Deltic engine origins surprised me
Discussion
Somehow, at son's parent teacher evening, i went from discussing my boy's progress in physics to trains with his tutor.. which somehow led onto the Deltic and the fact the power plant was actually German in origin stretching back to the the 1932 Junkers Jumo 204 diesel aero engine. I really had no idea about this!
There was a lot of research done on aviation related diesel engines in the 1920s and 30s. They were used on airships because they didn't need an ignition system (sparks and hydrogen don't make a good combination) and they were also used on some German flying boats as diesel fuel was easier to access in ports and harbours or when using mid ocean re-supply ships - as Dornier did when pioneering trans Atlantic flying boat services.
Eric Mc said:
They were used on airships because they didn't need an ignition system (sparks and hydrogen don't make a good combination)
The sparks were irrelevant - the diesel combustion would have ignited a hydrogen-rich atmosphere anyway, it was reliability that they wanted. Cutting out the whole ignition system was a much neater solution at the time. 
kurt535 said:
Somehow, at son's parent teacher evening, i went from discussing my boy's progress in physics to trains with his tutor.. which somehow led onto the Deltic and the fact the power plant was actually German in origin stretching back to the the 1932 Junkers Jumo 204 diesel aero engine. I really had no idea about this!
Sort of.....the 204 is effectively a third of a Deltic, or one side of the triangle.Napier had built the 204 under licence from Junkers before the war, and thus later on came up with the idea of the Deltic, by effectively joining three of them together in a triangle arrangement.
Krikkit said:
Eric Mc said:
They were used on airships because they didn't need an ignition system (sparks and hydrogen don't make a good combination)
The sparks were irrelevant - the diesel combustion would have ignited a hydrogen-rich atmosphere anyway, it was reliability that they wanted. Cutting out the whole ignition system was a much neater solution at the time. Apparently it sort of worked but needed much more development, they stopped work on it when the R101 crashed and they realised that Airships were a bit of a dead end.
andy97 said:
Diamond Aviation built a twin engined light aircraft with 2 Mercedes Benz based diesels based on the 1700cc engine in the original A Class small car, i think.
The Deltic was also used in RN Minewarfare Counter Measures
Vessels. Dont think it was very reliable.
Didn't the New York fire dept use them for a while to power fire pumps?The Deltic was also used in RN Minewarfare Counter Measures
Vessels. Dont think it was very reliable.
andy97 said:
The Deltic was also used in RN Minewarfare Counter Measures
Vessels. Dont think it was very reliable.
A friend in the States fought in Vietnam on Nasty class fast patrol boats. They had two blown Deltics. He never mentions poor reliability in particular. He manned one of the .50 cal guns. Vessels. Dont think it was very reliable.
Another school day. I never realised that the Jumo was the origin of the Deltic!
The Graf Zeppelin used additional gas bags filled with "Blaugas" as a fuel for the engines. It was basically Butane/propane and helped solve the change in buoyancy problem if you used liquid fuel. As the gas was consumed, the bag shrank as air pressure collapsed it with little change in overall weight.The engines could also use petrol. Bit like my LPG Rover !
The Graf Zeppelin used additional gas bags filled with "Blaugas" as a fuel for the engines. It was basically Butane/propane and helped solve the change in buoyancy problem if you used liquid fuel. As the gas was consumed, the bag shrank as air pressure collapsed it with little change in overall weight.The engines could also use petrol. Bit like my LPG Rover !
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