A sportscar shouldn’t have...

[blueg33]

talksthetorque said:

Well I’m impressed. Anyone else?

Nope

[nobrakes]

I’m sure that pre WW1, sports cars were only given rear brakes because brakes all round would be, well, unsporting old chap.

[blueg33]

nobrakes said:

I’m sure that pre WW1, sports cars were only given rear brakes because brakes all round would be, well, unsporting old chap.

The move from a tiller to a steering wheel was the end of any driver involvement

[Mandalore]

Winter Tyres.



What do I win? (Hopefully not a free sett of winter tyres for a sports car)

.

[MKnight702]

mat205125 said:

JuanGandini said:

Cheap budget / run flat tyres

This!!

Really don’t get why you can’t check out any list of classified ads, and see dozens of offerings of cheap, mismatched, and inappropriate tyres.

It’s where everything begins, for a fast and fun car, and no amount of investment of design or engineering will overcome deficiencies in rubber.

It’s the number one indicator, for me, of whether a car has been looked after and maintained properly.

I had cheap hard tyres on my Westfield XI and they were an essential part of the way the car handled, on track I could 4 wheel drift round the bends balanced on the throttle and it was the most fun I have had in a car! It may not have been the fastest car round the track but, for me, it was the most fun to drive. The other cars on the track had sticky trackday slicks and they were much faster round the bends but the gap between stick and twist was extremely narrow, plus their tyres were shot after one day, mine looked like new!

[bcr5784]

Maybe I missed it but in 17 pages has no-one said a sports car shouldn't have:

Cruise control?

Having a passenger in the passenger seat is fine - but not in the drivers seat too!

[blueg33]

bcr5784 said:

Maybe I missed it but in 17 pages has no-one said a sports car shouldn't have:

Cruise control?

Having a passenger in the passenger seat is fine - but not in the drivers seat too!

MIne has it, I just choose not to use it except in 50mph motorway roadworks. That's the beauty of things with an off switch

[Miserablegit]

Well, in light of the various discussions as to what constitutes a sports car I spent considerable time on the train this morning to come up with a scientific method of determining what constitutes a sports car - It is, as yet, unproven...

It looks like this:

The initial figure is calculated on the basis of the following:

Seating:
No. of seats

Gearbox
Manual gearbox +1
Dsg 0
Auto -1
None -5


Construction Material
Carbon Composite +2
Alloy +1
Plastic composite 0
Steel -1

Mass
Less than 1t +4
1-1.2t +3
1.2-1.4t +1
1.4-5t 0
More -1

Driven wheels
Rwd +3
Fwd +1
Awd 0 and if you have to ask it’s -2

Motive power
Fuel
Petrol +4
Diesel -100
EV -100

Electronic malarkey
Abs 0
Lane departure -1
Radar cruise -1
Facebook integration -50
Headlamp washers -1



Engine layout
V8 +4
V12 +1
6 pot +3
4 pot +2

Total all of that up and then divide the BHP per tonne by that figure.
If the result is less than 15.5 then it's a sportscar.

• might need the odd tweak!

[braddo]

bcr5784 said:

Maybe I missed it but in 17 pages has no-one said a sports car shouldn't have:

Cruise control?

Having a passenger in the passenger seat is fine - but not in the drivers seat too!

On the contrary - having cruise control is very useful for (quiet) motorway trips to and from track days and for continental cruising on the way to proper driving roads. Saves my energy for the fun driving.

[WJNB]

bcr5784 said:

Maybe I missed it but in 17 pages has no-one said a sports car shouldn't have:

Cruise control?

Having a passenger in the passenger seat is fine - but not in the drivers seat too!

A very silly observation & one I have noted over the years made by those who have never driven a car with cruise control. Or by those who have cruise control but lack the mental capacity to understand how best to use it.
It's presence has no relationship to the sporty nature of a car yet is a boon in helping to adhere to speed limits ( how easy it is to be distracted & unintentional speed) & most of all for making constant speed driving as on motorways strain free in terms of the muscular & mental.
The same silliness is often made about automatic gearboxes again by those who have never used one of lack the mental capacity ……..

[DoubleD]

WJNB said:

bcr5784 said:

Maybe I missed it but in 17 pages has no-one said a sports car shouldn't have:

Cruise control?

Having a passenger in the passenger seat is fine - but not in the drivers seat too!

A very silly observation & one I have noted over the years made by those who have never driven a car with cruise control. Or by those who have cruise control but lack the mental capacity to understand how best to use it.
It's presence has no relationship to the sporty nature of a car yet is a boon in helping to adhere to speed limits ( how easy it is to be distracted & unintentional speed) & most of all for making constant speed driving as on motorways strain free in terms of the muscular & mental.
The same silliness is often made about automatic gearboxes again by those who have never used one of lack the mental capacity ……..

Cruise control doesnt require any mental capacity to be used, thats the whole point of it, bit like an automatic gearbox.

[Gojira]

DoubleD said:

Cruise control doesnt require any mental capacity to be used, thats the whole point of it, bit like an automatic gearbox.

Most things don't need any mental capacity to use them, but to use them well is a whole different ballgame....

[DoubleD]

Gojira said:

DoubleD said:

Cruise control doesnt require any mental capacity to be used, thats the whole point of it, bit like an automatic gearbox.

Most things don't need any mental capacity to use them, but to use them well is a whole different ballgame....

Yes I agree, but cruise control isnt in various ballgames, you flick the switch and it holds the speed, simple.

