RE: Ford Mustang Mach-E officially unveiled
Discussion
GravelBen said:
So Ford say 'we can't be having that!' and set out to dilute and weaken the Mustang sub-brand by attaching it to an uninspired generic blob with no character?
You're quite wrong. Nothing is being diluted.Your way of thinking would deny Ford a major opportunity. See last month's sales, below. What's more: Mustang has important experiential values that are urgently needed in the opaque world of battery-electric vehicles.
Your PH profile says you're in New Zealand. If I may frame this matter closer to the PH "home" --- It's ironic that you're so dismissive, here. In my work experience on both sides of the Atlantic, UK firms tend to be more imaginative than US firms at recognising -- and at engaging prospects with -- intangible brand values. Values like those of Mustang. Incidentally, I would rank AUS / NZ below the Americans.
chart source
https://www.statista.com/statistics/276506/change-...
otolith said:
I’m not sure that they do intend to continue making actual Mustangs, given the long term decline in sales. I think they’re going to try to transfer what value is left in the brand before killing the car.
This is an unfortunate comment -- the sort of thing that leads to rumour. Even if unintended.
I don't see how the Ford Motor Company could continue in our lifetimes and not offer the 2+2 coupe. The powertrain may at some point be up for discussion. But not the 2+2 coupe format.
unsprung said:
otolith said:
I’m not sure that they do intend to continue making actual Mustangs, given the long term decline in sales. I think they’re going to try to transfer what value is left in the brand before killing the car.
This is an unfortunate comment -- the sort of thing that leads to rumour. Even if unintended.
I don't see how the Ford Motor Company could continue in our lifetimes and not offer the 2+2 coupe. The powertrain may at some point be up for discussion. But not the 2+2 coupe format.
unsprung said:
Your PH profile says you're in New Zealand. If I may frame this matter closer to the PH "home" --- It's ironic that you're so dismissive, here. In my work experience on both sides of the Atlantic, UK firms tend to be more imaginative than US firms at recognising -- and at engaging prospects with -- intangible brand values. Values like those of Mustang. Incidentally, I would rank AUS / NZ below the Americans.
wth is that all supposed to mean that GravelBen's opinion isnt valid at all because he lives in a different country? NZ buy a fair few Mustangs too.otolith said:
Why would they continue?
That's a fair question. Manufacturers will not support a dwindling and/or unprofitable product line.Is Mustang dwindling? Sales have averaged somewhere near 90,000 units annually for each of the last five years.
http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/ford/for...
Looks healthy to me. And worthy of yet another generation of the car. And, I believe, another generation after that. I don't see how Ford can't keep its range of coupe variants and its cost of goods in line with market demand.
I don't have a crystal ball, and I'm not unaware of the shifting sands of demographics and legislation that challenge cars that PHers might like. But I see no reason at this time to think that the Mustang 2+2 coupe cannot continue to evolve for quite some time.
Mache?...
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/mache
Well.. it sounds like a term used in home taxidermy to me. Maybe the vehicle is a bit dead.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/mache
Well.. it sounds like a term used in home taxidermy to me. Maybe the vehicle is a bit dead.
RobDickinson said:
wth is that all supposed to mean that GravelBen's opinion isnt valid at all because he lives in a different country? NZ buy a fair few Mustangs too.
That's not my message. My message is that it's ironic that a UK forum is host to an argument, a rather bellicose argument, that is dismissive of experiential brand values. Because, in my work experience, the UK makes the most imaginative use of brand experience.
RDMcG said:
Mache?...
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/mache
Well.. it sounds like a term used in home taxidermy to me. Maybe the vehicle is a bit dead.
Ca? C'est la version francaise https://www.dictionary.com/browse/mache
Well.. it sounds like a term used in home taxidermy to me. Maybe the vehicle is a bit dead.
unsprung said:
You're quite wrong. Nothing is being diluted.
Your way of thinking would deny Ford a major opportunity. See last month's sales, below. What's more: Mustang has important experiential values that are urgently needed in the opaque world of battery-electric vehicles.
You are assuming that those 'important experiental values' can be transferred by simply slapping the name onto a very different product, and that the product which established those values somehow won't have its brand diluted by the same name being associated with products that don't share its values.Your way of thinking would deny Ford a major opportunity. See last month's sales, below. What's more: Mustang has important experiential values that are urgently needed in the opaque world of battery-electric vehicles.
If they want those values to be experienced in electric vehicles they need to build them into the product, not just swap over a badge and some minor detailing. If they have different values, use a different name that reflects the values it does have.
If the name can convey values then using it for a product without those values does dilute it. You can't have it both ways, and burying it beneath a slurry of inane marketing drivel doesn't change that core issue.
RobDickinson said:
unsprung said:
Your PH profile says you're in New Zealand. If I may frame this matter closer to the PH "home" --- It's ironic that you're so dismissive, here. In my work experience on both sides of the Atlantic, UK firms tend to be more imaginative than US firms at recognising -- and at engaging prospects with -- intangible brand values. Values like those of Mustang. Incidentally, I would rank AUS / NZ below the Americans.
wth is that all supposed to mean that GravelBen's opinion isnt valid at all because he lives in a different country? NZ buy a fair few Mustangs too.GravelBen said:
simply slapping the name onto
The tell, if you will, that you don't know what you're talking about.We can see that you're upset. But not that you have a better argument than what is implied by Ford, with its substantial resources and its day in, day out management of opportunity and risk.
