Honest John and Left Foot Braking?
Discussion
JimSuperSix said:
Typically the world works by people trying things and finding them better, as some of us have done.
But if you are desperate for some validation by an expert (or whatever it is you feel you need) here's a video with it all explained by a person who is I assume a rally driver or rally instructor about how its a very good thing to do even on the road.
I expect though that this is not valid as he's not measured the improved stopping distances with a tape measure?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lx8d2rZxvU
Lol, who is going to drive around with their foot hovering over the brake pedal (especially in a manual like he is doing)? Reaction time is from your eyes to your brain then to your limbs. Doesn't matter which foot you use, if you have a sBut if you are desperate for some validation by an expert (or whatever it is you feel you need) here's a video with it all explained by a person who is I assume a rally driver or rally instructor about how its a very good thing to do even on the road.
I expect though that this is not valid as he's not measured the improved stopping distances with a tape measure?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lx8d2rZxvU
t reaction time then you have a st reaction time.NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
bad company said:
OnTheEdge said:
I really can't see any compelling reason to left foot brake on the road, certainly no-one has provided anything in this thread apart from personal preference.
You either haven’t read all the thread, haven’t understood it or refuse to believe what people are saying.Edited by JimSuperSix on Tuesday 8th October 15:29
Obviously this presumes that a left foot braker is cover the brake pedal
Edited by DoubleD on Tuesday 8th October 17:59
JimSuperSix said:
And in fact it turns out there IS data:
https://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
That is not published data, thats published data on braking with the right foot and then some postulaltion by a non expert writing a blog and assuming the left leg has the same reaction time.......so really its just the same craphttps://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
bad company said:
OnTheEdge said:
I really can't see any compelling reason to left foot brake on the road, certainly no-one has provided anything in this thread apart from personal preference.
You either haven’t read all the thread, haven’t understood it or refuse to believe what people are saying.Edited by JimSuperSix on Tuesday 8th October 15:29
But if you are desperate for some validation by an expert (or whatever it is you feel you need) here's a video with it all explained by a person who is I assume a rally driver or rally instructor about how its a very good thing to do even on the road.
I expect though that this is not valid as he's not measured the improved stopping distances with a tape measure?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lx8d2rZxvU
And some links with the pros and cons:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a21561899...
https://speedsecrets.com/driving-tips/the-pros-con...
https://driver61.com/uni/left-foot-braking/
https://leftfootbraking.org/index.cfm
No data there either
JimSuperSix said:
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
That para doesn’t seem to make much sense though unless one is supposed to drive with the left foot poised over the brake pedal at all times. It would seem logical that the act of getting the left foot from the foot rest to the pedal would take as long, if not longer than slipping the right foot over to the pedal? The latter also ensuring that from the moment the driver starts taking action the vehicle ceases accelerating and starts decelerating just from coming off the throttle.
And seeing as many drivers seem to bury everything in a panic situation then having the right foot away from the throttle would seem prudent?
On the whole, it’s surely the case that most people can get their right foot off the throttle and over to the brake quicker than lifting the left leg off the rest and onto the brake as there is no repositioning of the heel. The pedal positioning is orientated to favour the former.
I can see Honest John’s argument that the elderly may fair better to cover the brake with the left foot while manoeuvring, I can see that for rapid, deliberate, focussed progress it can be an advantage and I can see that some people just prefer it but I can’t really see an argument to suggest that the average driver is better off using a machine in a way that it is not specifically, physically set up to be used. To achieve that you’d want to be changing the foot rest to be at the brake pedal height and moving the brake pedal over to the foot rest so that the left foot can pivot without having to reposition the heel.
Edited by DonkeyApple on Wednesday 9th October 11:42
JimSuperSix said:
And in fact it turns out there IS data:
https://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
2.2 seconds reaction time to brake? https://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
Maybe you should let those nice folks who look after the Highway Code know - their stopping distance only includes 0.7 seconds for reaction time....
Hmm, believe the Highway Code or some random website that wants me to sign up to a restaurant list?
DickyC said:
On cars with the indicator stalk on the left, I indicate with my left hand.
On cars with the indicator stalk on the right, I indicate with my right hand.
It's the work of the devil.
On my automatic car I shift between park, drive etc using my right hand. This way I only need to use the right side of my body and can shut down my left side a bit like cylinder deactivation.On cars with the indicator stalk on the right, I indicate with my right hand.
It's the work of the devil.
(It is a RHD car with UK pedal layout)
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
And in fact it turns out there IS data:
https://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
That is not published data, thats published data on braking with the right foot and then some postulaltion by a non expert writing a blog and assuming the left leg has the same reaction time.......so really its just the same craphttps://www.thrillist.com/cars/nation/left-foot-br...
