Why can nobody overtake?
Discussion
Evil.soup said:
I would say its more an issue of clown overtaking in a car that doesn't have the pace to pass in such a short distance. Don't forget, the car they are passing could well be doing 40 to 50 so to pass safely in that space you would need something pretty quick. I can't tell for sure, but is it a MK5 Golf, possibly a GTi, but has the wrong wheels to be a GTi, so probably not even that.
Given that 5 Alive has just come around a blind bend onto that stretch of open bend, this Golf was just chancing his luck in hope that nobody else was coming. A quicker car would have been passed safely by this point.
A quicker car in the hands of a moron is not a recipe for safety.Given that 5 Alive has just come around a blind bend onto that stretch of open bend, this Golf was just chancing his luck in hope that nobody else was coming. A quicker car would have been passed safely by this point.
That driver has already demonstrated a lack of judgement, competence and competence. More speed will simply increase the danger.
911hope said:
Evil.soup said:
I would say its more an issue of clown overtaking in a car that doesn't have the pace to pass in such a short distance. Don't forget, the car they are passing could well be doing 40 to 50 so to pass safely in that space you would need something pretty quick. I can't tell for sure, but is it a MK5 Golf, possibly a GTi, but has the wrong wheels to be a GTi, so probably not even that.
Given that 5 Alive has just come around a blind bend onto that stretch of open bend, this Golf was just chancing his luck in hope that nobody else was coming. A quicker car would have been passed safely by this point.
A quicker car in the hands of a moron is not a recipe for safety.Given that 5 Alive has just come around a blind bend onto that stretch of open bend, this Golf was just chancing his luck in hope that nobody else was coming. A quicker car would have been passed safely by this point.
That driver has already demonstrated a lack of judgement, competence and competence. More speed will simply increase the danger.
A moron is a moron no matter what the situation and a moron will of course make moronic choices. This bloke would have just tried passing 2 at once in the same place if his car was quicker.
kuiper said:
havoc said:
No.
(Actually, off-topic, what ARE insurance companies going to do when it's EVs as far as the eye can see? Graduated licences? Switchable power modes?)
* Usually. The old boy who managed to shove his Yaris up a kerb, across a lawn and straight through the MiL's bedroom wall (ground-floor retirement apartment) 6 years ago clearly was trying harder. That was a Yaris...if he'd had an EV he'd probably have reached the lounge...where the MiL was sitting.
Funnily enough I was pondering exactly this the other day when looking at an Autocar article on the 'new' AR Giulia which will have like 450bhp in standard form, 750 for veloce and 1000+ for QV. It's not something I've really seen being discussed, but I could be wrong.(Actually, off-topic, what ARE insurance companies going to do when it's EVs as far as the eye can see? Graduated licences? Switchable power modes?)
* Usually. The old boy who managed to shove his Yaris up a kerb, across a lawn and straight through the MiL's bedroom wall (ground-floor retirement apartment) 6 years ago clearly was trying harder. That was a Yaris...if he'd had an EV he'd probably have reached the lounge...where the MiL was sitting.
The current Petrol QV is fast enough, and probably by far TOO fast for the vast majority of drivers. If i'd had mine when I was 17 or 18, I would probably be dead. It's probably not an unreasonable statement to say the majority of the driving public care not a jot about the skill of driving, and even for those who do it's fair to say that perceived ability /= actual skill. I'm generalising massively here, but with a few exceptions for YouTube stars and rappers I would wager most people who drive properly fast cars have worked their way up through a lot of lowered powered stuff to be able to handle the pace on offer.
We're about to wander into an environment where white goods day to day EV's are being sold on the basis of frankly ridiculous power outputs and instant massive torque, and I don't think for one second that the general public's driving skills are anything like up to it. Putting 500+ hp outputs alongside fairly basic chassis design into the hands of new drivers, old drivers, the sort of doris that just potters to the shops in her Zafira etc etc is going to be - imho, very dangerous.
