18% of California EV drivers move back to ICE

[Fatherdougal]

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News...

Interesting! I know many EV drivers here on PH state that once driven you'll never go back but guess Americans don't necessarily share the same sentiment..

[vaud]

No hint of bias from that website.

[Fatherdougal]

Err, the study's from the University of California. So maybe you'd feel more comfortable with pretty much the same article but a touchier feelier website name?

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-021-00814-9...

[so called]

Sounds reasonable to me.
Earlier EV's charging times are slow, especially with the US 110v domestic supply.

82% kept their EV's.

Edited by so called on Tuesday 4th May 08:10

[sjg]

Full paper here: https://escholarship.org/uc/item/11n6f4hs

One big factor is that manufacturers put out crazy cheap leases in the US because they had to sell EVs in markets like California to be allowed to sell ICE cars.

38% of Fiat EV owners (the compliance 500e) discontinued vs 10% of Tesla owners. So it suggests some people were happy to have a cheap EV for a couple of years but less keen to spend a lot more when the lease ended.

[Lexington59]

I like the torque and acceleration. But until they fix the range, charging time and charging infrastructure I'll keep my ICE thanks.

I also hear hydrogen is far quicker to refuel, has good range just no infrastructure. Maybe they should start funding this ?

Perhaps the 'end of an era' propaganda and the 2030 ban we continually hear about from eco loons is a bit of an exaggeration.

Still any excuse is a good one to continue to enjoy large capacity ICEs for a while yet...

[Filibuster]

I have never understood, why the americans stil use 120V / 60 Hz instead of 230V / 50 Hz.

[Truckosaurus]

sjg said:

...
One big factor is that manufacturers put out crazy cheap leases in the US ....

I think you could lease the electric Fiat 500 for something silly like $50 a month at one stage. Almost free motoring....

It would be interesting (*not enough to read the full paper) to see a breakdown of stats on people who had the EV as an additional car to an ICE car to those running one as their only vehicle.

[vaud]

Fatherdougal said:

Err, the study's from the University of California. So maybe you'd feel more comfortable with pretty much the same article but a touchier feelier website name?

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-021-00814-9...

People who bought first gen vehicles are disappointed (bought EVs between 2012 and 2018) and in a market where petrol is very cheap.

I'm not shocked.

[vaud]

The counter view would be "82 % continuance rate for battery electric vehicle owners for a first generation new technology"

[Fatherdougal]

vaud said:

The counter view would be "82 % continuance rate for battery electric vehicle owners for a first generation new technology"

That is a counter-view - albeit a very skewed one. I'd be very surprised if 18% of early adopters of CD players went back to cassette. Or 18% of early mobile users gave them up and went back to landlines. Given they are supposed to be te future of motoring and the only option to buy new from 2030, I'd say this shows why the takeup isn't anywhere near where it needs to be, given all the propaganda we get on EVs.

[ChocolateFrog]

EVs must also be a hard sell in the US unless you're a Tesla dealer in southern California

There's no way I'd drive an EV if fuel was $3 a gallon.

[Sheepshanks]

Filibuster said:

I have never understood, why the americans stil use 120V / 60 Hz instead of 230V / 50 Hz.

I don't understand why we (UK etc) still drive on the left. Although I suppose with EVs it becomes easier to engineer both.

[austinsmirk]

ChocolateFrog said:

EVs must also be a hard sell in the US unless you're a Tesla dealer in southern California

There's no way I'd drive an EV if fuel was $3 a gallon.

This. We have an EV due to the fact it’s virtually cost neutral to own and drive. But if I lived in the land of the free and guns I’d have a massive fuel guzzling car.

If you can get cars to run on minced cats or UKIP voters, I’d happily drive that but technology hasn’t evolved that far yet

[ChocolateFrog]

Sheepshanks said:

Filibuster said:

I have never understood, why the americans stil use 120V / 60 Hz instead of 230V / 50 Hz.

I don't understand why we (UK etc) still drive on the left. Although I suppose with EVs it becomes easier to engineer both.

It must still be a reasonable percentage of the cars made. The UK, Japan and Australia alone must account for 20% or so of all cars sold.

[ashenfie]

Fatherdougal said:

That is a counter-view - albeit a very skewed one. I'd be very surprised if 18% of early adopters of CD players went back to cassette. Or 18% of early mobile users gave them up and went back to landlines. Given they are supposed to be te future of motoring and the only option to buy new from 2030, I'd say this shows why the takeup isn't anywhere near where it needs to be, given all the propaganda we get on EVs.

I think I saw another stat that said only 75% of uk with PHEV never charged them.

[ATG]

Fatherdougal said:

vaud said:

The counter view would be "82 % continuance rate for battery electric vehicle owners for a first generation new technology"

That is a counter-view - albeit a very skewed one. I'd be very surprised if 18% of early adopters of CD players went back to cassette. Or 18% of early mobile users gave them up and went back to landlines. Given they are supposed to be te future of motoring and the only option to buy new from 2030, I'd say this shows why the takeup isn't anywhere near where it needs to be, given all the propaganda we get on EVs.

I wouldn't go casting "very skewed" around after writing you original post. Seriously, look at the stuff you've written.

[Fatherdougal]

ATG said:

I wouldn't go casting "very skewed" around after writing you original post. Seriously, look at the stuff you've written.

Seriously, I have and I'm very happy with it, thanks!

[kambites]

Fatherdougal said:

... but guess Americans don't necessarily share the same sentiment..

It would seem that 82% of them do, which is quite a lot!

[vaud]

I think 82% loyalty is pretty good in a market where petrol is very cheap and regulations still broadly favour ICE.

Uptake will be driven by supply (a car people like driving with sufficient range for most use-cases) and demand (which will be more complex and driven by societal pressure and legislation (direct and indirect tax, emissions)... it will take a generation but so did most phases of industrial revolutions.