RE: Rimac C_Two: new details revealed

[Vee12V]

RobDickinson said:

Vee12V said:

A whole article without mentioning the Evija? I mean, it's only more powerful (just), better looking and lighter than this thing...

When is it going to be an actual thing?

Soon

https://youtu.be/qsxCX0KYYJw

[chelme]

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

[LukeyC]

chelme said:

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

I've heard from a secret industry insider that it smells sublime too, so there's that..

[krisdelta]

It looks fantastic, if they can make it sound like an LMP1-H, all the better

[wab172uk]

Nearly 2000 bhp.

Seriously, what's the point?

[Dave Hedgehog]

wab172uk said:

Nearly 2000 bhp.

Seriously, what's the point?

i am not so sure, i dont think it will have enough peep, i will wait for the 3000bhp version

[Maldini35]

When the battery goes kaput (in 6 or 7 years time?) can it be replaced easily or are you left with a £2m garden ornament?

Better still, could you shoe-horn a V8 in the back?

[sidesauce]

chelme said:

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

What new vehicle gets you excited then?

[SturdyHSV]

sidesauce said:

chelme said:

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

What new vehicle gets you excited then?

I'd say I agree with him, in that it just doesn't get me excited at all etc., and to answer your question, current cars that do get me a bit exctied in varying degress:

MX-5, Mustang (the V8 one...), LC500 coupe and convertible, C63/E63, Giulia Quadrifoglio, anything with 'Hellcat' in the name.

There are probably a few more but not many to be honest, either way I thought I'd throw my hat into the ring for some scrutiny

[g4ry13]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Are tyres really going to be able to achieve that?

[Rob J]

DanielSan said:

Equus said:

the article said:

... a torsional stiffness of 17,000Nm, which is so far beyond conventional road cars that it has more in common with single seaters.

Eh?

17000Nm (per degree, I assume) is about the same as a 2006 Mercedes SL, with it's top down. Pretty unexceptional, in other words. The Bugatti Chiron is claimed to be 50,000.

I'm going to make the assumption that's supposed to be 170,000.

Maybe the article has been updated but it states 70,000 in the version that I am reading...

[Niffty951]

SturdyHSV said:

sidesauce said:

chelme said:

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

What new vehicle gets you excited then?

I'd say I agree with him, in that it just doesn't get me excited at all etc., and to answer your question, current cars that do get me a bit exctied in varying degress:

MX-5, Mustang (the V8 one...), LC500 coupe and convertible, C63/E63, Giulia Quadrifoglio, anything with 'Hellcat' in the name.

There are probably a few more but not many to be honest, either way I thought I'd throw my hat into the ring for some scrutiny

I find it a thought provoking original post. In some respects I think it would be interesting for you to review your post immediately after being given a passenger ride in something that does 0-60 in sub 3 seconds.

I previously thought it would be a case of diminishing returns over 500hp ~4sec 0-60 cars (the likes of which I've owned and loved) but after one ride in a light weight R33 skyline with sticky track rubber and >800hp at the wheels my eyes were opened wide that such an out and out assault on the senses is a VERY different experience. With legs floating in free air, breath momentarily frozen and my entire body weight lifted out of the seat. It was enough to trigger my fight of flight reflex and provide me a moment of animal fear before instantly wanting to experience it again. I simply can't imagine that accelerating twice as fast as that could ever be dull, or leave you wanting more sensory input.

However (and it is a big however), the kind of lasting satisfaction and love for a car does not for me come from purely these moments.

The tactile feel and weighting of the controls, the vibrations and connection to the powertrain through the gearstick warm in your palm & linking you to the engine. The smell of hot metals, rich unburnt fuel and oils in the cabin. The neural connection of feeling yourself integrate with the machinery, feeling it as an extension of your own body, wrapped around you and attached to your nervous system. Learning through necessity to understand its subtle movements, the shift of weight, tension and attitude in the suspension. Feeling the hold and scrabble of tyres on the road surface through your fingers. All those elements needing to be linked together to find one extra 10th and dance with the car down a road at speed.