Edited by kuiper on Friday 10th March 13:18
It will maybe be reflected in insurance premiums too, but the standard family road car will prob be a 7-8sec 0-60 type spec
People who opt for faster ones will have some interest in driving or be a minority buying higher end stuff
To go back to the thread title, I'd agree with the observation that many people are content to sit in a queue. I was driving back down the A5 from north Wales yesterday to the Midlands and there were queues of cars beetling along at 30 mph, on 60 mph limit roads. Obviously it was due to the weather conditions, but although there was a line of slush down the middle of each lane, the wheels didn't touch it and it wasn't below freezing so no ice. The biggest hazard was chunks of snow falling off the trees and going ' bang' on the roof!
Well, I touched the slush by overtaking, although the opportunities are less in a 1300 Triumph Toledo.
It would need a few people to turn off before I got the the chance to pass the slowest. And yes, I did get the flashing / honking for having the temerity to actually overtake, 
I didn't even get past 50 mph, I reduced speed overall because of the conditions but you didn't have to crawl along. I followed a HGV for miles, who wasn't hanging about.
Well, I touched the slush by overtaking, although the opportunities are less in a 1300 Triumph Toledo.
It would need a few people to turn off before I got the the chance to pass the slowest. And yes, I did get the flashing / honking for having the temerity to actually overtake, I didn't even get past 50 mph, I reduced speed overall because of the conditions but you didn't have to crawl along. I followed a HGV for miles, who wasn't hanging about.
dvshannow said:
Don’t think we are going to enter a future of progressively more ridiculous EVs - the current Teslas are not what everyone will be driving in 5y
It will maybe be reflected in insurance premiums too, but the standard family road car will prob be a 7-8sec 0-60 type spec
People who opt for faster ones will have some interest in driving or be a minority buying higher end stuff
Most likely. Although given how cheap electric motors are, I can see a MUCH higher proportion of EVs having high power outputs than is currently the case for ICE, as it'll be a selling point for all the German brands that we love so much...It will maybe be reflected in insurance premiums too, but the standard family road car will prob be a 7-8sec 0-60 type spec
People who opt for faster ones will have some interest in driving or be a minority buying higher end stuff
...so your current buyer of a 118i who just HAS to have that German badge on the bonnet will find themselves with the accelerative power of a current 340i (for example)*.
BUT...even the slower ones will still have properly-rapid 0-30 step-off acceleration. Which I can see causing problems for the more ham-footed drivers out there (and those near them).
* Unless the insurance industry step-in. But that's not happened yet.
kuiper said:
Currently high power usually comes with a much more developed car and is bought by a driver with at least 'good' ability
I'm doubtful that there's ever been much of a connection between driving aptitude and a will/capacity to procure a fast car. For a lot of people "the fast version" isn't mentally tied to an elevated driving experience, it's simply the "look at meeeiii" range-topper. The bullet headed thug filling his SVR, the mousy doctor in his twin motor Model S or the dappy celebrity/Arab kid in a supercar - do we think any of them have even an average level of judgement and foresight?Edited by kuiper on Friday 10th March 13:18
We've gone from 100hp Mk1 GTIs to, much more common, 320hp Golf Rs (other fast, mass-market cars are available) and the apocalypse hasn't arrived, even in part. My own experience of jumping, with a modicum of trepidation, from a wheezy 140hp to a 500+hp torque monster could be summed up in the sub-revelation "throttle inputs regulate engine outputs, and in modern production cars that relationship is linear and easily moderated."
Deranged Rover said:
Driving home from work last night on my usual country B-road when I found myself behind a Zafira that was in turn behind a tractor doing 20mph or so. No worries, there's a straight coming up and, when we get to it, the entire length of it is clear - more than enough for about 5 or 6 of us to overtake if necessary but luckily, it was only the Zafira and me.
Well, Zafira indicates and pulls out - good stuff, i think, i shall follow suit. Except that said Zafira then proceeded to accelerate ferociously to about 22mph and take the entire length of the straight section to overtake - I quickly realised what was going on and had to pull back in behind the tractor. Zafira then proceeds to pootle along in front of the tractor and only ends up a hundred yards or so in front of it by the time we hit the traffic lights a few miles later.
Obviosuly it was a Zafira so my expectations of driving standards were pretty low, but even I didn't expect this!
