RE: MX-5 30th Anniversary vs. Porsche Boxster (981)
Discussion
Nuisance said:
The dealer was well aware I was have it lowered elsewhere and had no issue with it. I didn't even order the springs from the same dealer as I got them cheaper from a different Mazda dealer online.
I got the springs fitted and the alignment done to my requested specs at Corten Miller in Lincolnshire.
That’s a pretty decent attitude for them to have. I know someone who ordered a Seat Ibiza estate, quite a few years ago mind, and sports springs were in the official brochure for it. Strangely they couldn’t be fitted on the production line, unlike any of the other optional extras they ordered, and the dealer was very specific that they would be the only people who would be allowed to fit them, at an extra cost of course!I got the springs fitted and the alignment done to my requested specs at Corten Miller in Lincolnshire.
ChrisW. said:
I have just bought one ... for all the reasons.
My old MX5 is in the classifieds.
The depreciation on the McLaren I didn't buy will pay for it in one year !
Insurance ? £274.16, mpg over 40, three year warranty and cheap servicing .... and every panel has a sticker showing the chassis number (as Porsche used to number the panels of their special cars).
Update. I believe my old car is now sold. The cost to change was £11,400. My old car is four years old in February, due and mot and service and of course outside warranty with a half worn set of tyres. So let's assume the following value added from my old MX5:My old MX5 is in the classifieds.
The depreciation on the McLaren I didn't buy will pay for it in one year !
Insurance ? £274.16, mpg over 40, three year warranty and cheap servicing .... and every panel has a sticker showing the chassis number (as Porsche used to number the panels of their special cars).
1. Three year warranty ... £1200 ?
2. Half a set of tyres ... £250 ?
3. Service and MOT x.75 ... £250 ?
4. ll the 30th Anniversary improvements ... power upgrade / Brembo / Forged alloys / Recaro seats / Alcantara interior / limited edition ... £4000 ?
Total £5700.
So by the above reckoning the depreciation on my old car was £5700 over 3.75 years including making new to secondhand, with interest free credit on 50% of the cost over the first three years.
Is there better value in the market ?
What would have been the cost on a 2.7 Boxster over this time and 12,000 miles ?
The MX5 really is a class act.
Chris W wins the Nobel Prize for Contributions to Man Maths with that analysis I think. Work on it a bit harder and it'll transpire that they actually paid you to change cars 
If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time.
If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time.
flukey5 said:
I've only driven a 718 Boxter (when cross-shopping it for an MX-5) and I found it to be very good but not worth the price premium over the Mazda.
!
You overlook the fact that for many price is not a factor but snobbery & peer group approval is. Whether said car 'handles' is of absolutely no consequence whatever. As foo it being 'good value' dear me no that is too much a suburban working class concept. !
" I think the mincing about in a small convertible without caring about how it drives market is much more into diesel SLKs, Mini convertibles, 2 series convertibles, Audi A3s, that kind of thing. You give up a lot of usability with an MX5, more so in the ND than the previous generation."
"If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time."
Do you really think that MX5 drivers mince around ?
Don't you really give away a lot of usability when you choose a two seater cabriolet ... hence the Boxster comparison ? Are you sure you aren't missing the point ?
I really fail to understand your reference to warning lights ... reliability is the very reason why the MX5 is so highly regarded ... I should say far more so than my experience of Boxsters at an equivalent price level ? And then much cheaper to repair.
I personally have no hankerings for a 3 year old Focus, but each to their own.
I will however accept the generosity of the man / maths
Spending money still costs and it would have been far more economical to keep the old car but ... !! Much less fun.
"If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time."
Do you really think that MX5 drivers mince around ?
Don't you really give away a lot of usability when you choose a two seater cabriolet ... hence the Boxster comparison ? Are you sure you aren't missing the point ?
I really fail to understand your reference to warning lights ... reliability is the very reason why the MX5 is so highly regarded ... I should say far more so than my experience of Boxsters at an equivalent price level ? And then much cheaper to repair.
I personally have no hankerings for a 3 year old Focus, but each to their own.
I will however accept the generosity of the man / maths
Spending money still costs and it would have been far more economical to keep the old car but ... !! Much less fun.rockin said:
It is indeed. Although comparing one with a used Boxster makes as little sense as comparing a new Boxster with a used McLaren.
