RE: Hyundai i30 N Fastback vs Skoda Octavia vRS 245

[Dale487]

jm28 said:

havoc said:

Talking of boot space, the Hyundai has 450 litres, which is last-gen 3-series territory, so not exactly small. I'd be stunned if a 'young family' actually needed more than that* unless they've got 2 kids under 2 or are the sort of middle-class PITAs that absolutely have to take everything with them...

* More than e.g. 2-3 times a year, that is.

Not quite sure how this has degenerated into an argument about class, or indeed how the contents of another's boot constitute a P in your A but whatever. The Hyundai sits at 450, usefully more than a Golf at 380 but significantly less than an Octavia at 590.

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

Once you move past that, sure, the Hyundai is doable as a family car but I'd still say it's a bit on the small side if you regularly go on holiday with your car. People managed in the past - we fitted in a B2 Audi 80 Sport, but my sister and I were usually sat on crates of Kronenberg on the way home...

And that is pretty much how I;

1. got rid of a MK2 Fabia Monte Carlo (one night trip with a 2 month old filled the entire car including the uninhabited back seat area)
2. despite much man maths - including brand new last of the Mk7 GTIs being only £1500 more than 18 month old ones with 10k miles on the clock - I didn't buy a Golf GTI.
3. end up with a Leon ST, as my wife decreed an Octavia too big (there's about 15 litres in boot space in it but the Leon ST is a good 10-15cm shorter)

[havoc]

jm28 said:

havoc said:

Talking of boot space, the Hyundai has 450 litres, which is last-gen 3-series territory, so not exactly small. I'd be stunned if a 'young family' actually needed more than that* unless they've got 2 kids under 2 or are the sort of middle-class PITAs that absolutely have to take everything with them...

* More than e.g. 2-3 times a year, that is.

Not quite sure how this has degenerated into an argument about class, or indeed how the contents of another's boot constitute a P in your A but whatever. The Hyundai sits at 450, usefully more than a Golf at 380 but significantly less than an Octavia at 590.

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

Once you move past that, sure, the Hyundai is doable as a family car but I'd still say it's a bit on the small side if you regularly go on holiday with your car. People managed in the past - we fitted in a B2 Audi 80 Sport, but my sister and I were usually sat on crates of Kronenberg on the way home...

Funnily enough, we've a 6-mth old and a 6y.o.

And my parents live in Kent, 150 miles away.

My parents have a 2nd hand cot, a 2nd hand fold-up mclaren buggy*, an Ikea high chair and a few odds-and-sods to make life easier for visiting kiddies. And we managed just fine for Christmas in my Civic (inc. presents for all my family plus my best mate and his family, as well as a full week of clothes etc. for elder son who was staying down there after Xmas). Boot looked like a championship round of Tetris and the change bag was in the rear footwell, but it was fine!

(First time we went down we travelled in wife's Mk7 GTi - again no pram but no roof-rack either)

I go back to what I was saying - the middle classes now really do try to take too much crap around with them...



* The two times we went down there when baby daughter was too young for buggy we didn't really go 'out' anywhere we'd have 'needed' a whole "travel system" assembly, but you're right in that regard - they're all ridiculously big. Our current one takes up 75% of the Golf's boot...

[Sford]

havoc said:

stuff

Was literally about to say, surely if the people are 'middle class' and the visit is monthly the parents will have stuff at the destination to save having to lug most of the John Lewis baby department with you.

[Rafeabrook]

I have a red VRS 245 Estate on lease with a manual gearbox

Nothing comes close in terms of performance, kit, economy and space and I am paying £2k up front and only £163 per month over 2 years.

It was an unbelievably good deal for a very competent fast and practical car

It's done everything I have asked of it (as a professional photographer and Dad), returns a genuine 35mpg average and keeps up with pretty much anything this side of a genuine sports car.

No, I don't love it but I would have another in a heartbeat.

NB: I also have an R129 500SL that I love that scratches the emotional itch.

[ahenners]

jm28 said:

Not quite sure how this has degenerated into an argument about class, or indeed how the contents of another's boot constitute a P in your A but whatever. The Hyundai sits at 450, usefully more than a Golf at 380 but significantly less than an Octavia at 590.

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

Once you move past that, sure, the Hyundai is doable as a family car but I'd still say it's a bit on the small side if you regularly go on holiday with your car. People managed in the past - we fitted in a B2 Audi 80 Sport, but my sister and I were usually sat on crates of Kronenberg on the way home...

You're absolutely spot on with this post and you've clearly been there and done it!

MK3 Octavia VRS owner here with a 3 year old and a 6 month old. It's our only car and I would definitely not want anything smaller; the boot is easily filled with the baby's pushchair plus our week's worth of shopping at Tesco and a few other bits of shopping. It's also swallowed all the stuff we've needed for camping weekends, weeks to center parcs etc. without needing a roofbox.

