RE: Ford Mustang Mach-E officially unveiled

[NDNDNDND]

nickfrog said:

I think it enhances the Mustang brand, at least based on what Ken Miles seemed to think of the product in Le Mans 66. Irrelevant anyway as Ford decides what the Mustang brand stands for and if you're so brand sensitive that you get upset about what a product is called rather then what the product actually does (and then slag off "the marketing" even though you're clearly very influenced by it) then simply stop buying Mustangs all together, not that you probably ever bought one in the first place. Or judge a car simply based on functional merits, not a few letters that form a word stuck at the back of it. In other words, ignore the marketing or the image created, if you can.

You're wrong if you think Ford controls what Mustang stands for. Back in the 80's Ford tried to supersede the Fox Body with a front wheel drive 'Mustang' on a shared Mazda platform. The customers were up in arms and forced Ford to keep the Mustang RWD, leading to the re-development of the Fox platform into the SN95.

The FWD Mustang became the Ford Probe...

I actually think the Mach-E looks like a pretty good car, and absolutely the right thing for Ford to be making right now as the market is clamouring for an Electric crossover. The only worrying thing about it is how they've stuck the Mustang name on it - I can't help but think it's the death knell for the proper Mustang.

Sure, the imminent demise of the ICE will pretty much make boisterous muscle cars like the Mustang redundant, but I wonder if we'll even see an electric 2+2 Mustang coupe? The coupe traditionally exists because its low CoG and smaller form bestow better handling and performance on the car, but when electric SUVs with their low-slung batteries all have low CoG and their massive batteries denote huge performance... what's the point of a coupe? What's the point of any sports car? As Unsprung pointed out above, customers only really care if a car does the numbers, and only an irrelevant few care how a car actually drives.

The Mustang crossover, to me, forebodes a future where everything is an electric crossover, battery and motor skateboards are widely shared, and minor styling tweaks and infotainment skins are the only differentiating factors between brands.

Marketing wins, which is clearly what you want, Nick.

[nickfrog]

NDNDNDND said:

nickfrog said:

I think it enhances the Mustang brand, at least based on what Ken Miles seemed to think of the product in Le Mans 66. Irrelevant anyway as Ford decides what the Mustang brand stands for and if you're so brand sensitive that you get upset about what a product is called rather then what the product actually does (and then slag off "the marketing" even though you're clearly very influenced by it) then simply stop buying Mustangs all together, not that you probably ever bought one in the first place. Or judge a car simply based on functional merits, not a few letters that form a word stuck at the back of it. In other words, ignore the marketing or the image created, if you can.

Marketing wins, which is clearly what you want, Nick.

Yes, it's abundantly clear in my original post, that you quoted.

But based on how regularly you see stuff that doesn't exist, I am not really surprised.

[RobDickinson]

I think it shows how important this is to Ford.

Huge play into the EV market, and they are side stepping their dealer network too, because they traditionally dont want to sell EV.

[NDNDNDND]

nickfrog said:

NDNDNDND said:

nickfrog said:

I think it enhances the Mustang brand, at least based on what Ken Miles seemed to think of the product in Le Mans 66. Irrelevant anyway as Ford decides what the Mustang brand stands for and if you're so brand sensitive that you get upset about what a product is called rather then what the product actually does (and then slag off "the marketing" even though you're clearly very influenced by it) then simply stop buying Mustangs all together, not that you probably ever bought one in the first place. Or judge a car simply based on functional merits, not a few letters that form a word stuck at the back of it. In other words, ignore the marketing or the image created, if you can.

Marketing wins, which is clearly what you want, Nick.

Yes, it's abundantly clear in my original post, that you quoted.

But based on how regularly you see stuff that doesn't exist, I am not really surprised.

I guess I was a bit too subtle in making my point. Yes, you say you're so morally virtuous that you aren't influenced by marketing, but by letting marketing get away with calling something by something it isn't, you are letting them win.

What's a Mustang now?

You seem to love everything that's new, and defend it to the hilt no matter how hideous. So I guess you're looking forward to a future where everyone drives the same, badge-engineered electric crossover?

(By the way, what am I 'regularly' seeing that doesn't exist??)

[nickfrog]

NDNDNDND said:

(By the way, what am I 'regularly' seeing that doesn't exist??)

I'll give you a few examples:

NDNDNDND said:

you say you're so morally virtuous

When did I say that ?

NDNDNDND said:

by letting marketing get away with calling something by something it isn't, you are letting them win.

