RE: Musk cancels Tesla Model S Plaid+

[Dave Hedgehog]

h0b0 said:

J4CKO said:

Elon Musk is many things but I dont think he is one to rest on his Laurels, from a dead start he now has a four car model range.

Tesla may have had the “dead start” but Elon didn’t. Despite what everything says, Musk is not a founder of Tesla. He was an early investor with a small amount of cash. When he was ready to ramp up and get serious he made it a requirement that he be called a founder. This was several years after the company started.

The true founders released a video recently explaining that it was just Musk and his way so they let him have the title.

Edited by h0b0 on Tuesday 8th June 13:06

there were 3 staff when Ol' Muskly joined up, so in reality they had next to fk all to do with what Tesla is now, and none of the other founders have gone on to make their own EV cars or space ships etc

[h0b0]

Dave Hedgehog said:

h0b0 said:

J4CKO said:

Elon Musk is many things but I dont think he is one to rest on his Laurels, from a dead start he now has a four car model range.

Tesla may have had the “dead start” but Elon didn’t. Despite what everything says, Musk is not a founder of Tesla. He was an early investor with a small amount of cash. When he was ready to ramp up and get serious he made it a requirement that he be called a founder. This was several years after the company started.

The true founders released a video recently explaining that it was just Musk and his way so they let him have the title.

Edited by h0b0 on Tuesday 8th June 13:06

there were 3 staff when Ol' Muskly joined up, so in reality they had next to fk all to do with what Tesla is now, and none of the other founders have gone on to make their own EV cars or space ships etc

Yeah, but he did not found the company and he did not come up with the original idea.

The Ray Kroc Story

[WestyCarl]

h0b0 said:

Yeah, but he did not found the company and he did not come up with the original idea.

The Ray Kroc Story

Well if you're being pedantic the first ev was sometime in the late 1800's.

Elon Musk may come across as a bit of a t***, but he built companies that can routinely land rockets and changed the automotive industry, both in a very short space of time.

An incredible person (although I think working for him would be tough)

[98elise]

h0b0 said:

98elise said:

h0b0 said:

98elise said:

h0b0 said:

J4CKO said:

Elon Musk is many things but I dont think he is one to rest on his Laurels, from a dead start he now has a four car model range.

Tesla may have had the “dead start” but Elon didn’t. Despite what everything says, Musk is not a founder of Tesla. He was an early investor with a small amount of cash. When he was ready to ramp up and get serious he made it a requirement that he be called a founder. This was several years after the company started.

The true founders released a video recently explaining that it was just Musk and his way so they let him have the title.

Edited by h0b0 on Tuesday 8th June 13:06

The two founders had been in business about 9 months with no money and no car when Musk joined them.

He raised over 100m in various rounds of funding, with the first car coming a few years later. Even then it was just a limited run Elise variant. 15 years on Tesla have expanded globally selling multiple models and are an 80bn company.

I'm not sure what the two original guys think they achieved in the original 9 months, but on balance I would say Musk was the person who built Tesla as we know it today.

I did not dispute that he had a significant impact on the success of Tesla from early on. I am sure the original team would not have had the same level of success without Elon. But, was he an original founder? No. Well, not until he sued to become one. Did he have the original concept. Again, no. He evolved it to take advantage of the beneficial tax laws, without which Tesla would not exist today.

When did he sue to become a co-founder? One of the original 2 founders (who was sacked) sued Tesla/Musk for libel, and one of the outcomes was Musk being named a co-founder.

Musk doesn't like being labeled investor because he's very hands on with design/engineering etc.

You are correct. Elon put it in the investment package that he got the title. It was a deal breaker for Elon. The legal battle came when one of the original founders was moved aside in 2009. Elon was very hands on with the roadster insisting on many design choices. At this stage he was less involved in the day to day running of the company so I can see how he did not want to be "just an investor".