It slots into family life perfectly and I can't think of much else that can match the all round offering this car has. There are better fast/fun cars, there are more practical cars, but the appeal in the Octavia VRS is how well it balances both.

[aaron_2000]

jm28 said:

Not quite sure how this has degenerated into an argument about class, or indeed how the contents of another's boot constitute a P in your A but whatever. The Hyundai sits at 450, usefully more than a Golf at 380 but significantly less than an Octavia at 590.

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

Once you move past that, sure, the Hyundai is doable as a family car but I'd still say it's a bit on the small side if you regularly go on holiday with your car. People managed in the past - we fitted in a B2 Audi 80 Sport, but my sister and I were usually sat on crates of Kronenberg on the way home...

Perfectly put. We did Cornwall in a Focus ST170, roofbox and fully loaded with luggage.

[blearyeyedboy]

Also worth highlighting that we're not just talking about boot capacity here. If you're a tall-ish bloke (6'1" with disproportionately long legs here) and you have a child in a rear-facing seat with an ISOFIX base to fit behind you, then there are only do many cars that will fit one.

Yes, my child doesn't need one as such, unless we have a nasty smash that we may never have. But I choose to have a big rear facing seat. Perhaps that makes me soft and middle class to some here...

It's not just a size thing (so I genuinely don't know how an i30 would be for this). VAG cars tend to be good, Ford acceptable, Renault and Toyota poor for the Golfocastra class that I've tried.

[Dale487]

blearyeyedboy said:

Also worth highlighting that we're not just talking about boot capacity here. If you're a tall-ish bloke (6'1" with disproportionately long legs here) and you have a child in a rear-facing seat with an ISOFIX base to fit behind you, then there are only do many cars that will fit one.

Yes, my child doesn't need one as such, unless we have a nasty smash that we may never have. But I choose to have a big rear facing seat. Perhaps that makes me soft and middle class to some here...

It's not just a size thing (so I genuinely don't know how an i30 would be for this). VAG cars tend to be good, Ford acceptable, Renault and Toyota poor for the Golfocastra class that I've tried.

Its not just fitting one behind you as a tall driver, its how far forward the passenger seat needs to be to fit an ISOFIX base on passenger side rear seat that I found increasingly frustrating - it seriously limited my view in my old Fabia, a car which 6' passengers could easily fit in behind a 6'2 driver.

The VAQ MQB based cars seem to have a slightly higher set rear bench, which also has a longer seat - I found the equivalent Fords & Nissans poor for this.

[AlB82]

Seems strange reading a review comparing a VRS and an i30N Fastback and the debate is around boot space

I think the Fastback is being aimed more at those who's kids have grown out of buggies and prams and are sick of the SUVs and family cars they've been driving for the last 5/10 years. The Hatch is probably aimed at those who haven't had to adapt to family life yet. I'm the former - ready to drive an interesting car for a change and to me the Fastback N is just that - something a bit different. You see the same old suspects on the road and this has come a little out left field. I may regret it, have driven 2 Hyundais in the past before switching to Audi. The Hyundai Coupe is still one of my favourite cars - still looks good when you see them on the road even today. The ix35 on the other hand was the worst car I've ever had in my life. Time will tell where the Fastback N sits.

[rob.e]

jm28 said:

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

this ^ nail, head etc.

Unfortunately in our household once the kids were beyond that stage where they needed all that crap carting around we got a dog. Then another one.. so we're still needing the bigger boot :-/

[Reciprocating mass]

Fresh new Hyundai or rehashed vag product made in 15 different badges topped off with rattle can primer grey, I’ll take the Hyundai thanks plus it looks 10 times nicer has a better warranty and every other car you pass on the road bar an suv won’t be a replicant drone of it

[ZX10R NIN]

rob.e said:

jm28 said:

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

this ^ nail, head etc.

Unfortunately in our household once the kids were beyond that stage where they needed all that crap carting around we got a dog. Then another one.. so we're still needing the bigger boot :-/

I agree but at that point I buy the better steering Mondeo.

Edited by ZX10R NIN on Friday 15th February 20:15

[JuanGandini]

rob.e said:

jm28 said:

Now, consider the situation where you've got a child under the age of six months plus one around 3 - 4 yrs. Not an unusual demographic for the UK. And you have a set, maybe two, of grandparents that live far enough away that you're going to want to stay overnight, maybe monthly. A pram suitable for a newborn would pretty much fill the Golf's boot on its own. Then you've got a travel cot, bedding, maybe a sterilizer, a buggy for the other child, before you get to the rest of your luggage. All of this stuff is bulky, and getting it all to fit into the Hyundai, even if it would fit, is the PITA bit when you're late and the six month old is having a meltdown because it's been in the car seat too long without moving. In the Octavia you just chuck it in and go. So it's a major consideration if you're making a buying decision at that point in your family's life and the needs of your family need to be balanced with those of yourself as an enthusiastic driver.

this ^ nail, head etc.