[blueg33]

Miserablegit said:

Well, in light of the various discussions as to what constitutes a sports car I spent considerable time on the train this morning to come up with a scientific method of determining what constitutes a sports car - It is, as yet, unproven...

It looks like this:

The initial figure is calculated on the basis of the following:

Seating:
No. of seats

Gearbox
Manual gearbox +1
Dsg 0
Auto -1
None -5


Construction Material
Carbon Composite +2
Alloy +1
Plastic composite 0
Steel -1

Mass
Less than 1t +4
1-1.2t +3
1.2-1.4t +1
1.4-5t 0
More -1

Driven wheels
Rwd +3
Fwd +1
Awd 0 and if you have to ask it’s -2

Motive power
Fuel
Petrol +4
Diesel -100
EV -100

Electronic malarkey
Abs 0
Lane departure -1
Radar cruise -1
Facebook integration -50
Headlamp washers -1



Engine layout
V8 +4
V12 +1
6 pot +3
4 pot +2

Total all of that up and then divide the BHP per tonne by that figure.
If the result is less than 15.5 then it's a sportscar.

• might need the odd tweak!

Good start - but note that some of the new auto paddle shift torque converter boxes shift faster than twin clutch boxes. Also you havent got a score for a robotised manual eg Ferrari F1 box.

But I like it, if I have time tonight Ill turn it into a spread sheet then we can test it

Just did a trial run using these

evora f360 MG midget ferrari 488 911 audi a5 d

The only ones less than 15.5 were the Midget and the A5 diesel (thats because the A5 has a negative number)

Evora 400 - 18.86666667
Ferrari 360 - 18.93333333
Mg Midget - 5.866666667
Ferrari 488 - 28.64285714
991 s - 39.85714286
A5 3.0 tdi - -0.993243243

So Midget = sports car, Evora and 360 nearly sports cars, 488 and 911 definitely not, A5 misses by a mile but skewed

Edited by blueg33 on Tuesday 10th December 18:03

[DoubleD]

Oh great, just what we need!

[bcr5784]

WJNB said:

A very silly observation & one I have noted over the years made by those who have never driven a car with cruise control. Or by those who have cruise control but lack the mental capacity to understand how best to use it.
It's presence has no relationship to the sporty nature of a car yet is a boon in helping to adhere to speed limits ( how easy it is to be distracted & unintentional speed) & most of all for making constant speed driving as on motorways strain free in terms of the muscular & mental.
The same silliness is often made about automatic gearboxes again by those who have never used one of lack the mental capacity ……..

My last 4 cars have had it and although I am perfectly capable of using it I never do. It's useless unless it's adaptive in 50 limits. Limit, on the other hand is useful and will help you keep to speed limits if you want, without driving the car for you. My present car has both Cruise and Limit, I never use cruise but I sometimes use Limit.

[talksthetorque]

bcr5784 said:

My last 4 cars have had it and although I am perfectly capable of using it I never do. It's useless unless it's adaptive in 50 limits. Limit, on the other hand is useful and will help you keep to speed limits if you want, without driving the car for you. My present car has both Cruise and Limit, I never use cruise but I sometimes use Limit.

Surely it can’t be only me who matches speed in traffic or does a motorway overtake by increasing and decreasing cruise speed, and switching it off and on.

[DoubleD]

talksthetorque said:

bcr5784 said:

My last 4 cars have had it and although I am perfectly capable of using it I never do. It's useless unless it's adaptive in 50 limits. Limit, on the other hand is useful and will help you keep to speed limits if you want, without driving the car for you. My present car has both Cruise and Limit, I never use cruise but I sometimes use Limit.

Surely it can’t be only me who matches speed in traffic or does a motorway overtake by increasing and decreasing cruise speed, and switching it off and on.

Yep, you can drive at various speeds without pressing any peddles and just using cruise.

[Miserablegit]

blueg33 said:

Good start - but note that some of the new auto paddle shift torque converter boxes shift faster than twin clutch boxes. Also you havent got a score for a robotised manual eg Ferrari F1 box.

But I like it, if I have time tonight Ill turn it into a spread sheet then we can test it

Just did a trial run using these

evora f360 MG midget ferrari 488 911 audi a5 d

The only ones less than 15.5 were the Midget and the A5 diesel (thats because the A5 has a negative number)

Evora 400 - 18.86666667
Ferrari 360 - 18.93333333
Mg Midget - 5.866666667
Ferrari 488 - 28.64285714
991 s - 39.85714286
A5 3.0 tdi - -0.993243243

So Midget = sports car, Evora and 360 nearly sports cars, 488 and 911 definitely not, A5 misses by a mile but skewed

Edited by blueg33 on Tuesday 10th December 18:03

So if the result from the initial calculation is a negative then it isn’t a sportscar before we get to part 2 or we limit part 1 to a minimum of zero which means the outcome of the division will be division by zero.

Lotus must qualify so we need to tweak somehow.
Not something a clumsy as moving the limit- perhaps add more for reduced mass as that is where cars fall down these days ?

[bcr5784]

talksthetorque said:

Surely it can’t be only me who matches speed in traffic or does a motorway overtake by increasing and decreasing cruise speed, and switching it off and on.

Why would you do it that way rather than using the right hand pedal? Is it really easier? Anything that encourages a driver to reduce his concentration over the job in hand is, imo, a bad thing. A reminder - whether it be a beep or speed limiter - I can countenance, though, to be honest, I'd hope my concentration level didn't need one. (Regretably sometimes I get lazy too).