RE: BMW M4 CS (F82) meets BMW M3 CS (E46)

[MBeemerman]

Yes It is, both great cars !

[Alpinestars]

Gus265 said:

M button just turns off DSC and I already have a button for that. It’s just not called the M button. Then press Sport and away I track go.

I think it’s safe to say the QF might be a lot of things but how can it possibly be overrated?! I think it’s had quite a lot of unfair stick given to it!
It’s an amazing car. And that’s coming from a BMW M fan.

Not quite. It’s a halfway house between on and off. Allows more slip, but DSC is still on.

It’s overrated on many fronts. Brakes are awful, suspension not good, diff very inconsistent, driving modes make no sense, eg you can only get into the raciest mode, which is the only mode that doesn’t upshift at stupidly low revs, if you want traction control off. Totally incoherent car.

[172]

five50 said:

Lol - drive one with the latest software and then share your view.

Quoted for irony

Maybe irony is the wrong word

Made me laugh anyway

[f1ten]

Agreed my 2016 car I would say is pretty resolved. It’s totally standard and I mainly drive on A roads and B roads. I certainly prefer smoother tarmac but it can make serious progress. I’ve done 11000 miles in mine and I drive it quickly. I’m well aware how easily it can overcome the rear wheels especially in damn surfaces so I drive it appropriately.

I’ve driven a comp twice (once on track) and a cs also at Bedford track.
I certainly didn’t walk away thinking I need a comp pack car over my standard car.

The CS certainly has some more power and I would expect with those tyres that it has more turn in and grip. The front end certainly turned in quickly and accurately.

I actually would buy a 62k light used CS. It’s fair money for that car which is why the 86k list price was a total joke. Hopefully no one paid that for the car.

Note a fairy basic c63s coupe is now 80k without blinking.
Car prices are mad now and I certainly wouldn’t spend that on a c class or m4.

Wills2 said:

The F82 must be completely different to drive than the F80 then as I never noticed any issues other than the fact that 430hp through just the rear wheels dictates when you apply the throttle and when you don't (just like all power rwd cars).

The car was a wonderful drive and easy to make very quick progress in across all types of road.

[f1ten]

Agreed my 2016 car I would say is pretty resolved. It’s totally standard and I mainly drive on A roads and B roads. I certainly prefer smoother tarmac but it can make serious progress. I’ve done 11000 miles in mine and I drive it quickly. I’m well aware how easily it can overcome the rear wheels especially in damn surfaces so I drive it appropriately.

I’ve driven a comp twice (once on track) and a cs also at Bedford track.
I certainly didn’t walk away thinking I need a comp pack car over my standard car.

The CS certainly has some more power and I would expect with those tyres that it has more turn in and grip. The front end certainly turned in quickly and accurately.

I actually would buy a 62k light used CS. It’s fair money for that car which is why the 86k list price was a total joke. Hopefully no one paid that for the car.

Note a fairy basic c63s coupe is now 80k without blinking.
Car prices are mad now and I certainly wouldn’t spend that on a c class or m4.

Wills2 said:

The F82 must be completely different to drive than the F80 then as I never noticed any issues other than the fact that 430hp through just the rear wheels dictates when you apply the throttle and when you don't (just like all power rwd cars).

The car was a wonderful drive and easy to make very quick progress in across all types of road.

[Kawasicki]

Julian Thompson said:

Kawasicki said:

Nimerino said:

It always seem to me that reviewers endlessly rationalise the damn-near dangerous handling traits of the F82, and the trend seems only to have become more prominent since the release of the CS gave it an aura of being ‘special’. It’s not, it’s a tarted-up marketing exercise. Nothing of genuine worth was transferred from the GTS and the price is a joke.

Being unable to handle the torque through the rear wheels at lateral load on anything other than marble-smooth roads (and the utter unpredictability of the behaviour) aren’t exciting traits, they’re potentially catastrophic. How did we get to the point where the inability to trust a car’s kinematics became a desirable trait? And if the CS is so much better-resolved, given pretty much identical suspension hardware, why didn’t the standard cars receive the same treatment? The answer certainly isn’t £27k worth of anything.