This kind of life altering drive as rivaled by few experiences I've known and those types of sensations must be preserved/replaced as we move into this new era if we are going to produce truly great machines to enjoy. Cars like my TVR Cerbera or 944 turbo created strong and lasting memories because they involved and engaged all of my senses not just because they were overloading them.

Edited by Niffty951 on Friday 22 November 14:34

[JohnCarlisleApeiron]

Rob J said:

DanielSan said:

Equus said:

the article said:

... a torsional stiffness of 17,000Nm, which is so far beyond conventional road cars that it has more in common with single seaters.

Eh?

17000Nm (per degree, I assume) is about the same as a 2006 Mercedes SL, with it's top down. Pretty unexceptional, in other words. The Bugatti Chiron is claimed to be 50,000.

I'm going to make the assumption that's supposed to be 170,000.

Maybe the article has been updated but it states 70,000 in the version that I am reading...

SI units are Nm per rad.

[tigamilla]

Niffty951 said:

I find it a thought provoking original post. In some respects I think it would be interesting for you to review your post immediately after being given a passenger ride in something that does 0-60 in sub 3 seconds.

I previously thought it would be a case of diminishing returns over 500hp ~4sec 0-60 cars (the likes of which I've owned and loved) but after one ride in a light weight R33 skyline with sticky track rubber and >800hp at the wheels my eyes were opened wide that such an out and out assault on the senses is a VERY different experience. With legs floating in free air, breath momentarily frozen and my entire body weight lifted out of the seat. It was enough to trigger my fight of flight reflex and provide me a moment of animal fear before instantly wanting to experience it again. I simply can't imagine that accelerating twice as fast as that could ever be dull, or leave you wanting more sensory input.

However (and it is a big however), the kind of lasting satisfaction and love for a car does not for me come from purely these moments.

The tactile feel and weighting of the controls, the vibrations and connection to the powertrain through the gearstick warm in your palm & linking you to the engine. The smell of hot metals, rich unburnt fuel and oils in the cabin the neural connection of feeling yourself integrate with the machinery, feeling it as an extension of your own body, wrapped around you and attached to your nervous system. Learning through necessity to understand its subtle movements, the shift of weight, tension and attitude in the suspension. Feeling the hold and scrabble of tyres on the road surface through your fingers. All those elements needing to be linked together to find one extra 10th and dance with the car down a road at speed.

This kind of life altering drive as rivaled by few experiences I've known and those types of sensations must be preserved/replaced as we move into this new era if we are going to produce truly great machines to enjoy. Cars like my TVR Cerbera or 944 turbo created strong and lasting memories because they involved and engaged all of my senses not just because they overloading them.

Excellent!

[Niffty951]

tigamilla said:

Excellent!

Thanks. Caught me in a moment of feeling passionate.

[SturdyHSV]

Niffty951 said:

I find it a thought provoking original post. In some respects I think it would be interesting for you to review your post immediately after being given a passenger ride in something that does 0-60 in sub 3 seconds.

I previously thought it would be a case of diminishing returns over 500hp ~4sec 0-60 cars (the likes of which I've owned and loved) but after one ride in a light weight R33 skyline with sticky track rubber and >800hp at the wheels my eyes were opened wide that such an out and out assault on the senses is a VERY different experience. With legs floating in free air, breath momentarily frozen and my entire body weight lifted out of the seat. It was enough to trigger my fight of flight reflex and provide me a moment of animal fear before instantly wanting to experience it again. I simply can't imagine that accelerating twice as fast as that could ever be dull, or leave you wanting more sensory input.

However (and it is a big however), the kind of lasting satisfaction and love for a car does not for me come from purely these moments.

The tactile feel and weighting of the controls, the vibrations and connection to the powertrain through the gearstick warm in your palm & linking you to the engine. The smell of hot metals, rich unburnt fuel and oils in the cabin the neural connection of feeling yourself integrate with the machinery, feeling it as an extension of your own body, wrapped around you and attached to your nervous system. Learning through necessity to understand its subtle movements, the shift of weight, tension and attitude in the suspension. Feeling the hold and scrabble of tyres on the road surface through your fingers. All those elements needing to be linked together to find one extra 10th and dance with the car down a road at speed.

This kind of life altering drive as rivaled by few experiences I've known and those types of sensations must be preserved/replaced as we move into this new era if we are going to produce truly great machines to enjoy. Cars like my TVR Cerbera or 944 turbo created strong and lasting memories because they involved and engaged all of my senses not just because they overloading them.

This is a very fortunate coincidence but I drove a Model 3 Performance at lunch time. First acceleration (admittedly from a roll of about 30mph) and my reaction was "oh OK", as it didn't feel particularly fast. I mean, it has largely the same torque and bhp as my (quite thoroughly modified) Monaro, it weighs about 200kg more and had 2 people in it as opposed to one, and I've had the Monaro so long that it also feels 'slow' basically as I'm used to it.

I was expecting the Tesla to perhaps feel quicker because of the instant and constant torque, but other than that initial rabid 0-30mph or so, it just sort of progressed, and because of the lack of drama all you were aware of was of the rate of acceleration constantly dropping off, it felt a bit like when you rev an engine too high beyond its peak power and it's just falling over, but it just sort of did that constantly.

It was strange, it didn't feel 'powerful' despite the comedy launching and acceleration. Oh and yes it was in sport mode (they don't have a ludicrous mode sadly).

As a means of transport I thought it was excellent, because of the quietness and the effortless and seamless power, it was a wonderfully calming way of making your way around, and as a commuting tool it would be extremely effective and I'm sure for the overwhelming majority of the population it would be 'the future'. Equally for me, as a commuting tool I'd love something similar as a means of transport, but I found it totally unengaging emotionally other than being very relaxing.

Edited by SturdyHSV on Friday 22 November 14:40

[LotusOmega375D]

She’s no looker is she. Looks dated already. Probably a technical tour de force, but for that sort of money it’s got to be an Evija.

[chelme]

Niffty951 said:

SturdyHSV said:

sidesauce said:

chelme said:

I really want to get excited about this vehicle - not too old and no luddite - BUT, I can't get excited about it.

Acceleration and speed - one dimensional.

We have 5 senses people. This just does not engage any but perhaps one: it looks unexeptional, will sound (I suspect) unexeptional and probably will feel heavy and at best unnatural, vegan or not.

What new vehicle gets you excited then?

I'd say I agree with him, in that it just doesn't get me excited at all etc., and to answer your question, current cars that do get me a bit exctied in varying degress:

MX-5, Mustang (the V8 one...), LC500 coupe and convertible, C63/E63, Giulia Quadrifoglio, anything with 'Hellcat' in the name.

There are probably a few more but not many to be honest, either way I thought I'd throw my hat into the ring for some scrutiny

I find it a thought provoking original post. In some respects I think it would be interesting for you to review your post immediately after being given a passenger ride in something that does 0-60 in sub 3 seconds.

I previously thought it would be a case of diminishing returns over 500hp ~4sec 0-60 cars (the likes of which I've owned and loved) but after one ride in a light weight R33 skyline with sticky track rubber and >800hp at the wheels my eyes were opened wide that such an out and out assault on the senses is a VERY different experience. With legs floating in free air, breath momentarily frozen and my entire body weight lifted out of the seat. It was enough to trigger my fight of flight reflex and provide me a moment of animal fear before instantly wanting to experience it again. I simply can't imagine that accelerating twice as fast as that could ever be dull, or leave you wanting more sensory input.

However (and it is a big however), the kind of lasting satisfaction and love for a car does not for me come from purely these moments.

