RE: McLaren Grand Tourer: Geneva 2019

[J4CKO]

Mclaren Grand Tourer, does it have seats for three ageing TV car clowns ?

[leakymanifold]

stavers said:

cypriot said:

I don't understand this whole "engine is in the wrong space" argument for a GT. Thats complete tosh. I own an evora, and having the rear seats which you use as a luggage rack (and can fit a full sized suitcase) you would still have the boot and/potential frunk space that mclarens normally have. With those 2 luggage spaces, you have way more usable space than a normal front engined GT, due to the inability of fitting 1 full sized suitcase in the back of something like an Aston Vantage for example.

I think it depends what someone thinks of as a "true" GT car. To me, a GT car is fast, handles well but (more importantly) can carry 4 people with their luggage very comfortably over long distances (OK - maybe not a full compliment of suitcases for a 2 week skiing trip but you get what I mean). I don't believe a 2+2 can fulfill that - don't get me wrong, I am sure that they can do a trip for 2 over a reasonable distance but they're still not a "continent eater" as I would see a GT.

It's probably just personal views on what a GT should be capable of.

Is a Skoda Superb 280 a GT? It's fast, handles okay, comes in L&K luxury form and has loads of space.

[Twoshoe]

Maldini35 said:

Picking me up on the use of apostrophes in a car forum? Really?

Oh, it's all the rage you know. The irony is that his grammar is nothing special, e.g. "they are a plurals not a possessive nouns".

[cypriot]

stavers said:

I think it depends what someone thinks of as a "true" GT car. To me, a GT car is fast, handles well but (more importantly) can carry 4 people with their luggage very comfortably over long distances (OK - maybe not a full compliment of suitcases for a 2 week skiing trip but you get what I mean). I don't believe a 2+2 can fulfill that - don't get me wrong, I am sure that they can do a trip for 2 over a reasonable distance but they're still not a "continent eater" as I would see a GT.

It's probably just personal views on what a GT should be capable of.

Fair enough, but under the "normal" definition of a GT (think Aston martin/bentley continental/ferrari f12 style cars) non of them fit 4 people anyway.

[Maldini35]

Twoshoe said:

Maldini35 said:

Picking me up on the use of apostrophes in a car forum? Really?

Oh, it's all the rage you know. The irony is that his grammar is nothing special, e.g. "they are a plurals not a possessive nouns".

[_Leg_]

stavers said:

Maldini35 said:

_Leg_ said:

mersontheperson said:

_Leg_ said:

So, I own an F12 for touring with the Mrs. I use my 458 Spider when I tour with my mates (which has acres of storage space for 2 blokes).
I'm betting many of us would be in the same situation.

Yep, millions of us. With my private jet, mega yacht, houses all around the world, life is a bh when you have to decide where to go and how to get there.
Life would be so much easier if I was poor again, I am sure everyone on here feels the same

I f*cking hate people that purposefully edit and misquote posts. Tantamount to being liar in my book. Pathetic.

What I actually said in that paragraph.

_Leg_ said:

So, looking at this new GT, I cant see how it has the boot space to take my Mrs, the stuff she packs and more importantly, the stuff she buys as we tour (which I have to allow for when we set off). I'm betting many of us would be in the same situation.

Edited by _Leg_ on Wednesday 6th March 01:42

For what it’s worth I thought your post was spot on and entirely relevant.
It’s good to hear some objective insights from somebody who owns and uses cars like these.

Agreed on both points. Misquoting someone to be a sarcastic tw*t is neither big nor clever.

Obviously I would love to be in the same position as _Leg_ but I never will be so it's nice to hear how someone's thought process in that situation works. Don't let someone's jealousy put you off from posting.

Thanks both.

No one ever posted anything arsey when I had market stall after leaving school at 16, nor when I was doing 70 hour weeks for 20 years or gambling my family home to buy the business I worked for. Funny eh. Also, it's Pistonheads and this is a thread about a supercar, if you cant talk supercars here, where can you?

With regards to this thread though, all I was saying is that I think it would be difficult to make a GT that you could genuinely tour in (i.e. 3 weeks round Europe moving from hotel to hotel with max 2 night stays) with your partner due to luggage space requirements ranging from what you both want to take, to what you buy on route which is part of touring. I hope McLaren have done something clever and cracked it though. There isn't much innovation coming out of the supercar manufacturers right now IMO, just more of the same with extra power we don't need, tech that does bugger all in real life and new body panels.

In my humble opinion it's hard to see the benefit in moving from previous generations of supercars into the latest at the moment so if McLaren have finally done something different, i.e. made a mid engined GT that can genuinely be used as a GT in the contexts I mention above, then well done them and I'll be visiting a dealer.

If it's just another mid engined supercar like the ones we've seen before with a GT badge, then it's nothing new. You can already happily tour in a 360, 430, 458, 488, Gallardo, 570S, 720S etc etc if you pack lightly. Hell, I've toured in my S3 Exige Sport with my son and we were fine and that has less luggage space than a hamster's posing pouch. If, big if, I could convince my wife to get in the Exige I would need a trailer for her bags.

Edited by _Leg_ on Wednesday 6th March 20:19

[mersontheperson]

I apologize Leg

I misread your post as one of those complaining whilst really bragging posts. Appreciate now that you never meant it like that and I am sincerely sorry

[Venturist]

mersontheperson said:

I apologize Leg

I misread your post as one of those complaining whilst really bragging posts. Appreciate now that you never meant it like that and I am sincerely sorry

Assuming that wasn’t sarcasm (hard to tell with text), bravo for that post. Many wouldn’t have had the balls to say that.

[_Leg_]

mersontheperson said:

I apologize Leg

I misread your post as one of those complaining whilst really bragging posts. Appreciate now that you never meant it like that and I am sincerely sorry

Absolutely no problem. I'm particularly (probably overly!) sensitive to comments like that mate as I'm absolutely car mad so car stuff is just car stuff to me, not cock waving, and I also pride myself on being absolutely grounded and not snooty about having a bit of success so I apologise for over reacting a bit too. I should have just explained what I meant. fking internet eh. ;-)

It is a tricky path to walk. I'm bubbling over with enthusiasm for cars and subsequently I have opinions on them and like to talk about them. Since I acquired a few cars it's become tricky to talk about it without thinking people will assume I'm a tt. So, it is understandable that you said what you said as many people do think that owning a supercar makes them super. It doesn't.

If you're ever in the York/Leeds area PM me. Kettle is always on.

Edited by _Leg_ on Thursday 7th March 01:57

[mersontheperson]

_Leg_ said:

mersontheperson said:

I'm particularly (probably overly!) sensitive to comments like that

Edited by _Leg_ on Thursday 7th March 01:57

Nah! I was just being a dick

You are a decent fellow, and if you ever come to Tokyo I will take out for some great sushi and sake, and we can check out the pretty awesome car scene here.
Then you can give me some advice on how to drum up the courage to escape from the corporate world of bullst, and how to convince my wife to take the plunge and go out on my own.
And turn that kettle off, it’s bad for the environment to keep it on all the time

[stavers]

mersontheperson said:

_Leg_ said:

mersontheperson said:

I'm particularly (probably overly!) sensitive to comments like that

Edited by _Leg_ on Thursday 7th March 01:57

Nah! I was just being a dick

You are a decent fellow, and if you ever come to Tokyo I will take out for some great sushi and sake, and we can check out the pretty awesome car scene here.
Then you can give me some advice on how to drum up the courage to escape from the corporate world of bullst, and how to convince my wife to take the plunge and go out on my own.
And turn that kettle off, it’s bad for the environment to keep it on all the time

Good man. My faith in humanity has just been restored somewhat.

[_Leg_]

mersontheperson said:

_Leg_ said:

mersontheperson said:

I'm particularly (probably overly!) sensitive to comments like that

Edited by _Leg_ on Thursday 7th March 01:57

Nah! I was just being a dick

You are a decent fellow, and if you ever come to Tokyo I will take out for some great sushi and sake, and we can check out the pretty awesome car scene here.
Then you can give me some advice on how to drum up the courage to escape from the corporate world of bullst, and how to convince my wife to take the plunge and go out on my own.
And turn that kettle off, it’s bad for the environment to keep it on all the time

Lol. Not at all.

I went to Japan in '17. Toured round. Did Tokyo, the highlands, Hiroshima, Kyoto etc. Kyoto was my favourite, it felt the most Japanese (coming from a first time visitor).

TBH I didn't have any courage starting the business, it was driven more by being so completely pissed off with working for other people and the frustration of their idiocy I didn't care about the consequences of getting it wrong anymore. A "fk it" moment if you will. I don't believe in luck but I'll use the word this one time, I was lucky that my wife just said, "If you think it's the right thing to do, do it". Which at the time was a minor conversation in my mind but given the kids were 7 and 9 and at the time she was a Nurse, it wasn't.

I've been watching Geneva videos. That new mid engined Aston looks great. The production one (The others are waaaaay too much £££).

[DeejRC]

Leggy...you sound just the chap I need to chat with!

What is the Frunk/luggage'ability like on your middie donkeys?
I have a 4C coupe, I regard it as the essence of Lancia distilled into modern form and as such the closest thing to God since Stanley Mathews. Given that my wife regarded a previous Integrale of mine as a petrol fume smelling ugly piece of tin, you can imagine her opinion of going anywhere beyond 2 miles in the 4C.

The other side of the fence is our Cayenne, which unfortunately is disgustingly good at hauling you, luggage, dogs, anything, anywhere - because lets face it, who actually wants to take the wife away for a weekend somewhere nice in a diesel dog hauler, no matter how V8'y it is?