Things like this are incredibly frustrating, but you learn not to make assumptions when on the road. The keen overtaker will always keep certain rules in his/her head:Well, Zafira indicates and pulls out - good stuff, i think, i shall follow suit. Except that said Zafira then proceeded to accelerate ferociously to about 22mph and take the entire length of the straight section to overtake - I quickly realised what was going on and had to pull back in behind the tractor. Zafira then proceeds to pootle along in front of the tractor and only ends up a hundred yards or so in front of it by the time we hit the traffic lights a few miles later.
Obviosuly it was a Zafira so my expectations of driving standards were pretty low, but even I didn't expect this!
1. Never rely on being able to overtake a slow moving vehicle at a known overtaking opportunity unless you are the first vehicle in the queue behind it;
2. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you knows how to overtake;
3. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you even knows how to drive;
4. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you even knows you are there;
5. Never assume anyone will leave a gap for you or knows what a gap even is;
6. Always remember that stupid people that are behind you are far less able to cause you any trouble than stupid people in front of you;
7. Always try to convert stupid people in front of you into being behind you at the first safe opportunity;
8. Even if you can't overtake the whole queue in front of you, always take every opportunity to be the first vehicle in the queue even if it doesn't seem like there's any point - e.g. even if there's a dual carriageway a mile ahead, you can't necessarily rely on being able to get past the slow moving thing before the end of the DC due to the myriad of dodderers in front of you who will occupy lane two without actually trying to overtake anything;
9. Always complete the overtake as quickly as possible at the fastest safe speed, not only so that you are on the wrong side of the road for as short a time as possible but also to make it less likely someone else in the queue in front of you will be able to pull out and interrupt your manoevre;
10. Always have a very fast car....
modifiedrides said:
I guess some people have cars that are not even capable of overtaking 
This must be a large part of it. My every day driver is not exactly quick off the mark, but it does keep up with everyday traffic, and give me very good MPG figures, which is all I really wanted, and expected from it.If I want to over take things, I just use another car!
I guess the ones with the least options, are those who for a variety of very sound reasons, can only have one car.
king arthur said:
Deranged Rover said:
Driving home from work last night on my usual country B-road when I found myself behind a Zafira that was in turn behind a tractor doing 20mph or so. No worries, there's a straight coming up and, when we get to it, the entire length of it is clear - more than enough for about 5 or 6 of us to overtake if necessary but luckily, it was only the Zafira and me.
Well, Zafira indicates and pulls out - good stuff, i think, i shall follow suit. Except that said Zafira then proceeded to accelerate ferociously to about 22mph and take the entire length of the straight section to overtake - I quickly realised what was going on and had to pull back in behind the tractor. Zafira then proceeds to pootle along in front of the tractor and only ends up a hundred yards or so in front of it by the time we hit the traffic lights a few miles later.
Obviosuly it was a Zafira so my expectations of driving standards were pretty low, but even I didn't expect this!
Things like this are incredibly frustrating, but you learn not to make assumptions when on the road. The keen overtaker will always keep certain rules in his/her head:Well, Zafira indicates and pulls out - good stuff, i think, i shall follow suit. Except that said Zafira then proceeded to accelerate ferociously to about 22mph and take the entire length of the straight section to overtake - I quickly realised what was going on and had to pull back in behind the tractor. Zafira then proceeds to pootle along in front of the tractor and only ends up a hundred yards or so in front of it by the time we hit the traffic lights a few miles later.
Obviosuly it was a Zafira so my expectations of driving standards were pretty low, but even I didn't expect this!
