RE: How do you solve a problem like Evija
Discussion
Electric motors are fantastic, the current (and possibly insurmountable) limitations of batteries are a problem for weight, cost and convenience.
I’d like to see a high performance hydrogen fuel cell demonstrator.
That way you prove the concept of motors, leave the battery tech until such time as it is viable and potentially save a few hundred kg.
That is of course assuming a fuel cell and hydrogen tank come in at less than a battery in terms of weight.
I’d like to see a high performance hydrogen fuel cell demonstrator.
That way you prove the concept of motors, leave the battery tech until such time as it is viable and potentially save a few hundred kg.
That is of course assuming a fuel cell and hydrogen tank come in at less than a battery in terms of weight.
GingerNinja said:
GranCab said:
5p / mile ? .... yeah sure it will ....
70KWh battery back costs about £3.50 to charge at home if you’re on a 5p per KW deal - achievable with Octopus energy.That’ll get you 250 miles according to Lotus, but let’s say 200.
That’s 2p per mile.
What about tyres and other consumables, servicing etc ? ( ... and don't pretend EVs don't need any of this )
I don't think "fuel" cost per mile is the first thing owners of Hyper EVs think about when making their purchasing decisions.
It's £2m. It's completely unattainable. It's not even especially ground breaking. You can't go away in it because there's nowhere to put a small soft bag. It only goes at full chat long enough to do one lap of the 'ring. If it does get built hardly any will be driven. All this hyper car stuff is hyper impractical and hyper boring.
Meanwhile Corvette are knocking out 6.2l V8 500bhp mid engined supercars (with luggage space) for $60k. That's exciting.
Meanwhile Corvette are knocking out 6.2l V8 500bhp mid engined supercars (with luggage space) for $60k. That's exciting.
LotusOmega375D said:
Strange article.
I think the only problem the writer should have with the Evija is that it doesn’t actually rhyme with Maria.
Lol.I think the only problem the writer should have with the Evija is that it doesn’t actually rhyme with Maria.
But in seriousness, is Dan suggesting that companies should never do anything until future tech is sufficiently mature?
Trouble with that approach is who decides? It's like having kids, if you wait until you think you're ready then you'd never do anything.
I think this is the best article I’ve read on PH in a long time. It sums up exactly how I feel about the Evija. I’m glad they re building it and I love some of the styling and details, but I’d be so much more excited by a new Esprit or an electric Elise.
Hopefully the Evija is a statement of design direction and these are to come.
Imagine an Esprit that was like a BMW i8 but better, it’s got more historical right to have a small four pot hybrid than any other Supercar, having had one for most of its production run.
And then imagine a Tesla Roadster, but actually built by Lotus and brought up to date, with a carbon composite tub replacing its wonderful but old tech bonded aluminium chassis.
Lotus have the potential to take on the world, building the best lightweight sports cars to attainable supercars around. Hypercars make nice desktops but they’re kind of irrelevant.
I want Lotus to build a car that makes me want to save up and buy a new car, a pure, lightweight driving machine, but one for the 2020s.
Hopefully the Evija is a statement of design direction and these are to come.
Imagine an Esprit that was like a BMW i8 but better, it’s got more historical right to have a small four pot hybrid than any other Supercar, having had one for most of its production run.
And then imagine a Tesla Roadster, but actually built by Lotus and brought up to date, with a carbon composite tub replacing its wonderful but old tech bonded aluminium chassis.
Lotus have the potential to take on the world, building the best lightweight sports cars to attainable supercars around. Hypercars make nice desktops but they’re kind of irrelevant.
I want Lotus to build a car that makes me want to save up and buy a new car, a pure, lightweight driving machine, but one for the 2020s.
scottydoesntknow said:
It's £2m. It's completely unattainable. It's not even especially ground breaking. You can't go away in it because there's nowhere to put a small soft bag. It only goes at full chat long enough to do one lap of the 'ring. If it does get built hardly any will be driven. All this hyper car stuff is hyper impractical and hyper boring.
If you have the money for one of these, you will have staff to organise luggage.If you have the money for one of these, I suspect only being able to do one lap at a time of the Nurburgring is not something that will inform your purchasing decision.
Author wonders if the car is too fast.
Also wonders if a bruiser is the right course for Lotus.
It’s not ‘too fast’ any more than the F40 was or the Veyron is. That’s just something to write about.
Is it the right way for Lotus?
Well for 60 years they have been ‘adding lightness’ and getting precious little kudos for it and not making any money.
So I would argue that another approach might be worth a go.
Also wonders if a bruiser is the right course for Lotus.
It’s not ‘too fast’ any more than the F40 was or the Veyron is. That’s just something to write about.
Is it the right way for Lotus?
Well for 60 years they have been ‘adding lightness’ and getting precious little kudos for it and not making any money.
So I would argue that another approach might be worth a go.
"Machines like the Lotus Evija represent a quantum leap in road car performance at a time when they're already too fast. They move us inexorably to a point where performance cars are defined not by how fun they are to drive nor by how cohesive they feel dynamically, but by how quickly they accelerate. It's just daft."