Unfortunately in our household once the kids were beyond that stage where they needed all that crap carting around we got a dog. Then another one.. so we're still needing the bigger boot :-/

Totally agree with these sentiments. We have a two year old and a baby on the way this spring and with my Octy 245 hatch I've got no worries about fitting a pram, travel cot, bags, moses basket etc. etc. etc. in the car if ever required. I'll be on the lookout for an estate version when my current lease is up next year as it'll have a little more room, looks better than the hatch and I can't be bothered to make life more complicated worrying about whether we'll fit in the car.

For comparison, when our current child was born we had a B9 Audi A4 saloon. We could fit the pushchair in the boot and managed to squeeze luggage in when we went on holiday but it needed serious planning and involved the rear seats being flattened and most of the rear cabin filled with stuff. The Octy hatch has been way easier to carry the same quantity of stuff.

...now I'm off to sip a latte, chomp on a croissant and read the Guardian outside a local retro coffee bar. Am I doing this right?

[R400TVR]

Hot hatches???? These are obviously saloons, the Hyundai even days Fastback on it. A hot hatch is, in these terms the Fabia, Golf etc.

[aaron_2000]

R400TVR said:

Hot hatches???? These are obviously saloons, the Hyundai even days Fastback on it. A hot hatch is, in these terms the Fabia, Golf etc.

Other than the fact the Octavia is a hatchback of course.

[blearyeyedboy]

AlB82 said:

Seems strange reading a review comparing a VRS and an i30N Fastback and the debate is around boot space

Because if boot space were not a significant factor, why would you be buying either?

[havoc]

So the Octavia is better because it has a bigger boot then?!?

If that's the criteria then the fastSuperb Estate is better still. And a Transit better still, if you want me to engage in hyperbole.



In reality, everyone has their own specific requirements...and not many people will NEED close to 600 litres of boot space...while some will choose the more interesting/capable car and accept the boot limitations for the few times a year that it actually matters.

[Trophy Husband]

havoc said:

So the Octavia is better because it has a bigger boot then?!?

If that's the criteria then the fastSuperb Estate is better still. And a Transit better still, if you want me to engage in hyperbole.



In reality, everyone has their own specific requirements...and not many people will NEED close to 600 litres of boot space...while some will choose the more interesting/capable car and accept the boot limitations for the few times a year that it actually matters.

This.
Imagine Top Trumps with these two? How smug would you feel knowing that you have 150 litres more storage! I'd be buzzing! Not.
There seems to be a lot of reverse justification regarding Skoda in general. The nose of the new Octavia looks like some kind of kitchen gadget for preparing vegetables.

The Hyundai on the other hand is the dogs as far as I am concerned.

Edited by Trophy Husband on Sunday 17th February 10:24

[daytonavrs]

I think they are definitely different spectrum cars.....its clear the Hyundai is aimed at more boy racier younger lot to lease maybe?
Octy has been a long time mainstay family/fun car as mentioned.

But that missed the point that many will heavily modify their octys anyway and thanks to reasonable depreciation on 1st ownership can be had decent prices. Same it not true just yet for Hyundais as they are too new.
Mines already 300hp from a 220 owned for quite a few years ( bought for a smidge over £10k with 40 something thou miles) with only a few hundreds of quids thrown at a tuner and is different car to the one reviewed- and its already 5 years old lol

I think these track focussed performance specific aimed cars at younger markets are still pretty niche - so on sales the Oct on heavy discounts or used has a sales edge.
TBH If I wanted to spend IRO £30K on a car I would want a sporty 2nd hand Jag or Nissan or something - neither Octavia or Hyundai would appeal at that price point and I'm a good advocate at Skodas. Mind you only time I bought new recently was my 2006 Fabia vRS which seems a bargain to everything now lol

[blearyeyedboy]

havoc said:

So the Octavia is better because it has a bigger boot then?!?

If that's the criteria then the fastSuperb Estate is better still. And a Transit better still, if you want me to engage in hyperbole.

Hyperbole? You usually write some decent posts, havoc, but you're the one engaging in reductio ad absurdam here.

No one said bigger boot= win. Some have merely said that there may be different points at which people prefer their pleasure/practicality compromise. If your preferred point lies where the Hyundai exists then all power to your arm; it's a very good car. It's not a binary decision and some people have different priories to others. All I'm trying to say is that if practicality plays no role, go and buy a Caterfield.

If it sounds less adversarial, I'd prefer the Hyundai if I didn't need to carry do much. That doesn't mean I'd prefer a Superb or a Transit.