Will Coronavirus hit used car prices? (Vol 2)

[sanguinary]

time waster said:

Court_S said:

Vroomer said:

flibbage0 said:

I'm sorry but car prices are dropping for anything with a big engine.

I've been tracking the price of the following:

-C63 AMG (N/A V8)
-E92 M3 V8
-B7 RS4
-XKR
-XFR

The price on WBAC/Motorway/Cazoo is ridiculously lower than the advertised price (Usually only slightly lower). For example advert on Autotrader will be up for £16k, WBAC will only give £9k.

These cars are not moving but the prices are hardly dropping, maybe £1k max after 2-3 months. For that reason I am waiting, something has got to give for cars with a large displacement.

I know people have seen prices go up but that's for stuff like a 2015+ Euro 6 compliant petrol/diesel or an EV/Hybrid.

Have you got actual prices matched to dates, or is this just a general impression?

The values being added don’t seem to reflect a drop in M3 prices. I still have a few searches from when I was serialising at the a new prices still look high to me.

Yes, just checking - my e92 M3 value has gone down by 25% on WBAC, compared to a few months ago.

I posted this a few weeks back, but this is my car based on WBAC. 2011 C63 Estate. 80,000 miles give or take.

It's difficult to find a direct comparison on Autotrader. Mine's an estate pre facelift PPP, so a bit of a cross over model. Selling privately, I'd be aiming for £19.5k I reckon. A dealer I've seen recently had a fairly close match for sale at £23.5k. The estates seem command a little more than the others, probably as there are fewer of them available.

I've compared a mate's reg and WBAC doesn't appear to differentiate between standard and PP/PPP.

[time waster]

similar to my M3

[MDMA .]

Been looking at a few 2011/12 BMW 320d Tourings/Alpina D3 recently. WBAC valuation for these seems to have tanked recently (compared to advertised price). Are pre Euro 6 diesels now completely unwanted? I know D3’s are hard to price, but advertised prices are more than double the valuation. Standard 320D now showing less than £2k for a low mileage, full history car.

[Tagteam]

MDMA . said:

Been looking at a few 2011/12 BMW 320d Tourings/Alpina D3 recently. WBAC valuation for these seems to have tanked recently (compared to advertised price). Are pre Euro 6 diesels now completely unwanted? I know D3’s are hard to price, but advertised prices are more than double the valuation. Standard 320D now showing less than £2k for a low mileage, full history car.

Dealers will hold on til as long as possible . But won’t want to take on expensive stock .

[Canyon78]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.am-online.com/amp...


https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/used-car-p...

[Fusion777]

The i have a headline today suggesting that interest rates are likely to go up another 2% over the next 4 months, with 0.75% coming tomorrow. To counter, there will be a reversal of the NI increase soon and there’s talk of more tax cuts in future such as a 1p income tax drop.

These won’t counter increased mortgage costs though for many people.

[Niponeoff]

Seems to be a few youtube clips of the auto loan problem in the US. not sure how much of a problem it is.

So many defaults that the banks are left with a ton of seized cars, but they cant sell them quickly otherwise they will flood the market and reduce the value of the very cars they now own. Bit of a conundrum? seems to be driven by a lot of younger folk taking out loans they cant afford, which isn't all that surprising to me.

I'm not sure how true it all is, but it has been widely reported.

Seems to me that the loan were given based on a much higher value of the car, which now depreciates, far lower than the loan value - person defaults nd hands the car back, bank is stuck with debt from someone who cant pay.. Guess it all mounts up and has been massively exacerbated by the recent price increases of cars, resulting in bigger loans and more defaults.

[AlexNJ89]

Niponeoff said:

Seems to be a few youtube clips of the auto loan problem in the US. not sure how much of a problem it is.

So many defaults that the banks are left with a ton of seized cars, but they cant sell them quickly otherwise they will flood the market and reduce the value of the very cars they now own. Bit of a conundrum? seems to be driven by a lot of younger folk taking out loans they cant afford, which isn't all that surprising to me.

I'm not sure how true it all is, but it has been widely reported.
.

I don't buy that, banks are selfish and competitive and they'd happily crash a market for their own profits.

It just takes one of their competitors to decide to pull the trigger and sell them all and their own stock crashes.

They'd be racing to be the first to sell off their stock.

[vikingaero]

AlexNJ89 said:

Niponeoff said:

Seems to be a few youtube clips of the auto loan problem in the US. not sure how much of a problem it is.

So many defaults that the banks are left with a ton of seized cars, but they cant sell them quickly otherwise they will flood the market and reduce the value of the very cars they now own. Bit of a conundrum? seems to be driven by a lot of younger folk taking out loans they cant afford, which isn't all that surprising to me.

I'm not sure how true it all is, but it has been widely reported.
.

I don't buy that, banks are selfish and competitive and they'd happily crash a market for their own profits.

It just takes one of their competitors to decide to pull the trigger and sell them all and their own stock crashes.

They'd be racing to be the first to sell off their stock.

I agree. Banks and finance houses are not in the business of holding and insuring car stock. They'll want out ASAP, even if the cars sell for pennies as they can offset losses and play financial trickery bks on the balance sheets.

[PBCD]

AlexNJ89 said:

I don't buy that, banks are selfish and competitive and they'd happily crash a market for their own profits.

It just takes one of their competitors to decide to pull the trigger and sell them all and their own stock crashes.

They'd be racing to be the first to sell off their stock.

Wasn't the above the entire premise of the film 'Margin Call'?

