RE: Westfield SEIGHT | Spotted

[Equus]

300bhp/ton said:

I'm betting there is no weight saving running a Ford Pinto or even Crossflow over the RV8.

I'll take that bet.

For the record:

• Crossflow, complete with flywheel, clutch, distributor and twin Webers (but no exhaust manifold or alternator), I've weighed one myself at 107kg
• Pinto in a similar state is about 170kg (and is regarded as a bit of a boat anchor in a Seven type car).
• The Rover V8 has a dry, bare weight (without any ancillaries) of about 170kg (which is where the flawed comparison with the Pinto usually comes in), but 'dressed' to the equivalent level above, like-for-like, it's around 230kg.

In total, a Crossflow engined Westfield typically weighs around 560Kg (less if you're careful), and the SEight, as noted in the article, was about 100kg heavier. Might not sound much, but that's the equivalent of a pretty well-built bloke squatting under the bonnet at the front, and on this sort of car you could certainly feel it.

I drove the original SEight 330 factory demonstrator (the dark blue car, with a TVR engine on quad Dellortos and allegedly 330bhp), back in the day. It was an animal (in amostly good way) but understeered relatively heavily off-throttle, with the obvious potential for dramatic oversteer on demand. Certainly not a precision instrument compared to a 'normal' Locaterfield, but still a bloody good laugh in a giggling-hysterically-cos-you're-still-alive sort of way.

[Dusty964]

The other limiting factor if the v8 was range. A Westfields tank is hardly large.
My mates was terrible in that regard.
Mine was a xflow, hardly economical, but we stopped at virtually every sodding petrol station on the way to le mans to fill his up.
I had a go in the factory v8 demo, and a 2.0 litre Vauxhall whatever it was, the Vauxhall engined car handled far, far better than the v8.

Edited by Dusty964 on Tuesday 14th July 23:25

[Marc H]

1) Mate at work 20 yrs ago had one. Was taken out on the roundabouts of Farnborough Hants from the office (Lucent Tech) and was suitably terrified. My co car was Alfa 146ti in Verde Tropicale and he had it painted that colour.

2) I have an S2000, was out in it today around Kent. They are superb.

[s m]

Likewise, a friend built one in his spare time ( when he wasn’t building Gp A rally cars for Mazda and Nissan )

We’re all used to such performance nowadays but 0-100 in under 8 seconds nearly 30 years ago was still really something





It was brutally fast even as a point and squirt thing but once you were a bit more used to there wasn’t really anything around that could stay with it until we got our hands on big power turbo cars

There was mention of TVRs before but having experienced the factory 390SE demo a few years before ( first time I opened the door the dash binnacle fell off ) it was nowhere near in performance terms

Pleasant way to spend a sunny weekend though

[binnerboy]

There was a chap who had a yellow westfield seight who I saw at a track day and he used to compete in the sprints at castle combe.

His towcar was an audi RS2 Avant :-)

he was definitely an OAP.

very nice bloke

He drove his car well and was quick , it also sounded awesome , though I think the engine was a more modern v8, possibly a 4.2.

[dhutch]

I think it is generally accepted that for best handling, the RV8 is too heavy for the westfield.

HOWEVER; I also understand that setup well it will handle more then well enough to to be fun, gives you the V8 sound track, and as said at the time of launch was a reasonable option to the power level it gave.

Mine has a 2ltr ford 4pot in it. But it does mean Ive get to own or drive a v8 car.


Daniel

[Jules Henry]

I'd get rid of those Toyo T1R's though, I had a set of 195/50's on my Westy they were shockingly bad, especially with the 15 x 8" rims that Toybox tend to supply a bit too much stretch so it would feel like you were running off the edge of the rim, in the wet they were lethal, I switched to 13's & R888R's which is a great combo & surprisingly good in the wet

[300bhp/ton]

Equus said:

I'll take that bet.

For the record:

• Crossflow, complete with flywheel, clutch, distributor and twin Webers (but no exhaust manifold or alternator), I've weighed one myself at 107kg
• Pinto in a similar state is about 170kg (and is regarded as a bit of a boat anchor in a Seven type car).
• The Rover V8 has a dry, bare weight (without any ancillaries) of about 170kg (which is where the flawed comparison with the Pinto usually comes in), but 'dressed' to the equivalent level above, like-for-like, it's around 230kg.

In total, a Crossflow engined Westfield typically weighs around 560Kg (less if you're careful), and the SEight, as noted in the article, was about 100kg heavier. Might not sound much, but that's the equivalent of a pretty well-built bloke squatting under the bonnet at the front, and on this sort of car you could certainly feel it.