I agree ... an MX5 of a similar age is half the cost of a 2.7 Boxster ... but much more than half of the fun and far less than half of the running costs ...ChrisW. said:
" I think the mincing about in a small convertible without caring about how it drives market is much more into diesel SLKs, Mini convertibles, 2 series convertibles, Audi A3s, that kind of thing. You give up a lot of usability with an MX5, more so in the ND than the previous generation."
"If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time."
Do you really think that MX5 drivers mince around ?
Don't you really give away a lot of usability when you choose a two seater cabriolet ... hence the Boxster comparison ? Are you sure you aren't missing the point ?
I really fail to understand your reference to warning lights ... reliability is the very reason why the MX5 is so highly regarded ... I should say far more so than my experience of Boxsters at an equivalent price level ? And then much cheaper to repair.
I personally have no hankerings for a 3 year old Focus, but each to their own.
I will however accept the generosity of the man / maths Spending money still costs and it would have been far more economical to keep the old car but ... !! Much less fun.
Re the mincing - my point was that for mincing people wouldn't chose an MX5 exactly because it does require such a compromise - you'd have a mini convertible, or an A3/A5 convertible or something like that if you just wanted a convertible with no care for driving dynamics. This is why I think the accusations about the MX5 being a "hairdressers car" have always been drivel."If you don't already follow the Bargain Barge threads then you should, a man of your calibre will fit right in; you'll be concluding that 14 year old twin turbo V12 Mercedes with three warning lights on the dash is a reasonable alternative to a 3 year old Focus in no time."
Do you really think that MX5 drivers mince around ?
Don't you really give away a lot of usability when you choose a two seater cabriolet ... hence the Boxster comparison ? Are you sure you aren't missing the point ?
I really fail to understand your reference to warning lights ... reliability is the very reason why the MX5 is so highly regarded ... I should say far more so than my experience of Boxsters at an equivalent price level ? And then much cheaper to repair.
I personally have no hankerings for a 3 year old Focus, but each to their own.
I will however accept the generosity of the man / maths
Spending money still costs and it would have been far more economical to keep the old car but ... !! Much less fun.The warning lights was more of a reference to the bargain barge thread, where man maths like that is considered a fine art. I covered 60k in a 20 year old NA over 2 years, and the only fault was when I couldn't be arsed to look into a small coolant leak that became a big coolant leak on the M4 - it was probably the cheapest to run and most reliable car I've ever owned.
thelostboy said:
As soon as I opened this thread I was anticipating this kind of argument!
Firstly, the 981 Boxster is a fabulous thing. Unlike the previous bar of soap, it is genuinely good looking and with the 'right' wheels and -20mm suspension option it just looks spot on.
With the PSE, it also sounds sensational with the roof down (although the overrun pops are contrived and borderline irritating), and the weighting of the controls are just lovely.
These things add up as easily enough justification to buy one and enjoy for years.
But.
On a British road, the Boxster is doing everything for you. There is a ton of mechanical grip and you need to be going a silly speed for you as a driver to be doing anything besides pointing and shooting; you are kidding yourself if you believe otherwise.
Meanwhile, the MX5 is like going back in time. It is way more immersive as a driver's car because you are very much in control of the car's balance at relatively low speeds. They are soft, giving you time to indulge even if not particularly experienced. it is fast neither in a straight line or around corners, but in isolation there is nothing more you need.
For me, there is no argument on that, especially in the UK, if you are buying a car to have fun in the MX5 doesn't have an equal outside the more compromised Caterfields (or an old Elan, of course!).
As an only car though, the Boxster is a far nicer thing to live with. Nothing wrong with the MX5 interior, and it's not like you can't get the luxuries, but the cabin is very small and space limited in general - they are tiny! The Porsche is a better choice if you have to drive on the motorway (for me, not every journey is a B road thrash), taking calls and, you know, all the boring stuff.
I suppose what I'm saying is that I'd take the Boxster, but I am aware that is because I have made a decision based on compromise. I am fully aware that the MX5 driving I'm following will be having a better time on the right road.