But, I can call myself anything, and act in any manner, but that does not make it true. Elon did not come up with the car/computer/technology concept. He loved it and invested huge amounts of money. Elon elevated the company by targeting beneficial tax situations. If it was not for the cut in Company car tax in the UK 0 Teslas would have been sold. This was even more relevant in the US. It is where Fisker failed and Tesla succeeded. If you read my previous posts I have said I would respect Elon if it was not for the recent constant lies.

Why do you think zero would have been sold? When the 3 was announced they got 300,000 orders (including me) in the first week alone. When we went to order (at Bluewater) there were at least 3 other people ordering at the same time, we had to wait for a terminal to come free.

How many companies would be placing orders for a car that wasn't available for sale in the UK? In the end it was 3 years between reveal and it being available here. That's a long time to wait for a company car.

[Clive Milk]

The issue with Tesla is that the rest of the world is trying to make hay today, somewhat belatedly, whilst Tesla is still promising jam tomorrow with

1. Tesla Roadster v2
2. The Semi.
3. The bulletproof steel cybertruck with poor NCAP pedestrian rating.
4. FSD. Fully Self Deluded

The latter is the most amazing promise yet.

They have spent years getting it up to scratch after saying robotaxis and they are on hardware version 4 or so and XX for the software and they seem no closer.

And then they said they will get rid of LIDAR and just go all visual, as if they had already perfected it and were just fine tuning it .. you have to laugh,.

Once the germans get up to speed the 2 sedans, one old SUV and the hatchback with poor vehicle construction will be under pressure. A bit like this



Elon is Pike ... don't panic ...

I am sure he has smoked so much stuff he is turning into the next Gerald Ratner. Everything that glistens is not gold in the Tesla promised land of milk and honey.



He should have named his baby General_X_Custer rather than r2d2_CU20

which would have been far more appropriate considering how badly Teslas are screwed together.

[anonymous-user]

Musk promises Mars on a stick and when he only delivers the Moon, Dave from Swindon says he's a twzt.

[ddom]

WestyCarl said:

Well if you're being pedantic the first ev was sometime in the late 1800's.

Elon Musk may come across as a bit of a t***, but he built companies that can routinely land blow rockets up and changed the automotive industry, both in a very short space of time.

An incredible person (although I think working for him would be tough)

EFA

He's example of why you don't want someone who was bullied as a child to be your CEO

[Davismatt]

So basically they couldn't make the new battery tech work and so were unable to deliver the promised range improvement. That's going to be the reality as opposed to the Musk spin job.

[WestyCarl]

ddom said:

WestyCarl said:

Well if you're being pedantic the first ev was sometime in the late 1800's.

Elon Musk may come across as a bit of a t***, but he built companies that can routinely land blow rockets up and changed the automotive industry, both in a very short space of time.

An incredible person (although I think working for him would be tough)

EFA

He's example of why you don't want someone who was bullied as a child to be your CEO

From google: Since June 2010, rockets from the Falcon 9 family have been launched 124 times, with 122 full mission successes, one partial failure and one total loss of spacecraft. In addition, one rocket and its payload were destroyed on the launch pad during the fueling process before a static fire test.

EFA

[ddom]

WestyCarl said:

From google: Since June 2010, rockets from the Falcon 9 family have been launched 124 times, with 122 full mission successes, one partial failure and one total loss of spacecraft. In addition, one rocket and its payload were destroyed on the launch pad during the fueling process before a static fire test.

EFA

Take your turn. I’m sure he’ll cover the funeral expenses

[5harp3y]

Here's this shiny new 520 mile model

Nope doesn't exist

Cancelled

Absolute vapourware

[hyphen]

fblm said:

Musk promises Mars on a stick and when he only delivers the Moon, Dave from Swindon says he's a twzt.

It's under promise and over deliver. Not over promise and under deliver.

[WestyCarl]

hyphen said:

fblm said:

Musk promises Mars on a stick and when he only delivers the Moon, Dave from Swindon says he's a twzt.

It's under promise and over deliver. Not over promise and under deliver.