I agree. The F82 is most disappointing car I’ve driven. Crap is not good, it’s crap.

That’s really interesting that you see the car in such a negative way. Was it the handling or the noise or something else that turned you off? Which iterations of the car did you try and can you recall if you felt the same about all of them?

Handling, specifically the lack of grip consistency at the rear.

I drove two, one f80 built maybe 6 months after production started, the other was an f82 built in 2017, I think!

[TobyTR]

Alpinestars said:

Gus265 said:

M button just turns off DSC and I already have a button for that. It’s just not called the M button. Then press Sport and away I track go.

I think it’s safe to say the QF might be a lot of things but how can it possibly be overrated?! I think it’s had quite a lot of unfair stick given to it!
It’s an amazing car. And that’s coming from a BMW M fan.

Not quite. It’s a halfway house between on and off. Allows more slip, but DSC is still on.

It’s overrated on many fronts. Brakes are awful, suspension not good, diff very inconsistent, driving modes make no sense, eg you can only get into the raciest mode, which is the only mode that doesn’t upshift at stupidly low revs, if you want traction control off. Totally incoherent car.

Giulia's brakes take a while to adjust, but not exactly terrible. Suspension better than my F80 M3 CP, imo. And I found the driving modes perfectly fine - in day-to-day traffic just left it in 'A' mode, then when I wanted to press on simply flicked it into Race mode and used the lovely paddles in manual mode - change gear how you please, job done. Actually, I went most places in Race/manual mode. And it was so good it will replace my F80 CP next year

[Julian Thompson]

Kawasicki said:

Julian Thompson said:

Kawasicki said:

Nimerino said:

It always seem to me that reviewers endlessly rationalise the damn-near dangerous handling traits of the F82, and the trend seems only to have become more prominent since the release of the CS gave it an aura of being ‘special’. It’s not, it’s a tarted-up marketing exercise. Nothing of genuine worth was transferred from the GTS and the price is a joke.

Being unable to handle the torque through the rear wheels at lateral load on anything other than marble-smooth roads (and the utter unpredictability of the behaviour) aren’t exciting traits, they’re potentially catastrophic. How did we get to the point where the inability to trust a car’s kinematics became a desirable trait? And if the CS is so much better-resolved, given pretty much identical suspension hardware, why didn’t the standard cars receive the same treatment? The answer certainly isn’t £27k worth of anything.

I agree. The F82 is most disappointing car I’ve driven. Crap is not good, it’s crap.

That’s really interesting that you see the car in such a negative way. Was it the handling or the noise or something else that turned you off? Which iterations of the car did you try and can you recall if you felt the same about all of them?

Handling, specifically the lack of grip consistency at the rear.

I drove two, one f80 built maybe 6 months after production started, the other was an f82 built in 2017, I think!

Thanks for that - I really do wonder about the reason why we have such a polarising view. Still it makes for interesting thought.

[Alpinestars]

TobyTR said:

Giulia's brakes take a while to adjust, but not exactly terrible. Suspension better than my F80 M3 CP, imo. And I found the driving modes perfectly fine - in day-to-day traffic just left it in 'A' mode, then when I wanted to press on simply flicked it into Race mode and used the lovely paddles in manual mode - change gear how you please, job done. Actually, I went most places in Race/manual mode. And it was so good it will replace my F80 CP next year

Different folks different strokes. Looked great, but that was about it for me. The F80 is not a great car either, but much better than the Alfa imv.

[Chrism4s2000]

The price always get’s mentioned, I paid M4 comp money for a pre reg CS and they have dropped in value again since. I’ve owned an early M4 and a comp pack, I thought I’d finished with them but after driving a CS I would agree it just feels right. Just hope the depreciation stops 😳

[MatLock]

You can get an M8 for that money - game over, and you don't look like every other wanabee either,