The above is one of the best comments on here for me. As said earlier in this thread, I only got into the Boxster world as I could no longer get in and out of my Elise. I had an MX5 on lease for three years so got plenty of experience of driving one. The MX5 is a great little car, good handling, gear shift, reasonable power and ideal for a couple of hour run round the Yorkshire Dales. Reminds me of my original Elan, as many people have said over the years. For me it falls down on lack of boot and cabin space. The engine's a bit wheezy compared to the Boxster but ultimate power's not an issue for me, my boy racer days are long gone.Firstly, the 981 Boxster is a fabulous thing. Unlike the previous bar of soap, it is genuinely good looking and with the 'right' wheels and -20mm suspension option it just looks spot on.
With the PSE, it also sounds sensational with the roof down (although the overrun pops are contrived and borderline irritating), and the weighting of the controls are just lovely.
These things add up as easily enough justification to buy one and enjoy for years.
But.
On a British road, the Boxster is doing everything for you. There is a ton of mechanical grip and you need to be going a silly speed for you as a driver to be doing anything besides pointing and shooting; you are kidding yourself if you believe otherwise.
Meanwhile, the MX5 is like going back in time. It is way more immersive as a driver's car because you are very much in control of the car's balance at relatively low speeds. They are soft, giving you time to indulge even if not particularly experienced. it is fast neither in a straight line or around corners, but in isolation there is nothing more you need.
For me, there is no argument on that, especially in the UK, if you are buying a car to have fun in the MX5 doesn't have an equal outside the more compromised Caterfields (or an old Elan, of course!).
As an only car though, the Boxster is a far nicer thing to live with. Nothing wrong with the MX5 interior, and it's not like you can't get the luxuries, but the cabin is very small and space limited in general - they are tiny! The Porsche is a better choice if you have to drive on the motorway (for me, not every journey is a B road thrash), taking calls and, you know, all the boring stuff.
I suppose what I'm saying is that I'd take the Boxster, but I am aware that is because I have made a decision based on compromise. I am fully aware that the MX5 driving I'm following will be having a better time on the right road.
The Boxster for me is a great compromise, front and rear boot, big enough cabin,easy hood and fabulous engine and exhaust noise. I'd never had a flat six before but it's pretty addictive. The Boxster's going to be dearer to run but surely anyone thinking of buying one would expect that. I'm not expecting massive depreciation, the 981 PDK seems to hold its value reasonably and I'll be doing no more than 10K per year. It's far from perfect though, it's a bit bulky,rear vision with the hood up is a bit restricted for me, switches are fiddly and interior storage is poor. This thing with the wheels scrubbing on full lock is really annoying too.Having just done a long Euro trip on a mixture of roads I was glad to be in the Boxster and not an MX5. For me neither's perfect but both good cars. As a pure driving machine though, neither is a patch on the Elise.
I reckon it's pretty accurate.
Parts costs don't go down and I've yet to meet a competent indy with bargain basement labour rates.
Rough rule of thumb after the first three years is to allow 5% of the "new" cost of the car as running costs each year. Hopefully it should work out cheaper than that, but it's a useful yardstick.
Parts costs don't go down and I've yet to meet a competent indy with bargain basement labour rates.
Rough rule of thumb after the first three years is to allow 5% of the "new" cost of the car as running costs each year. Hopefully it should work out cheaper than that, but it's a useful yardstick.
mpcdonald said:
I always say, If you can't buy it new. you can't afford to run it second hand.
Then you're wrong as that's what 99% of the driving population do.At new prices I own possibly £1M of cars (I CBA to work it out) but I certainly couldn't afford to buy them new and they cost buttons to run.
The trick is to buy the right cars not the unique / overly complex ones
Tales me back to 2005 - wanted a fun 2 seater convertible that I could use for commuting all year round. Had a budget that could stretch to Boxter - and had test drives in both cars. Very different machines at different ends of the spectrum - and both brilliant in their own way. Ultimately I preferred the Porsche but got scared off by a friends experience of running costs. But the MX5 just wasn't quite what i wanted........bought an S2000. Shame there's no equivalent today.
300bhp/ton said:
mpcdonald said:
I always say, If you can't buy it new. you can't afford to run it second hand.
What utter nonsense.That's a bit of a fringe case though. I couldn't afford a £120,000 S600 twin turbo but I could afford the odd £3000 bill when my £5k shed S600TT breaks!
So it's partially nonsense, I suppose.
If you want a cheap reliable car I would go for a Honda Jazz or a Toyota Yaris.