I am simply ignoring the marketing, not letting anyone win or lose, I am not an activist

NDNDNDND said:

You seem to love everything that's new

I don't care how new/old something is per se.

NDNDNDND said:

and defend it to the hilt no matter how hideous.

I don't. Hideous/beautiful is pretty subjective anyway, I would have thought.

NDNDNDND said:

So I guess you're looking forward to a future where everyone drives the same, badge-engineered electric crossover?

I don't. I don't care about the badge anyway. An electric crossover does massively appeal to me though (is that OK by you ?) but I don't care what everyone else drives.

I think you're also the guy who got very emotional and hysterical about people defending fake exhausts when absolutely no one remotely did that in the thread - you were challenged by several posters to quote such views and couldn't - mainly because they weren't there. It was quite weird.

I admire your imagination and creativity though but you're probably reading too much into things.

Edited by nickfrog on Wednesday 20th November 21:58

[foxbody-87]

Gojira said:

I wonder how many of the folks complaining about diluting the brand etc have driven the Mustang I did, in Florida back in 1992?

a 2.4 litre in-line 4 with a claimed 105 horsepower, that slowed down when you turned the aircon on, and didn't pull any better off the line than the 1.6 Cavalier I had on my drive at home at the time

Anyone trying to claim that particular feeble little '92 Mustang was truer to the brand than the new BEV version will be pointed at and laughed

The world, and the car industry, is changing, and I'm glad to see that Ford are coming up with a plausible alternative to the St Elon product that some folk here are so keen on.

I expect that if we'd had the interweb a hundred or more years ago, people would be complaining about the demise of the steam car...

You drove the poverty spec model then, which had a 2.3 engine. Think the top model in '92 was over 220hp, so although pedestrian today, similar power to the Escort Cosworth of the time. Boxy styling not withstanding, V8 RWD 2-door is still a lot closer to the original concept than a fast electric family car surely?

ETA - the original 1964 1/2 Mustang had a straight six option, also with 105hp.

Edited by foxbody-87 on Wednesday 20th November 23:00

[unsprung]

Video posted by Ford Europe. In the US, there is an almost identical video. Additionally, it is cut into 30-second versions and running there on television.

video here
https://youtu.be/6j0S2V4Wtjc

Ford Europe also posted the following clip, which has no voiceover. It's quite nice just to see the car, along with its shapes and lines, as it moves about an urban landscape.

video here
https://youtu.be/DflwbHLjnW8

A number of messages are communicated, both explicitly and by suggestion. Idris Elba, imo, is an ideal spokesperson for this product launch.

[bridgdav]

20” wheels..
Has several design cues and lines from The S550 that really stand out in the flesh.

[RobDickinson]

Not a bad first effort from Ford if the numbers pan out.

[unsprung]

"I was absolutely adamant that it not be a Mustang"


video
https://youtu.be/KOu_gOI9u88

[foxbody-87]

I was hoping it wouldn't happen but I just saw an advert taking pre-orders on YouTube and I felt a pang of sadness. Sounds pathetic really as its just a car but I don't find the new breed of crossovers/SUVs of any interest at all and we seem to be on an inevitable roll towards them where people who drive these blobs will now be able to call themselves Mustang drivers. This is literally the Ghost busters 2016 of the car world

[JonnyVTEC]

The real question:

Is this mustang a mustang without a live axle?

[ajprice]

Mach E 1400.

7 motors (4 at the back, 3 at the front) and 1400bhp. More of a track/drift/gymkhana car than a road car though

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/ford-has...

[TREMAiNE]

JonnyVTEC said:

The real question:

Is this mustang a mustang without a live axle?

Like all Mustangs from the last 6 years, yes.

[Badman86]

doesn't this defeat the point of an EV, if you have these super powerful ev's they will need to be charged more and inturn consume more energy? robbing peter to pay paul...

[TREMAiNE]

Badman86 said:

doesn't this defeat the point of an EV, if you have these super powerful ev's they will need to be charged more and inturn consume more energy? robbing peter to pay paul...

Wealthy people will mostly not drive around in a 75bhp hatchback.
Big expensive fast EVs will sell well to the wealthy and that adoption will bring down the costs of EV technology over time.
At that point, manufacturers can pump more resources into ‘white goods’ EVs that have a good range and lower price point for the more average consumer.

It’s no different from sat nav only being found on high-end cars 20 years ago. The technology has got cheaper and cheaper and now nav is on virtually all cars but that would likely have never have happened had prestige brands not offered them in the first place.