1. Never rely on being able to overtake a slow moving vehicle at a known overtaking opportunity unless you are the first vehicle in the queue behind it;
2. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you knows how to overtake;
3. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you even knows how to drive;
4. Never assume anyone else in the queue in front of you even knows you are there;
5. Never assume anyone will leave a gap for you or knows what a gap even is;
6. Always remember that stupid people that are behind you are far less able to cause you any trouble than stupid people in front of you;
7. Always try to convert stupid people in front of you into being behind you at the first safe opportunity;
8. Even if you can't overtake the whole queue in front of you, always take every opportunity to be the first vehicle in the queue even if it doesn't seem like there's any point - e.g. even if there's a dual carriageway a mile ahead, you can't necessarily rely on being able to get past the slow moving thing before the end of the DC due to the myriad of dodderers in front of you who will occupy lane two without actually trying to overtake anything;
9. Always complete the overtake as quickly as possible at the fastest safe speed, not only so that you are on the wrong side of the road for as short a time as possible but also to make it less likely someone else in the queue in front of you will be able to pull out and interrupt your manoevre;
10. Always have a very fast car....
10. Absolutely
Pan Pan Pan said:
modifiedrides said:
I guess some people have cars that are not even capable of overtaking
This must be a large part of it. My every day driver is not exactly quick off the mark, but it does keep up with everyday traffic, and give me very good MPG figures, which is all I really wanted, and expected from it.If I want to over take things, I just use another car!
I guess the ones with the least options, are those who for a variety of very sound reasons, can only have one car.
I carried out some epic overtakes on the way to and through France in this beast... all 903cc of it. Couldn't afford the autoroute tolls and wouldn't have got there much quicker anyway. 40 odd years ago!
Then you have the t
ts who decide that they're going to overtake as you're going for your overtake so just pull out without a signal, cutting you up and nearly causing you to rear end them!
Like the absolute tool yesterday in a silver Golf with windows so tinted I couldn't even see the shape of the driver through the rear screen. Rear wiper hanging down, totally useless in all the rain and spray, and the st covering the rear of his car! I'm already overtaking and he pulls straight out, maximum of a foot in front of me, no 'kin signal, then proceeds to floor it. Probably thinking "Ha-ha, fk You, I am Driving God!" Believe me, he fkin isn't!
I've been moving into my new place, with all the stress that involves, and was on the way back to collect the last car load from my old place. Feeling slightly aggrieved that this little st decides to cut me up and then try and accelerate away leaving me cursing in his wake, I've got to admit I did lose it for a split second and set off after him with full beam held on for a good 5 seconds, and was catching the little bd!! Think he realized what a tt he'd been as he flashed his hazards a couple of times, hopefully in his version of, "Oops, Sorry, Didn't see you there!" I do hope so but the cynic in me thinks probably not. Any way, the little st turned right at the next roundabout and fked off, and I realized I'd almost dropped down to his level of ttishness, so carried straight on at a more sensible speed!
So, you get the tts who can't overtake, the tts who refuse to overtake, and the tts who dangerously overtake. They can ALL cause you problems and can ALL drive up your piss to boiling point. Next job is to get a dashcam fitted, for my own protection I hasten to add, not to post up spurious footage of 'bad driving' more as a record to show my side if the worst happened and one of these little tts did cause a crash!
Sorry for ranting but I think that's maybe helped get the sheer piss boiling anger over the little ahole out of my head 
ts who decide that they're going to overtake as you're going for your overtake so just pull out without a signal, cutting you up and nearly causing you to rear end them! Like the absolute tool yesterday in a silver Golf with windows so tinted I couldn't even see the shape of the driver through the rear screen. Rear wiper hanging down, totally useless in all the rain and spray, and the s
t covering the rear of his car! I'm already overtaking and he pulls straight out, maximum of a foot in front of me, no 'kin signal, then proceeds to floor it. Probably thinking "Ha-ha, fk You, I am Driving God!" Believe me, he fkin isn't!I've been moving into my new place, with all the stress that involves, and was on the way back to collect the last car load from my old place. Feeling slightly aggrieved that this little s
t decides to cut me up and then try and accelerate away leaving me cursing in his wake, I've got to admit I did lose it for a split second and set off after him with full beam held on for a good 5 seconds, and was catching the little bd!! Think he realized what a tt he'd been as he flashed his hazards a couple of times, hopefully in his version of, "Oops, Sorry, Didn't see you there!" I do hope so but the cynic in me thinks probably not. Any way, the little st turned right at the next roundabout and fked off, and I realized I'd almost dropped down to his level of ttishness, so carried straight on at a more sensible speed!So, you get the t
ts who can't overtake, the tts who refuse to overtake, and the tts who dangerously overtake. They can ALL cause you problems and can ALL drive up your piss to boiling point. Next job is to get a dashcam fitted, for my own protection I hasten to add, not to post up spurious footage of 'bad driving' more as a record to show my side if the worst happened and one of these little tts did cause a crash! Sorry for ranting but I think that's maybe helped get the sheer piss boiling anger over the little a
hole out of my head Short Grain said:
Then you have the tts who decide that they're going to overtake as you're going for your overtake so just pull out without a signal, cutting you up and nearly causing you to rear end them!