I'm sad to say that this point was reached long ago. Every modern hot hatch i can think of has become more isolated from the driving experience than their predecessors, each new super saloon the same. Faster, but heavier and dulled by the pursuit of power and speed. Look at the current BMW stable, for example. A new M5 is far heavier than an E34, or E39, but in order to increase the performance, they add bigger engines, but decrease the fun. Honda Civic Types R are the same.
Sadly, it's another step towards the obsolescence of the driver and the fun car.
I'm sad to say that this point was reached long ago. Every modern hot hatch i can think of has become more isolated from the driving experience than their predecessors, each new super saloon the same. Faster, but heavier and dulled by the pursuit of power and speed. Look at the current BMW stable, for example. A new M5 is far heavier than an E34, or E39, but in order to increase the performance, they add bigger engines, but decrease the fun. Honda Civic Types R are the same.
Sadly, it's another step towards the obsolescence of the driver and the fun car.
All the hypercar EV’s are pointless, and mark my words when the politicians get hold of them they’ll be heavily legislated. It could be the beginning of the end for speeding completely.
How can a vehicle which is so much quicker be allowed on the roads, the level of driving ability required to use the performance is far in above mere mortals.
I guess we are a good few years away from ‘affordable’ EV with decent range and fast charging. Even further from one with any kind of driving enjoyment or character.
How can a vehicle which is so much quicker be allowed on the roads, the level of driving ability required to use the performance is far in above mere mortals.
I guess we are a good few years away from ‘affordable’ EV with decent range and fast charging. Even further from one with any kind of driving enjoyment or character.
I think this whole electric hypercar thing is already going in the wrong direction. Electric cars are appliances, they haven’t got a soul but they drive great.
A 2000bhp electric hypercar still has no soul but can go really fast really quick, but can it do anything else?
I feel like manufacturers should be working on making electric cars more emotive, I’m yet to see a new electric sports/super/hyper car launched that gets me excited.
Lotus need to do a big showcase model just to prove they can, but I can’t help but feel that it will be a flop. Whose going to buy an electric hypercar?
A 2000bhp electric hypercar still has no soul but can go really fast really quick, but can it do anything else?
I feel like manufacturers should be working on making electric cars more emotive, I’m yet to see a new electric sports/super/hyper car launched that gets me excited.
Lotus need to do a big showcase model just to prove they can, but I can’t help but feel that it will be a flop. Whose going to buy an electric hypercar?
Blah blah blah...
Lotus are building this because they can and it gets headlines.
Its entirely possible to build a stripped down fast lightweight ev, go look at ev west's m3 conversion.
https://youtu.be/pHaqiWcWSIc
Or this..
https://youtu.be/B8bV8SKeQOo
But there's obviously no market for it at the moment might as well build this instead
Lotus are building this because they can and it gets headlines.
Its entirely possible to build a stripped down fast lightweight ev, go look at ev west's m3 conversion.
https://youtu.be/pHaqiWcWSIc
Or this..
https://youtu.be/B8bV8SKeQOo
But there's obviously no market for it at the moment might as well build this instead
Edited by RobDickinson on Monday 22 July 07:23
An M3 with a range of 50 miles, how practical.
It’s so utterly pointless having huge torque numbers and being unable to use them. Both of the above sum up all that’s wrong with EV. Give me the straight 6 any day of the week.
In 40 years we won’t be going to Silverstone classic to watch EV
It’s so utterly pointless having huge torque numbers and being unable to use them. Both of the above sum up all that’s wrong with EV. Give me the straight 6 any day of the week.
In 40 years we won’t be going to Silverstone classic to watch EV
Whilst cars like this may seem pointless, and destined to end up in the hands of a few wealthy collectors, rarely being seen in the open, I also think they are a very necessary evil.
History has shown that technology only advances if it is pushed to its limits. Thats what these cars do, they push current EV tech to its limits, and by doing so they drag along with them the capabilities of the mas produced PV car that the majoity of PH readers will end up buying.
Look at KERS in F1 when it was first introduced, and where it is now.
Look at Formula E when it first started, two cars needed to finish a race. Now they can do it with one.
Thanks to cars like the Evija and the Rimac, in 5-10 years basic EV cars will have the range and the recharging capabilities to make them usable in everyday situations.
History has shown that technology only advances if it is pushed to its limits. Thats what these cars do, they push current EV tech to its limits, and by doing so they drag along with them the capabilities of the mas produced PV car that the majoity of PH readers will end up buying.
Look at KERS in F1 when it was first introduced, and where it is now.
Look at Formula E when it first started, two cars needed to finish a race. Now they can do it with one.
Thanks to cars like the Evija and the Rimac, in 5-10 years basic EV cars will have the range and the recharging capabilities to make them usable in everyday situations.
Sure, it's pointless in terms of performance and price but almost any supercar these days is. You could say the same about a 720S or 488. Both stupid fast, expensive and less enjoyable because of it. But I don't see any journalist ranting you'd be better off buying a 911 or Evora instead.
So why now?
It's a technical tour the force that blows anything else in or outside the segment off the table. And let's not forget it's still remarkably lighter than a Chiron for example.
So why now?
It's a technical tour the force that blows anything else in or outside the segment off the table. And let's not forget it's still remarkably lighter than a Chiron for example.
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