I can't work out if he sets public crazy goals (over promises) on purpose to push his companies to achieve them.

Or he just can't help himself........

[hyphen]

WestyCarl said:

I can't work out if he sets public crazy goals (over promises) on purpose to push his companies to achieve them.

Or he just can't help himself........

He gets paid on share price increases. Billions.
Tesla raise cheap cash as the share price is booming.

It's carefully planned and he is at the top of his game.

[Talksteer]

Clive Milk said:

The issue with Tesla is that the rest of the world is trying to make hay today, somewhat belatedly, whilst Tesla is still promising jam tomorrow with

1. Tesla Roadster v2
2. The Semi.
3. The bulletproof steel cybertruck with poor NCAP pedestrian rating.
4. FSD. Fully Self Deluded

Tesla is scaling up BEV production at more than twice the rate of the nearest competitor (even more if you consider the price of the vehicles).

VW, Toyota etc also have concept cars and nebulous promises of solid state batteries in the future. Many of the other major companies have some form of investment in self driving.

The Muskverse approach is to schedule with the assumption of success and prioritise action over analysis, occasionally it results in delays to the stated timelines, but normally it still results in the actual product shipping well before any rival's product.

• The Model S was 2 years late and about 6 years before anyone produced a remotely comparable car

• The Tesla Roadster will have performance comparable to a Rimac but at 1/10th the price with twice the range

• The Tesla Semi has been delayed by the fact that as they were cell constrained it made more sense to build 10 Model 3's than one Semi. It is still more capable than anything anyone else has announced.

• Full self driving is still making progress, see what the people on the FSD Beta tests cars can do. Remmeber that Tesla is taking on a much more difficult challenge than most of the other competitors which have their cars geofenced to areas that are 3D mapped and have to carry LIDAR. FSD will look silly right up to the point that it just works, it won't matter if that is this year or next year or five years from now it will be massively disruptive.

[Dave Hedgehog]

Clive Milk said:

Once the germans get up to speed the 2 sedans, one old SUV and the hatchback with poor vehicle construction will be under pressure. A bit like this



Elon is Pike ... don't panic ...

the germans are all playing at EVs with tiny production run, inefficent and badly packaged premium cars

except maybe VW who are the only ones going to be making at scale in the near future

the real danger for Tesla and the rest of the industry is China who are surging ahead of the game and producing in volume at lower prices

Nio's battery swap technology makes Tesla's charging infrastructure advantage mute and solves all the problems of those with no home charging

[Dave Hedgehog]

5harp3y said:

Here's this shiny new 520 mile model

Nope doesn't exist

Cancelled

Absolute vapourware

its more worrying than that, it suggests that development of the car has found a problem with the new larger battery tech, maybe a charge control or a thermal control problem

if this is the case it will hold Tesla back

[hyphen]

Talksteer said:

• The Model S was 2 years late and about 6 years before anyone produced a remotely comparable car

There was no public demand for EVs, ICE cars were selling well so the manufacturers had no reason to go this route. As the customers didn't want it. Only 1% of sales were EV.

Even now, the customers don't want it, they are quiet happy with ICE. It's the national governments who are legislating and forcing the change. Hence VAG and everyone else is ramping up.

Tesla failed to make a profitable market for EVs, subsidies and selling environmental credits kept them afloat.

[TyrannosauRoss Lex]

hyphen said:

WestyCarl said:

I can't work out if he sets public crazy goals (over promises) on purpose to push his companies to achieve them.

Or he just can't help himself........

He gets paid on share price increases. Billions.
Tesla raise cheap cash as the share price is booming.

It's carefully planned and he is at the top of his game.

I'm sure this latest announcement will help increase share prices...?

[Bennet]

Teslas are meant to be supercar fast. But I have never once yet seen one being driven quickly or storming away from an A road roundabout. People just seem to drive them like normal cars. I keep expecting to see something dramatic and so far, nothing. And it's not like there are a shortage of them on the roads. I see them all the time.