"A brilliant study from the University of Iowa establishes total driver reaction time as 2.2 seconds, and finds that the average driver will begin lifting his or her foot off the accelerator 0.96 seconds after the need arises. That means that the act of moving your foot over to the left, then pushing down on the brake pedal, requires an additional 1.24 seconds for that 2.2-second total. That's huge."
"At 70mph, you cover 102ft, 8in per second. Over the course of the 68 hundredths of a second that a right-foot braker wastes, his or her car travels a full 70ft. Amazingly, that number (in feet) is going to remain tied to your speed in miles per hour. Going 45mph? You're saving 45ft with your left foot in an emergency,"
I knew it would be.
And the videos by the rally instructor are not the right sort of data either , because ... he IS an expert but he's not published them on the correct sort of website for you?
In hindsight you're probably right not to LFB because I'm not sure you would be able to control your feet independently
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
bad company said:
OnTheEdge said:
I really can't see any compelling reason to left foot brake on the road, certainly no-one has provided anything in this thread apart from personal preference.
You either haven’t read all the thread, haven’t understood it or refuse to believe what people are saying.Edited by JimSuperSix on Tuesday 8th October 15:29
But if you are desperate for some validation by an expert (or whatever it is you feel you need) here's a video with it all explained by a person who is I assume a rally driver or rally instructor about how its a very good thing to do even on the road.
I expect though that this is not valid as he's not measured the improved stopping distances with a tape measure?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lx8d2rZxvU
And some links with the pros and cons:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a21561899...
https://speedsecrets.com/driving-tips/the-pros-con...
https://driver61.com/uni/left-foot-braking/
https://leftfootbraking.org/index.cfm
No data there either
SidewaysSi said:
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
JimSuperSix said:
NewUsername said:
bad company said:
OnTheEdge said:
I really can't see any compelling reason to left foot brake on the road, certainly no-one has provided anything in this thread apart from personal preference.
You either haven’t read all the thread, haven’t understood it or refuse to believe what people are saying.Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 8th October 15:29
But if you are desperate for some validation by an expert (or whatever it is you feel you need) here's a video with it all explained by a person who is I assume a rally driver or rally instructor about how its a very good thing to do even on the road.
I expect though that this is not valid as he's not measured the improved stopping distances with a tape measure?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lx8d2rZxvU
And some links with the pros and cons:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a21561899...
https://speedsecrets.com/driving-tips/the-pros-con...
https://driver61.com/uni/left-foot-braking/
https://leftfootbraking.org/index.cfm
No data there either
Damn just realized I have no data telling me to wipe my ass after a poop, guess its going to be mucky trousers from now on then...
Off Topic A Bit - Kenny Bräck, Swedish racing driver, driving a GT40 which were, of course, right hand drive with a right hand gearchange was never going to work, was it?
The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
DickyC said:
Off Topic A Bit - Kenny Bräck, Swedish racing driver, driving a GT40 which were, of course, right hand drive with a right hand gearchange was never going to work, was it?
The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
Is it me or was the car completely uncontrollable in that vid??The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
V6 Pushfit said:
Is it me or was the car completely uncontrollable in that vid??
He's a rally driver by profession. It looked to me like driving a GT40 round Goodwood in the wet is more like rally driving than anything else. The rate at which he goes past other cars is awe inspiring."He went past me like I was tied to a tree." As someone once said. Nick Cussons? Can't remember.
DickyC said:
Off Topic A Bit - Kenny Bräck, Swedish racing driver, driving a GT40 which were, of course, right hand drive with a right hand gearchange was never going to work, was it?
The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
What a legend. The hash he makes of it.
https://youtu.be/1jF__B1xpJY
Though I think there are some on here who could teach him a thing or two how to drive properly.
DoubleD said:
If you want real data then time how long it takes your foot to move from the accelerator to the brake.
Obviously this presumes that a left foot braker is cover the brake pedal
Suggested that with a basic methodology too. Probably needs writing up in a peer reviewed journal and of course traceable calibration certificates for the timing equipment to be valid. Obviously this presumes that a left foot braker is cover the brake pedal
Edited by DoubleD on Tuesday 8th October 17:59
I do understand though, if someone doesn't want to try lfb then they shouldn't. For me it is completely natural thing as I learned while karting and have practiced other physical disciplines where being able to perform movements equally well both left and right sided is necessary.
Some days I like to drive without braking at all, other days I use both left and right feet to brake, some days I use my hands to brake, I'm not a chimpanzee by the way, and on very rare occasions I just wait for a convenient secondary vehicle to slow me down!! 
Does his make me wrong? Do I need re-educating? I've only been driving 31 years, so I guess I'm still learning!!!
Does his make me wrong? Do I need re-educating? I've only been driving 31 years, so I guess I'm still learning!!!
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