N Performance hatchback and have had it since May 18. I have a toddler (well coming up to 2 years old) and the boot space has been plenty big enough for pushchair, travel cot and all the other stuff that we have needed for trips away etc.
I'm not disagreeing that the boot coould maybe be bigger but you do get a bit more room removing the rear strut brace (I know you shouldn't have to) but i have found it to be adequate for our needs. I haven't seen the size of the fastback boot so couldn't comment on that.
I agree with your comment about it being fun to drive though. The pressing of the N button will always make you smile.

I gather the Fastback boot is long & comparatively low - which I think it better than the SUV style tall boots, piling things high doesn't make access easy.

[JMF894]

This whole practicality thing is being bounced about a bit too much I think. I accept different people lead different lives which require different things but back in 2008 we had a MK1 Octy vRS hatch and 3 young boys: a 1 year old, a 5 year old and a 7 year old. We managed with that car for 5 years and the only time things got a bit fiddly was when strapping in 2/3 child seats required a specific order of operation.

Would you rather enjoy the car 80% of the time and have to faff a little 20% of the time when family duties called or would you rather have an easy life 20% of the time and tolerate a car you don't really need 80% of the time?

[kambites]

JMF894 said:

Would you rather enjoy the car 80% of the time and have to faff a little 20% of the time when family duties called or would you rather have an easy life 20% of the time and tolerate a car you don't really need 80% of the time?

Well that depends what you're using the car for I guess. I think I could count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I've driven our Octavia without our daughter in it in the last year. My wife drives it solo rather more but even that's a minority and she's not particularly interested in fun beyond the amusement of booting it in a straight-line occasionally.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 12th February 15:44