[Pommy]

AlexNJ89 said:

Niponeoff said:

Seems to be a few youtube clips of the auto loan problem in the US. not sure how much of a problem it is.

So many defaults that the banks are left with a ton of seized cars, but they cant sell them quickly otherwise they will flood the market and reduce the value of the very cars they now own. Bit of a conundrum? seems to be driven by a lot of younger folk taking out loans they cant afford, which isn't all that surprising to me.

I'm not sure how true it all is, but it has been widely reported.
.

I don't buy that, banks are selfish and competitive and they'd happily crash a market for their own profits.

It just takes one of their competitors to decide to pull the trigger and sell them all and their own stock crashes.

They'd be racing to be the first to sell off their stock.

Not quite, because in doing so they then crash their remaining assets they have liens over, which in turn ends up with people just giving them back (certainly in the US) as it's not economically beneficial to keep it and exacerbates the issue.

Most financial institutions will try and keep the possession, and debt, in play with the borrower for as long as possible whilst there's a chance they'll still get paid.

[Fast Bug]

So the dream of cheap cars from the auction... I've just seen a post from a trader elsewhere that's spent 3 months trying to return a car he bought from BCA with the following;

Starting/cutting out problem. Loses all power including the power steering

Bad remap and DPF has been removed

Tape on the dash covering up engine management light, glow pluf and collision assist

None of the above are mentioned on the report, which is why we as a group don't buy from auction. These kind of faults aren't unusual, and it's not uncommon for them to not be listed when it goes through auction.

Auctions really aren't as great as people think. If you'd bought that car and not managed to return it (most traders end upthreatening to not buy again), it would cost youmore than buying it retail from a dealer with some kind of protection.

[sam303]

flibbage0 said:

I do. Jaguar XFR advertised for £16k on Autotrader, maximum trade in value I can find is £9450 on Motorway.

XKR for sale £21000, trade in value is £14000.

Yes I understand that the trade in value is not the same as the market price but the difference is huge when it only used to be a small amount.

For example I was tracking an XKR with the speed pack, 105k miles and it was up for around £17k. Trade in value was £15-16k, this was around September-October 2021.

I have seen an SLK55 AMG for sale on Autotrader, based in Golders Green, lovely example. Earlier this year it was for sale around £18k, now it's £16k.

Anyone who thinks V8 sports cars aren't dropping value are quite frankly in denial.

Fibbage0, you are right. I know this because I am one such seller of an XFR, with a wide gap between my asking price and the trade in price

In my defence, it's fabulous and I don't really want to sell it.

[chickenbarns]

WBAC is not a good barometer of used car price. There is a looming ban on petrol will only raise the price of interesting cars next year. Take a look at price of interesting cars they are already climbing.

-CB

[johnnyBv8]

chickenbarns said:

WBAC is not a good barometer of used car price. There is a looming ban on petrol will only raise the price of interesting cars next year. Take a look at price of interesting cars they are already climbing.

-CB

Funny, AV185 used to relentlessly make the same assertion

[Seraph14]

Fast Bug said:

So the dream of cheap cars from the auction... I've just seen a post from a trader elsewhere that's spent 3 months trying to return a car he bought from BCA with the following;

Starting/cutting out problem. Loses all power including the power steering

Bad remap and DPF has been removed

Tape on the dash covering up engine management light, glow pluf and collision assist

None of the above are mentioned on the report, which is why we as a group don't buy from auction. These kind of faults aren't unusual, and it's not uncommon for them to not be listed when it goes through auction.

Auctions really aren't as great as people think. If you'd bought that car and not managed to return it (most traders end upthreatening to not buy again), it would cost youmore than buying it retail from a dealer with some kind of protection.

I'm aware of this. However, when you buy from a dealer (at least the sort of cars I'm looking for in the up to £8k range) you are often effectively buying from the auction indirectly anyway. I often see cars come up for sale at dealers which use the auction photos first, so it's evident that the dealer has just bought the car online at auction without even seeing it in person himself. When it gets delivered, the photos get updated.

I don't believe dealers typically check these cars over much, they just clean them up (if they even do that) and sell it on, pocketing their fat profit. If you have any problems they usually don't want to know. Consumer law is very weak, and dealers know that very well. The consumer has plenty of rights on paper, but enforcing them is another matter, if the dealer doesn't play ball.

[Pommy]

johnnyBv8 said:

chickenbarns said:

WBAC is not a good barometer of used car price. There is a looming ban on petrol will only raise the price of interesting cars next year. Take a look at price of interesting cars they are already climbing.

-CB

Funny, AV185 used to relentlessly make the same assertion

Did he also pointlessly leave his signature at the end of every post?

-P

[chickenbarns]

johnnyBv8 said:

chickenbarns said:

WBAC is not a good barometer of used car price. There is a looming ban on petrol will only raise the price of interesting cars next year. Take a look at price of interesting cars they are already climbing.

-CB

Funny, AV185 used to relentlessly make the same assertion

which is?

-CB

[ghost83]

chickenbarns said:

WBAC is not a good barometer of used car price. There is a looming ban on petrol will only raise the price of interesting cars next year. Take a look at price of interesting cars they are already climbing.

-CB

Aren’t we 13yrs off that?

[2ono]

Took my 911 in for its first MOT today, it would seem there is no real downturn for used prices at the moment as I was offered £105k by the dealer, OPC, to buy it from me today, he said they would go a bit higher if I purchased another car from them, paid £110k for it in Feb 2020, car was 4 months old at the time.