I drove the original SEight 330 factory demonstrator (the dark blue car, with a TVR engine on quad Dellortos and allegedly 330bhp), back in the day. It was an animal (in amostly good way) but understeered relatively heavily off-throttle, with the obvious potential for dramatic oversteer on demand. Certainly not a precision instrument compared to a 'normal' Locaterfield, but still a bloody good laugh in a giggling-hysterically-cos-you're-still-alive sort of way.

What about a Pinto?


I'm not claiming this is the best engine ever in these cars. But at the end of the day, a TVR Chim/Griff is an awesome bit of kit. So imagine essentially one of them with quite a bit of weight saving = the SEIGHT. Can't be a bad thing surely.

[Andy665]

I was lucky enough to own a Westfield with a V8 in it but rather higher spec than that.

V8 Developments 5.1 litre, fully balanced, Jenvey throttle bodies, dry sumped, standalone management, high lift cams etc etc, revved like no other Rover V8 I have experienced, would happily run out to the 6,500 rev limiter

Was good for 340bhp and 380 lb ft torque and did a 10.4sec qtr mile at Santa Pod

Was crazy quick, I will never own anything so stupid, wheelspin when changing from 4th to 5th etc but it was also a real pussycat, would pull cleanly from 20mph in 5th

Was set up very well, ran on Nitrons all round and only felt intimidating when using more than 1/4 throttle

The car I had had a lot of carbon on it and was really fast road spec, surprisingly comfortable on a longer journey but totally impractical with the custom made fuel cell leaving zero room for luggage and the oil tank at the bottom of the passenger footwell meaning that passengers feet tended to fry after a while - my 12 year old son still maintains it was the most comfortable car he has ever been in - he used to regularly fall asleep (or was he poisoned by fumes)

Was pleased I owned it but glad I got all sensible and bought a Tuscan :-)

Mine was completely immaculate, absolutely nothing needing doing to it, when sold had only done 10k miles from build and was bought by a 79 year old gentleman who wanted "one last roll of the dice"

Edited by Andy665 on Wednesday 15th July 10:21

[anonymous-user]

[quote=Andy665] Mine was completely immaculate, absolutely nothing needing doing to it, when sold had only done 10k miles from build and was bought by a 79 year old gentleman who wanted "one last roll of the dice"

Good for him - proper attitude

[SuperPav]

Are all of these wide body, or will the RV8 slip into one of the earlier narrowbody cars?

[Equus]

Andy665 said:

...only felt intimidating when using more than 1/4 throttle

Andy665 said:

....was bought by a 79 year old gentleman who wanted "one last roll of the dice"

Did they ever find all the pieces?

[dukebox9reg]

300bhp/ton said:

thiscocks said:

Certainly something different but for the sake of 200hp and a beefier torque curve I'm not sure it would be worth the weight penalty. Something this small and light hardly needs a load of low down torque anyway. I'd agree a high smaller reving 4cyl is a better choice but I'm sure this would be fun to experience.

I think you need to look at it in context. the RV8 is all aluminium. And nothing at like a classic big block V8. It is pretty light and compact, especially compared to the cast iron 4 pots that you may have found when this was first done.

I'm betting there is no weight saving running a Ford Pinto or even Crossflow over the RV8.

Wasn't there hardly any weight penalty swapping the 1.8 b series out for the 3.5 in the MGB?

[anonymous-user]

Andy665 said:

I was lucky enough to own a Westfield with a V8 in it but rather higher spec than that.

V8 Developments 5.1 litre, fully balanced, Jenvey throttle bodies, dry sumped, standalone management, high lift cams etc etc, revved like no other Rover V8 I have experienced, would happily run out to the 6,500 rev limiter

Was good for 340bhp and 380 lb ft torque and did a 10.4sec qtr mile at Santa Pod

Was crazy quick, I will never own anything so stupid, wheelspin when changing from 4th to 5th etc but it was also a real pussycat, would pull cleanly from 20mph in 5th

Was set up very well, ran on Nitrons all round and only felt intimidating when using more than 1/4 throttle

The car I had had a lot of carbon on it and was really fast road spec, surprisingly comfortable on a longer journey but totally impractical with the custom made fuel cell leaving zero room for luggage and the oil tank at the bottom of the passenger footwell meaning that passengers feet tended to fry after a while - my 12 year old son still maintains it was the most comfortable car he has ever been in - he used to regularly fall asleep (or was he poisoned by fumes)

Was pleased I owned it but glad I got all sensible and bought a Tuscan :-)

Mine was completely immaculate, absolutely nothing needing doing to it, when sold had only done 10k miles from build and was bought by a 79 year old gentleman who wanted "one last roll of the dice"

Edited by Andy665 on Wednesday 15th July 10:21

That’s wicked, bet it was real fun. Lovely.