When I was mugged for my E36 M3 I changed direction and bough one of the first 1.0L Yaris five doors in a delightful gold colour (it was the cheapest one I could find).
I ran it in in the first week, it did 120,000 miles in five years and my children learnt to drive on it. By 120,000 miles it had had only brake pads and a new battery ... apart from servicing it was still on it's original everything else ... and I sold it for £2000.
In it's place I bought a six month old demonstrator with 2000 miles on the clock for £7000 ...
That's £5000 for 118,000 miles with total reliability and minimal servicing and consumable costs.
I have owned far too many cars ...
When I was mugged for my E36 M3 I changed direction and bough one of the first 1.0L Yaris five doors in a delightful gold colour (it was the cheapest one I could find).
I ran it in in the first week, it did 120,000 miles in five years and my children learnt to drive on it. By 120,000 miles it had had only brake pads and a new battery ... apart from servicing it was still on it's original everything else ... and I sold it for £2000.
In it's place I bought a six month old demonstrator with 2000 miles on the clock for £7000 ...
That's £5000 for 118,000 miles with total reliability and minimal servicing and consumable costs.
I have owned far too many cars ...
ChrisW. said:
If you want a cheap reliable car I would go for a Honda Jazz or a Toyota Yaris.
When I was mugged for my E36 M3 I changed direction and bough one of the first 1.0L Yaris five doors in a delightful gold colour (it was the cheapest one I could find).
I ran it in in the first week, it did 120,000 miles in five years and my children learnt to drive on it. By 120,000 miles it had had only brake pads and a new battery ... apart from servicing it was still on it's original everything else ... and I sold it for £2000.
In it's place I bought a six month old demonstrator with 2000 miles on the clock for £7000 ...
That's £5000 for 118,000 miles with total reliability and minimal servicing and consumable costs.
I have owned far too many cars ...
I feel this falls down on the cost/reward argument for me. When I was mugged for my E36 M3 I changed direction and bough one of the first 1.0L Yaris five doors in a delightful gold colour (it was the cheapest one I could find).
I ran it in in the first week, it did 120,000 miles in five years and my children learnt to drive on it. By 120,000 miles it had had only brake pads and a new battery ... apart from servicing it was still on it's original everything else ... and I sold it for £2000.
In it's place I bought a six month old demonstrator with 2000 miles on the clock for £7000 ...
That's £5000 for 118,000 miles with total reliability and minimal servicing and consumable costs.
I have owned far too many cars ...
As someone who loves driving & appreciates comfort/quality I measure cars not only on what they cost but in what I get back. A polo or aygo or similar can be as much fun as a supercar for a day or week as a hire car but it doesn't take long to get tired of its 2 dimensional handling, non variable on/off throttle pedal and cheap minimalist interior/seats.
I don't know how having experienced deeper cars you could live with that for more than 3 months. I would analogise it to prostitution after experiencing love.
You would sacrifice almost anything to get back to something that is an escape from the narrow grey reality of working for necessity.
A car where the handling/Powertrain have depth. Where the more you grow as a driver, the more questions you think to ask of the chassis and the more it has to teach you. Where striving for the perfect lap is something you can grow ever closer to but never feel you can quite achieve. Where your connection grows deeper every passing hour. The 911 (maybe a 993 C2) is the pinnacle of this for me but you can get close enough.
I would add into this description a soundtrack that speaks to the soul and forces a smile to the face but this is sadly more and more a distant memory, accessible only with the increasing penalty of trying to maintain ageing cars to a condition that allows you to use them as they were intended when fresh and new. The cost is an exponential curve with the cars age and I do not have an infinate budget.
The modern boxster and mx-5 are both a long way from perfection but give a lot for very little. Good ratio of cost/reward.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 12th November 11:29
mpcdonald said:
I always say, If you can't buy it new. you can't afford to run it second hand.
Whereas i always say, never buy new If that were the case, i should have had 90k (current new price) in the bank to have bought and run my old 996, which cost 10k and 2k a year to keep.
I'm seriously considering swapping my mk1 mx5 turbo for a lightly tuned mk3, just something a bit more comfy and refined. Might cost me 6-8k?
I can't see the value in a 30k mx5, but also can't justify that kind of money on a 981. I'm very much at the lower end of the market!
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