So - I have been considering mid engined, drop top motors with some flair, that could take her and muggins off somewhere nice at weekends. Like yourself - and I presume most blokes with wives - this wonderful "playboy chap about town" ideal comes up against the cold hard reality of luggage. Namely - hers.

So, what are your thoughts on such things as 360s and 430s with respect to the boring practical things of the above?

[GranCab]

Maldini35 said:

Twoshoe said:

Maldini35 said:

Picking me up on the use of apostrophes in a car forum? Really?

Oh, it's all the rage you know. The irony is that his grammar is nothing special, e.g. "they are a plurals not a possessive nouns".

I was slightly inebriated when I wrote that post ... what's your excuse ?

Apart from envy and ignorance ... ?

[_Leg_]

DeejRC said:

Leggy...you sound just the chap I need to chat with!

What is the Frunk/luggage'ability like on your middie donkeys?
I have a 4C coupe, I regard it as the essence of Lancia distilled into modern form and as such the closest thing to God since Stanley Mathews. Given that my wife regarded a previous Integrale of mine as a petrol fume smelling ugly piece of tin, you can imagine her opinion of going anywhere beyond 2 miles in the 4C.

The other side of the fence is our Cayenne, which unfortunately is disgustingly good at hauling you, luggage, dogs, anything, anywhere - because lets face it, who actually wants to take the wife away for a weekend somewhere nice in a diesel dog hauler, no matter how V8'y it is?

So - I have been considering mid engined, drop top motors with some flair, that could take her and muggins off somewhere nice at weekends. Like yourself - and I presume most blokes with wives - this wonderful "playboy chap about town" ideal comes up against the cold hard reality of luggage. Namely - hers.

So, what are your thoughts on such things as 360s and 430s with respect to the boring practical things of the above?

I can only speak of the 458's capacity (Spider) but I guess they're all similar. It'll take 3 mid sized holdalls behind the seats easily and two 'cabin baggage' size wheely cases in the boot stood up along with say a suit bag on top and a couple of soft bags (Euro roadside kit, camera gear kind of stuff).

It wont fit a proper holiday case (the 22-25kg type) anywhere. When I tour with friends we generally go Hull to Rotterdam and then do 2 weeks round Europe. When I tour with Mrs Leg I'll go Hull to Rotterdam and then down to Bergamo airport or similar and pick her up. She travels with just her handbag, I take everything else. We then do 2 weeks touring before she flies back and I drive back. 2 weeks away means a full size holiday case for all her stuff. Also means I can take my time (usually 4-5 days down and the same back up) enjoying the Alps or Dolomites, car museums etc and the car without her tutting next to me.

If anyone is planning a Euro trip, with a partner or with friends, I'm more than happy to respond to PMs with routes, hotels etc that I have been on/to.

Cars wise I've tried and struggled to get into McLarens. I've had a couple on loan and just not bitten. But, as Ferrari continue to simply copy them with blown V8s (they really need to produce something revolutionary now IMO to maintain their position as the market leader) and the price of McLarens such as the 600LT, 720s and 570s are currently at 'no brainer' levels it's hard to ignore them.

Whilst I simply cant part with my F12 nor 458 Spider for anything out there (I have a fear that I'll deeply regret it if I do) I have to say that if I was first time buying I would be seriously tempted by a 600LT and/or 720s. In many ways if the 720s Spider follows the pricing path the 720s has then waiting a few months for a used one of those, well specced, would be hard to beat. I'm ignoring any servicing and residual considerations there, just taking those cars as cars to buy, keep and use.

I'm off to Geneva tomorrow for a few days and the only things I'm interested in finding out about are the mid engined Aston (the affordable one) simply because it's new and interesting and not just more of the same and also the McLaren GT.

Hope that helps. Blathered on a bit, sorry.

Edited by _Leg_ on Saturday 9th March 18:44

[DeejRC]

Fine reply Leggy, ta muchly Great info on the luggage ability! The motor wouldnt be for anything like 2 weeks of touring Europe, just decent weekends away.

What did you think of the middie Astons in Geneve?

[justin220]

If McLaren come up with something 2+2 it could be a great GT car.

Similar in size, I did quite a bit of touring in my 2+2 Evora, and the back seats being useless for humans, were brilliant for luggage. We regularly took two airport suitcases on the back seat, and still had the boot for extra space

[Caviar]

mclaren business model is to make as much models as possible with the least cost possible using the same parts bin available and play around with the profit margin for which will be expensive and not as expensive with different state of tune on nearly the same parts..one of the reasons why manufacturers love turbocharging

[jayemm89]

The Evora was certainly a superb GT car, "despite" the mid-engined layout.

However I think McLaren should have made this front engined, if for no other reason than to clearly differentiate it from their other models.

People will no doubt come out and point out how many versions of the 911 there are, but the key difference is Porsche are not trying to fool anyone, and call a GT3 something other than a 911.

[Civpilot]

Even in camo colours I am loving that rear end now the cladding is off.

And if the current trend in chassis development they are having is continued then I wouldn't bet against this car being pretty damn good on the road