[jet_noise]

300bhp/ton said:

Not really. But a lot of the V8's were low CR, strangled on twin SU or Stromberg carbs and in a heavy vehicle with TALL gearing. So they would appear lazy and unwilling to rev in such applications.

However a higher CR version with better gearing and maybe a wilder cam is a screamer of an engine. Obviously not the highest rpm, it is only a 2v per cylinder engine. You can make them rev high for race track use. But road use more around the 6000-6500rpm. But they are lovely and free revving.

This was my cammed 3.5 in my TR7 V8, obviously no SEIGHT, but the TR still only weighed just over a tonne. And was making approx 230hp on the dyno. Hitting just below 6500rpm before shifting.

That's the sound

[PurpleTurtle]

ate one too said:

A modern 2 litre 4 pot turbo would produce more horsepower and torque and be far more reliable than a shonky old Rover V8.

.... but doesn't have the sound of a V8, which is a huge part of this car's appeal.

I remember when the SEight was launched, it was brilliant. A huge part of the offering that you could build this yourself in your garage with an unstressed V8 engine that was readily available in Britain and had a wide range of tuning options if you wanted them.

Personally I would love to have this car for high days and holidays and, being a middle-aged duffer, would just want to wallow in its effortless torque as I traverse the countryside at a fair old lick, whilst avoiding getting my collar felt for being too silly. That probably sums up the demographic of most owners of these. I'd be in, if I had the space and time to enjoy it, but I don't.

[markcoopers]

SuperPav said:

Are all of these wide body, or will the RV8 slip into one of the earlier narrowbody cars?

Nope. the chassis rails on the narrow will not accommodate the V8. Westfield built a specific V8 chassis to take the torque but a few Wide chassis cars did get the engine swap and seem to survive.

I have had a X-flow, Pinto, CVH, V8, Zetec, and 4AGE powered Westfied's over the years, i loved my V8 (4.2 stoker kit from Real Steal) but for me the 4AGE and Zetec were the better engines suiting my driving style and needs. I never tracked the V8, but as a road weapon it was effortless to make swift progress (brakes were a weak point in scrubbing off the speed which always seemed more than you thought), but the rest of the car was not really reflective of the GT status. Just felt to be the wrong engine in the wrong car but nothing wrong with either.

I now have a TVR Chimaera 500......same engine and a far better marriage of engine and car purpose.

[Limpet]

300bhp/ton said:

I think you need to look at it in context. the RV8 is all aluminium. And nothing at like a classic big block V8. It is pretty light and compact, especially compared to the cast iron 4 pots that you may have found when this was first done.

Agreed that the RV8 is nowhere near as heavy as you might expect.

I remember helping a mate clear his garage, and in the corner was a bare Rover V8 block sitting on a pallet. I asked him to give me a lift with it, and he laughed and said “just pick it up!” And I did. The bare block is only about 25kg, IIRC.

Of course, a dressed engine is considerably more, but these were not heavy lumps for their size, at all.

Edited by Limpet on Wednesday 15th July 13:37

[dhutch]

markcoopers said:

SuperPav said:

Are all of these wide body, or will the RV8 slip into one of the earlier narrowbody cars?

Nope. the chassis rails on the narrow will not accommodate the V8. Westfield built a specific V8 chassis to take the torque but a few Wide chassis cars did get the engine swap and seem to survive.

I have had a X-flow, Pinto, CVH, V8, Zetec, and 4AGE powered Westfied's over the years, i loved my V8 (4.2 stoker kit from Real Steal) but for me the 4AGE and Zetec were the better engines suiting my driving style and needs. I never tracked the V8, but as a road weapon it was effortless to make swift progress (brakes were a weak point in scrubbing off the speed which always seemed more than you thought), but the rest of the car was not really reflective of the GT status. Just felt to be the wrong engine in the wrong car but nothing wrong with either.

I now have a TVR Chimaera 500......same engine and a far better marriage of engine and car purpose.

Yeah I was going to say, it was a bespoke chassis with I think thicker wall tubing, and only in widebody format.

The V8 also had its own bonnet with the huge scoop, which some use on other engines, but again there was no narrowbody v8 bonnet.

Technically it should be an SEiWeght not at SEieght! (SEi is narrow, SEiW is wide IRS)


Daniel

Daniel

[ChezzaV8]

I never really saw the point of the SEight. The rover V8 is not an engine for a sports car, not revvy, not powerful, and expensive to get any power out of. They make a nice noise, but that's about it. The idea of big engine in a small car makes sense when that big engine puts out big power, but the RV8 just doesn't!