Like the absolute tool yesterday in a silver Golf with windows so tinted I couldn't even see the shape of the driver through the rear screen. Rear wiper hanging down, totally useless in all the rain and spray, and the st covering the rear of his car! I'm already overtaking and he pulls straight out, maximum of a foot in front of me, no 'kin signal, then proceeds to floor it. Probably thinking "Ha-ha, fk You, I am Driving God!" Believe me, he fkin isn't!
I've been moving into my new place, with all the stress that involves, and was on the way back to collect the last car load from my old place. Feeling slightly aggrieved that this little st decides to cut me up and then try and accelerate away leaving me cursing in his wake, I've got to admit I did lose it for a split second and set off after him with full beam held on for a good 5 seconds, and was catching the little bd!! Think he realized what a tt he'd been as he flashed his hazards a couple of times, hopefully in his version of, "Oops, Sorry, Didn't see you there!" I do hope so but the cynic in me thinks probably not. Any way, the little st turned right at the next roundabout and fked off, and I realized I'd almost dropped down to his level of ttishness, so carried straight on at a more sensible speed!
So, you get the tts who can't overtake, the tts who refuse to overtake, and the tts who dangerously overtake. They can ALL cause you problems and can ALL drive up your piss to boiling point. Next job is to get a dashcam fitted, for my own protection I hasten to add, not to post up spurious footage of 'bad driving' more as a record to show my side if the worst happened and one of these little tts did cause a crash!
Sorry for ranting but I think that's maybe helped get the sheer piss boiling anger over the little ahole out of my head
Do you feel better now? ts who decide that they're going to overtake as you're going for your overtake so just pull out without a signal, cutting you up and nearly causing you to rear end them! Like the absolute tool yesterday in a silver Golf with windows so tinted I couldn't even see the shape of the driver through the rear screen. Rear wiper hanging down, totally useless in all the rain and spray, and the s
t covering the rear of his car! I'm already overtaking and he pulls straight out, maximum of a foot in front of me, no 'kin signal, then proceeds to floor it. Probably thinking "Ha-ha, fk You, I am Driving God!" Believe me, he fkin isn't!I've been moving into my new place, with all the stress that involves, and was on the way back to collect the last car load from my old place. Feeling slightly aggrieved that this little s
t decides to cut me up and then try and accelerate away leaving me cursing in his wake, I've got to admit I did lose it for a split second and set off after him with full beam held on for a good 5 seconds, and was catching the little bd!! Think he realized what a tt he'd been as he flashed his hazards a couple of times, hopefully in his version of, "Oops, Sorry, Didn't see you there!" I do hope so but the cynic in me thinks probably not. Any way, the little st turned right at the next roundabout and fked off, and I realized I'd almost dropped down to his level of ttishness, so carried straight on at a more sensible speed!So, you get the t
ts who can't overtake, the tts who refuse to overtake, and the tts who dangerously overtake. They can ALL cause you problems and can ALL drive up your piss to boiling point. Next job is to get a dashcam fitted, for my own protection I hasten to add, not to post up spurious footage of 'bad driving' more as a record to show my side if the worst happened and one of these little tts did cause a crash! Sorry for ranting but I think that's maybe helped get the sheer piss boiling anger over the little a
hole out of my head I had a dangerous experience last weekend, but the Audi driver who hung me out to dry did it deliberately. He had left a consistent 10 car lengths to the car in front, so I thought I’d take advantage of it. As I went past, he accelerated to close the gap. I shouldn’t have fed the ejit's ego by giving him the finger as he went past, though his sign language was more prolific. I dropped in behind him and fell back. No point in provoking further f***wittery eg. a brake check etc. He turned off a couple of miles later.