This particular issue of correct / incorrect -- regarding the Mustang line extension -- is satisfied, in my opinion. Loads of posts here about that topic, and I reckon that most people can make up their own minds.
Ford's marketing department really have disappeared up their own nether regions. In the latest ads for the (proper) Mustang (such as the 2-page spread in the first few pages of the latest issue of Classic and Sportscar), they start with the traditional "Ford takes you further". Not sure that this is appropriate for the limited range of an EV...? Then, the next headline text is "Don't go quietly". Absolutely appropriate for a proper Mustang, but completely off target for an EV.
So basically they have cynically hijacked the Mustang brand in an attempt to add panache to the latest SUV EV, and at the same time contradicted their own marketing drive for that same Mustang brand. Somebody should lose their job for such incompetence.
The only thing remotely "Mustang" about the EV is the nod to classic tail lights. You can't even add the frontal styling to this association because basically it's just standard corporate Ford, and even the latest (proper) Mustang face has more in common with Mondeo, Focus et al than it does with classic Mustang.
I expect this SUV is an excellent EV, and may even be an excellent car overall, but it is certainly not coherent with the Mustang ethos which, since the 2005 iteration, had been so successfully revived by Ford. So shame on you Ford and, as others have commented, this may even backfire on you (if an EV can perform such an act?) as it is detracting attention from the undoubted qualities of the vehicle itself.
By the way, as a Mustang owner and daily hybrid EV driver, I don't think I can be accused of ranting from a position of bias.
So basically they have cynically hijacked the Mustang brand in an attempt to add panache to the latest SUV EV, and at the same time contradicted their own marketing drive for that same Mustang brand. Somebody should lose their job for such incompetence.
The only thing remotely "Mustang" about the EV is the nod to classic tail lights. You can't even add the frontal styling to this association because basically it's just standard corporate Ford, and even the latest (proper) Mustang face has more in common with Mondeo, Focus et al than it does with classic Mustang.
I expect this SUV is an excellent EV, and may even be an excellent car overall, but it is certainly not coherent with the Mustang ethos which, since the 2005 iteration, had been so successfully revived by Ford. So shame on you Ford and, as others have commented, this may even backfire on you (if an EV can perform such an act?) as it is detracting attention from the undoubted qualities of the vehicle itself.
By the way, as a Mustang owner and daily hybrid EV driver, I don't think I can be accused of ranting from a position of bias.
I wonder how many of the folks complaining about diluting the brand etc have driven the Mustang I did, in Florida back in 1992?
a 2.4 litre in-line 4 with a claimed 105 horsepower, that slowed down when you turned the aircon on, and didn't pull any better off the line than the 1.6 Cavalier I had on my drive at home at the time
Anyone trying to claim that particular feeble little '92 Mustang was truer to the brand than the new BEV version will be pointed at and laughed
The world, and the car industry, is changing, and I'm glad to see that Ford are coming up with a plausible alternative to the St Elon product that some folk here are so keen on.
I expect that if we'd had the interweb a hundred or more years ago, people would be complaining about the demise of the steam car...
a 2.4 litre in-line 4 with a claimed 105 horsepower, that slowed down when you turned the aircon on, and didn't pull any better off the line than the 1.6 Cavalier I had on my drive at home at the time
Anyone trying to claim that particular feeble little '92 Mustang was truer to the brand than the new BEV version will be pointed at and laughed
The world, and the car industry, is changing, and I'm glad to see that Ford are coming up with a plausible alternative to the St Elon product that some folk here are so keen on.
I expect that if we'd had the interweb a hundred or more years ago, people would be complaining about the demise of the steam car...
unsprung said:
We can see that you're upset. But not that you have a better argument than what is implied by Ford, with its substantial resources and its day in, day out management of opportunity and risk.
Do you always refer to yourself as 'we'? You have a very good imagination if you think I'm upset about anything - I'm just a relatively impartial observer with a tendency to be cynical about empty marketing verbiage.You're entitled to your opinion of course, though with the remarkable number of promotional posts you have been making for this car I can't help but wonder if you are being paid for your services. Ford with its substantial resources etc also thought the Edsel was a great idea, so they aren't exactly infallible.
I think it enhances the Mustang brand, at least based on what Ken Miles seemed to think of the product in Le Mans 66. Irrelevant anyway as Ford decides what the Mustang brand stands for and if you're so brand sensitive that you get upset about what a product is called rather then what the product actually does (and then slag off "the marketing" even though you're clearly very influenced by it) then simply stop buying Mustangs all together, not that you probably ever bought one in the first place. Or judge a car simply based on functional merits, not a few letters that form a word stuck at the back of it. In other words, ignore the marketing or the image created, if you can.
Dave Hedgehog said:
Totally worth it, it's a Mustang!Dave Hedgehog said:
I'd hazard a guess that there are plenty of slower, pricier cars.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff