RE: Audi S1 | Spotted

RE: Audi S1 | Spotted

Author
Discussion

dibblecorse

5,091 posts

137 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
thiscocks said:
So a Ford Focus ST isn't a 'premium product'. What a load o' bks.
I'd have one of those over this if they did a decent auto .....

the_hood

418 posts

139 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
thiscocks said:
So a Ford Focus ST isn't a 'premium product'. What a load o' bks.
As good as the ST is, it's not a 'premium product'. I don't think that's much of an issue for most people.

thiscocks

2,033 posts

140 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Not sure what the definition of a 'premium product' car is then. Does it just have to be German?

Chestrockwell

1,854 posts

102 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
thiscocks said:
Not sure what the definition of a 'premium product' car is then. Does it just have to be German?
I’ve been in my friends 2017 Focus ST Line a few times and while it doesn’t have the ST engine, it has everything else and I agree that it isn’t a premium product.

I think Ford also know this as they’re offering the ‘Vignale’ (or whatever it’s called) trim for people after a more upmarket version.

VeeFource

928 posts

122 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
I could understand the negative criticisism for this car a bit more if it weren't so easy to address:

Sloppy gear change - Shim the linkage with metal tape (£5)

Overly light gear change - Quick shifter (£200)

Exhausts give away the Q car appeal - Remove the large chrome tips and paint the pipes black. Still looks nice but is barely noticeable in the uk gloom.

Poor steering feel - Change to dynamic steering in all driver modes with VCDS which is much more feelsome (~£400). And is any modern electric system really much better (Fiesta ST included)?

Ok the VCDS isn't cheap but it allows you to customise and diagnose your (and any other VWAG) car to the same level a franchised garage can do so, so is money well spent.

As for the sensible on the limit handling I'd argue it's incredibly well balanced and do you really need a tail happy car on the road? It will play to an extent but the huge amount of extra grip you get in the wet more than makes up for this on a road car.

I know modifying any car is missing the point of a fair comparison but it's so easy to do and you end up with the ultimate B section hot hatch which is still relatively standard.

Edited by VeeFource on Monday 9th September 18:10

RacerMike

2,446 posts

156 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
VeeFource said:
I could understand the negative criticisism for this car a bit more if it weren't so easy to address:

Sloppy gear change - Shim the linkage with metal tape (£5)

Overly light gear change - Quick shifter (£200)

Exhausts give away the Q car appeal - Remove the large chrome tips and paint the pipes black. Still looks nice but is barely noticeable in the uk gloom.

Poor steering feel - Change to dynamic steering in all driver modes with VCDS which is much more feelsome (~£400). And is any modern electric system really much better (Fiesta ST included)?

Ok the VCDS isn't cheap but it allows you to customise and diagnose your (and any other VWAG) car to the same level a franchised garage can do so, so is money well spent.

As for the sensible on the limit handling I'd argue it's incredibly well balanced and do you really need a tail happy car on the road? It will play to an extent but the huge amount of extra grip you get in the wet more than makes up for this on a road car.

I know modifying any car is missing the point of a fair comparison but it's so easy to do and you end up with the ultimate B section hot hatch which is still relatively standard.

Edited by VeeFource on Monday 9th September 18:10
Massively missing the point. You can turn pretty much any crap car into a good one if you understand vehicle dynamics and have a fat wallet.

I get why people buy them. They’re an Audi, and they’re 4WD. Objectively though the S1 isn’t comparable in handling to quite a lot of other cars in its class. Audi’s engineers know their market, and set their cars up to be safe and grippy. It’s absolutely fine if that’s the kind of car you want, but it’s not an engaging drivers car even with a load of artificial weight added into the steering cal...

VeeFource

928 posts

122 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
RacerMike said:
Massively missing the point. You can turn pretty much any crap car into a good one if you understand vehicle dynamics and have a fat wallet.

I get why people buy them. They’re an Audi, and they’re 4WD. Objectively though the S1 isn’t comparable in handling to quite a lot of other cars in its class. Audi’s engineers know their market, and set their cars up to be safe and grippy. It’s absolutely fine if that’s the kind of car you want, but it’s not an engaging drivers car even with a load of artificial weight added into the steering cal...
Fat wallet? It's not a cheap car to begin with granted but it should at least do well with depreciation and the mods I've mentioned are a few hundred quid. I had also considered an M135i but the consensus is they need an LSD, M4 lower wishbones and an exhaust to make them a decent drivers car. That's many thousands of pounds so I think my point of the S1 being cheap to change into a PH worth daily still stands. Albeit if you value capability over adjustability which is personal preference as you point out.

For the record, I couldn't give two hoots about the Audi thing either. My last car was a Suzuki!

Edited by VeeFource on Monday 9th September 19:01

Elatino1

337 posts

6 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
A friend had one of these, the interior I would say was less "premium" than a Focus and the steering and gearbox as well as the dampening of the suspension were absolutely diabolical.

The only person that could defend these are ones that do not value/know good dynamics or just wants something small and surefooted but cares not a jot about dynamics.

Fine for Mrs Miggins to pop to the shop in but it's not a drivers car in any way shape or form.

Edited by Elatino1 on Monday 9th September 19:45

MyV10goesWhaaa

264 posts

38 months

Monday 9th September
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Shappers24 said:
Shame to hear the negative feedback about this, the S1 was top of my test drive list for replacement of my ageing mini in the new year.
This is PH!!!

Do not let them put you off.... Go drive one and make your own mind up... Im guessing your going to love it based on and relative to your "ageing" Mini...

They are personally not for me (would be something from the class up) but i can see the appeal and they would be great fun with a map, brake kit and full exhaust...

Great little cars for there current 2nd hand price...

Gorbyrev

1,037 posts

99 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
MyV10goesWhaaa said:
This is PH!!!

Do not let them put you off.... Go drive one and make your own mind up... Im guessing your going to love it based on and relative to your "ageing" Mini...

They are personally not for me (would be something from the class up) but i can see the appeal and they would be great fun with a map, brake kit and full exhaust...

Great little cars for there current 2nd hand price...
Second that. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion but based on my driving experience which includes everything from Caterhams, through Fiesta ST, GT86 to 911 GT3s. The S1 is a proper drivers car that is well set up and never fails to put a smile on my face. Watch Henry Catchpole's Evo vid on YouTube, he's not wrong. It's a cracking hot hatch with big car abilities.


Edited by Gorbyrev on Monday 9th September 20:18


Edited by Gorbyrev on Monday 9th September 21:01

Maldini35

2,150 posts

133 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Elatino1 said:
A friend had one of these, the interior I would say was less "premium" than a Focus and the steering and gearbox as well as the dampening of the suspension were absolutely diabolical.

The only person that could defend these are ones that do not value/know good dynamics or just wants something small and surefooted but cares not a jot about dynamics.

Fine for Mrs Miggins to pop to the shop in but it's not a drivers car in any way shape or form.

Edited by Elatino1 on Monday 9th September 19:45
I enjoyed my S1.
Pretty sure I’m not Mrs Miggins.
Perhaps you and your friend aren’t the experts you think?
wink





ali27

9 posts

130 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Ay caramba said:
"Audi is a premium product"
"Brand desirability"

Audi has never made anything to justify those two statements, not even the R8, which is a boring Gallardo.

I already spot many 'premium items' in this S1 that are fitted to the Seat Ibiza. Does that make the Ibiza a premium product? Or are we just talking about a few plastic interior mould differences? Marketing is an amazing thing.

And I'm sorry but Audi have not sorted the drive on this, or any other Audi for that matter, I've driven both 3dr and 5dr through work and they are st. I'd rather have the Ford, or even the Seat which manages to handle better despite being on the same platform.
For those who can remember it, Audi is trying to live of the legacy of the Audi Quattro Sport which people desired and dreamed about. This is as close to the Sport as the Sun is to Pluto. It's just another warmish Euro supermini not a fire breathing beast from hell which I always think of when I hear the words Audi Quattro.

EpsomJames

759 posts

191 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Elatino1 said:
A friend had one of these, the interior I would say was less "premium" than a Focus and the steering and gearbox as well as the dampening of the suspension were absolutely diabolical.

The only person that could defend these are ones that do not value/know good dynamics or just wants something small and surefooted but cares not a jot about dynamics.

Fine for Mrs Miggins to pop to the shop in but it's not a drivers car in any way shape or form.

Edited by Elatino1 on Monday 9th September 19:45
I don't agree.

The interior when spec'ed with the Quattro Interior Pack I think is rather nice, definitely more premium than a Focus ST of the same age (things of course move on). It would be difficult to describe the steering as diabolical, the worst you could say is lacking in feeling. The gearshift I don't have any issue with and the ride is just about perfect in Auto, perhaps a touch on the firm side in Dynamic but definitely not as harsh as a Fiesta ST.

I'm not sure what your definition of "good dynamics" is but I've owned and enjoyed a few cars that are regarded as driver's cars, yet I still rate the Audi S1 as good fun to hustle along.

VeeFource

928 posts

122 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
ali27 said:
For those who can remember it, Audi is trying to live of the legacy of the Audi Quattro Sport which people desired and dreamed about. This is as close to the Sport as the Sun is to Pluto. It's just another warmish Euro supermini not a fire breathing beast from hell which I always think of when I hear the words Audi Quattro.
If only they'd done things like redesigned the whole back of the car to fit in multilink suspension and a 5th gen haldex system on a 2wd platform, a bespoke steering rack and a magnesium gearbox case for good measure.. Lamo's!!

fido

14,107 posts

200 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
VeeFource said:
If only they'd done things like redesigned the whole back of the car to fit in multilink suspension and a 5th gen haldex system on a 2wd platform, a bespoke steering rack and a magnesium gearbox case for good measure.. Lamo's!!
Sigh. And if only this 'warm hatch' was as quick to 60 as a Focus ST with 310bhp. Anyway I just used mine to go to ASDA. No seriously, it easier to hide in the car park!

Its Just Adz

9,389 posts

154 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
I had an S1 for 2 years, I must have been one of the few that loved the model.
Handled superbly, loads of grip and room to play if you wanted.
Plenty quick enough, surprised a lot of people, 330 bhp is there with a Revo map if you desire more.
Typical Audi solid quality and never had an issue with it. Only sold because I wasn't using it enough.
S1 and RS1 are planned for new A1 so I'm told by people at Audi.

EpsomJames

759 posts

191 months

Tuesday 10th September
quotequote all
Its Just Adz said:

S1 and RS1 are planned for new A1 so I'm told by people at Audi.
Where did you hear this?

My Audi dealer says they won't be making a hot new A1, but then again, they are trying to push me into an RS3 at the moment.

Elatino1

337 posts

6 months

Tuesday 10th September
quotequote all
Maldini35 said:
1) I enjoyed my S1.
2) Pretty sure I’m not Mrs Miggins.
3) Perhaps you and your friend aren’t the experts you think?
wink
1) Good for you thumbup
2) I wouldn't be so sure.
3) I never said either of us were "experts" but it's very obvious when certain things feel disconnected and stodgy to anyone that enjoys driving and has driven a few good cars.

Gio G

2,143 posts

154 months

Tuesday 10th September
quotequote all
EpsomJames said:
Where did you hear this?

My Audi dealer says they won't be making a hot new A1, but then again, they are trying to push me into an RS3 at the moment.
I heard the same... No S1, just a luke warm A1 with 200 hp..

G

John.Taylor

33 posts

125 months

Tuesday 10th September
quotequote all
I looked at an S1 as a replacement for my Mini R35 Cooper S.

Even taking into account setting aside money to replace the clutch that isn't up to the standard power let alone a Stage 1 remap I planned I wasn't put off.

Then I drove one and was hugely disappointed - two years later I'm still in my R53.