Some people just don’t like being overtaken for various reasons. It’s no excuse for making the situation extremely dangerous though. They don’t just walk amongst us, they have driving licences too.
I came home yesterday from a few days away and a 400+ mile round-trip, and the single carriageway NSL roads were the best part of it!
Great scenery, flowing roads and not much traffic so I could safely overtake an artic stuck behind a tractor with a trailer on a clear stretch - although nobody else even tried.
Great scenery, flowing roads and not much traffic so I could safely overtake an artic stuck behind a tractor with a trailer on a clear stretch - although nobody else even tried.
Short Grain said:
8/10 rant
Nice work mate. Genuinely no sarcasm, I hope that post was cathartic. I do the same, it's nice to rant somewhere just to get it out of your system.Today I enjoyed overtaking a 900 year old guy in a van. 26mph everywhere. I lie, when I went to overtake him (on a 50mph road), he didn't like that and accelerated to, well, less than 48mph.
I was driving a car with 17bhp. I still find it incredible that I can overtake people within the spirit of the speed limit.
My go-to for "is this person a s
t driver" is if they don't bother to avoid potholes. Surely it's basic instinct that you don't drive into a big hole in the ground, but still. People never fail to surprise me.I had a Sprinter knocked into the huge oak tree at the end of my drive when a Mondeo decided to overtake without checking his mirrors... the sprinter was already overtaking him
Sprinter driver was understandably very upset, Mondeo driver stunk of weed
People not looking in the mirrors before overtaking is a real issue when you're on a bike as you're less visible and the speed differential tends to be greater
Sprinter driver was understandably very upset, Mondeo driver stunk of weed
People not looking in the mirrors before overtaking is a real issue when you're on a bike as you're less visible and the speed differential tends to be greater
TarquinMX5 said:
bigothunter said:
We need Intelligent Acceleration Assist alongside Intelligent Speed Assist with Remote Override for good measure 
And Non-Intelligent Driver Assist (if they could keep up with demand)
ClaphamBoxS said:
TarquinMX5 said:
bigothunter said:
We need Intelligent Acceleration Assist alongside Intelligent Speed Assist with Remote Override for good measure
And Non-Intelligent Driver Assist (if they could keep up with demand)Toyota already working prototype
https://youtube.com/shorts/H6P2b_GoPDg?feature=sha...
KTMsm said:
I had a Sprinter knocked into the huge oak tree at the end of my drive when a Mondeo decided to overtake without checking his mirrors... the sprinter was already overtaking him
Sprinter driver was understandably very upset, Mondeo driver stunk of weed
People not looking in the mirrors before overtaking is a real issue when you're on a bike as you're less visible and the speed differential tends to be greater
Happened last year when I was on my GS.Sprinter driver was understandably very upset, Mondeo driver stunk of weed
People not looking in the mirrors before overtaking is a real issue when you're on a bike as you're less visible and the speed differential tends to be greater
The guy slammed into the side of me and it was more good luck than skill that I didn’t come off. A thin line between a good story to tell your mates or a long stay in hospital or worse.
Still wrote my bike off with £11.5k worth of damage although to be fair the guy was extremely apologetic and admitted as much to his insurance company.
I had quite a scary experience that has never happened to me before in over 30 years of driving yesterday. I'm happily minding my own business doing about 50 on a 60 nsl road, when I see a Golf overtaking a load of cars up ahead, which I thought was fine because he will pull back in anytime soon. However he didn't and I had to come to a complete stop and he darted back in right at the last minute. It shook me up a bit to be honest and I thought that he was just going to crash into me head on.
I've had to hit the brakes and slow down a bit when people have been doing reckless overtaking manoeuvres before, but I've never had to come to a complete stop though, and I was lucky that I didn't have anyone behind me in fairness as well.
I've had to hit the brakes and slow down a bit when people have been doing reckless overtaking manoeuvres before, but I've never had to come to a complete stop though, and I was lucky that I didn't have anyone behind me in fairness as well.
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