The tactile feel and weighting of the controls, the vibrations and connection to the powertrain through the gearstick warm in your palm & linking you to the engine. The smell of hot metals, rich unburnt fuel and oils in the cabin. The neural connection of feeling yourself integrate with the machinery, feeling it as an extension of your own body, wrapped around you and attached to your nervous system. Learning through necessity to understand its subtle movements, the shift of weight, tension and attitude in the suspension. Feeling the hold and scrabble of tyres on the road surface through your fingers. All those elements needing to be linked together to find one extra 10th and dance with the car down a road at speed.

This kind of life altering drive as rivaled by few experiences I've known and those types of sensations must be preserved/replaced as we move into this new era if we are going to produce truly great machines to enjoy. Cars like my TVR Cerbera or 944 turbo created strong and lasting memories because they involved and engaged all of my senses not just because they were overloading them.

Edited by Niffty951 on Friday 22 November 14:34

Could not have expressed myself better @Niffty951. An excellent post, I feel in total agreement with.

I have driven a 458 Italia, accelerating it at a pretty fast rate and the lasting impression was not so much the sensation of acceleration and speed, but the look and sound of the car, the feel of the chassis and steering wheel

The most memorable experiences ( that have led me to continue buying classic cars) have been driving the old Alfa GTV, a beautiful and fun car to drive with lovely tactile steering, a rorty super responsive twin cam engine that crackled and popped on the overrun, naturally because of the way the carbs were set up, the feel of the gearshift; a long throw, but mechanical, the smell of the fuel air mixture combined with the scent of interior materials, the engagement with the car was full on and immersive, yet the little beauty did max 120mph with 0-60 in 8.9 secs. Notwithstanding this lack of speed, I entered another world totally devoid of the daily routine of cerebral life. Not that my life sucks - far from it.

The Lancia Delta is a more modern car, but still just as immersive for it provides a similar level of stimulation, and goes faster, but no so fast, that I feel I cannot enjoy a good B Road blast.

Another car was the 147 GTA, but I sold that after one year because whilst the engine was phenomenal (sounding like a 60s race car engine with a wizard exhaust) and the car looked lovely, the rest of car, i.e chassis, heavy engine front wheel drive etc, was not totally sorted, so I let that one go.

Electric cars will inevitably lack a significant level of engagement; no gears to shift, one linear surge...on the one hand I am left thinking I might as well go to a fun fair and take a ride on a rollercoaster, or get one purely as a luxury car; softly sprung and serene as a relaxing motorway mile muncher...

Edited by chelme on Friday 22 November 19:25

[Niffty951]

chelme said:

Could not have expressed myself better @Niffty951. An excellent post, I feel in total agreement with.

The most memorable experiences ( that have led me to continue buying classic cars) have been driving the old Alfa GTV, a beautiful and fun car to drive with lovely tactile steering, a rorty super responsive twin cam engine that crackled and popped on the overrun, naturally because of the way the carbs were set up, the feel of the gearshift; a long throw, but mechanical, the smell of the fuel air mixture combined with the scent of interior materials, the engagement with the car was full on and immersive, yet the little beauty did max 120mph with 0-60 in 8.9 secs. Notwithstanding this lack of speed, I entered another world totally devoid of the daily routine of cerebral life. Not that my life sucks - far from it.

The Lancia Delta is a more modern car, but still just as immersive for it provides a similar level of stimulation, and goes faster, but no so fast, that I feel I cannot enjoy a good B Road blast.

I do believe sir we speak the same language and having just read your article on the Lancia Delta Evo 2 (one of my favourite cars of all time, god damn I love early turbo cars).

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/features/opinion/car-...

I may even be one of those with a picture of your car. I saw one just like it on a visit to London where I went to see Dunkirk screened at the IMAX

[lotuslover69]

I think the Evija is the current leader in ridiculous ev hyper cars coming out at the moment