Do You Prefer Newer or Older cars?
Discussion
Modern performance cars are super fast, very well setup, refined and utterly boring to drive on UK roads unless your doing jail time speed. I could drive an M4 everywhere at 120mph and never put it past 7/10ths of its ability
This maybe great for daily driving but give me something i actually have to control for sunday fun drives
This maybe great for daily driving but give me something i actually have to control for sunday fun drives
It's a tricky one this. I only have one car which does everything and I need it to be reliable. I opted for an Audi S5 Sportback as its practical enough to lug the bin lids around, plush inside and quick when I want it to be. I wouldn't class it as a 'fun' car as such but much more fun than an Audi A5 TDI or similar.
My bike is my toy and I wouldn't replace that for a fun car - it just isn't the same. However, if I could afford a 2nd car I would more than likely go for something like an E30 325i. Fun to drive, brisk enough and IMO one of the best looking saloons ever created. It also comes with bags full of nostalgia and would immediately whisk me back to my childhood. Would I prefer it to the S5, generally yes. Would I prefer it if I had a long journey to do and was in a bad mood, absolutely not.
There's also a sweet spot to older cars. If you go down the cheap 10 year old runabout route then I can't imagine how that would be better than it's latest version. If you're talking an 80's / 90's cherished hot hatch / sports car then I am sure it would feel more special to own and drive than something of today.
My bike is my toy and I wouldn't replace that for a fun car - it just isn't the same. However, if I could afford a 2nd car I would more than likely go for something like an E30 325i. Fun to drive, brisk enough and IMO one of the best looking saloons ever created. It also comes with bags full of nostalgia and would immediately whisk me back to my childhood. Would I prefer it to the S5, generally yes. Would I prefer it if I had a long journey to do and was in a bad mood, absolutely not.
There's also a sweet spot to older cars. If you go down the cheap 10 year old runabout route then I can't imagine how that would be better than it's latest version. If you're talking an 80's / 90's cherished hot hatch / sports car then I am sure it would feel more special to own and drive than something of today.
The only comparison I can find for the TV/laptop analogy is film. Film is expensive, it's heavy and has to be transported round, it's difficult to use, it requires far more effort to edit or work with in post.
But, regardless of how far digital cinema cameras have come, it still provides a picture that cannot be matched, and for tat reason, for the right aesthetic, it is still worth using.|
Old cars are worse than new cars in so many measurable ways, but there's something about *some* old cars that just cannot be simulated by newer efforts. This trend will only continue with the rise of the EV.
But, regardless of how far digital cinema cameras have come, it still provides a picture that cannot be matched, and for tat reason, for the right aesthetic, it is still worth using.|
Old cars are worse than new cars in so many measurable ways, but there's something about *some* old cars that just cannot be simulated by newer efforts. This trend will only continue with the rise of the EV.
Personally, I have a pet hate for my wife's modern E-class. It's built to break, and it does. Frequently. Then I fix it. Again.
I prefer the 30-year-old retro-moded CRX-R, or any of my other cars. A Type-R Honda doesn't break and always brings a smile to my face.
It has air conditioning, a glass roof and a properly restomoded interior with Apple Car Play and a sound system with clarity that would embarrass all but the best OEM setups. Old cars don't have to be inconvenient, or unreliable for daily use.
The E-class is just modern, has all the toys, and is competent. Relaxing to drive. Dull.
I prefer the 30-year-old retro-moded CRX-R, or any of my other cars. A Type-R Honda doesn't break and always brings a smile to my face.
It has air conditioning, a glass roof and a properly restomoded interior with Apple Car Play and a sound system with clarity that would embarrass all but the best OEM setups. Old cars don't have to be inconvenient, or unreliable for daily use.
The E-class is just modern, has all the toys, and is competent. Relaxing to drive. Dull.
Toys that people have becomes accustomed to and which they "can't do without" are largely just tat.
If you are that lazy/reliant on modern tech that it makes an older car "difficult to drive/use", then it is the individual who has the issue.
Very little built in the last 30 odd years is remotely hard to live with/drive on the road today.
If you are that lazy/reliant on modern tech that it makes an older car "difficult to drive/use", then it is the individual who has the issue.
Very little built in the last 30 odd years is remotely hard to live with/drive on the road today.
I have a Lotus Evora and had a Lotus Elan +2 which I built from scratch (but am currently restoring another).
The Plus 2 was much more fun to drive than the Evora, great car though the Evora is. Though the Evora steering is lauded, the Plus 2 steering really is better in both feel and sensitivity - amazing for something built from bits robbed off a Triumph Herald/Spitfire.
Modern cars are too disconnected in my experience and have no 'sense of occassion' - the latter is somewhat indefinable but you know it when you feel it
The Plus 2 was much more fun to drive than the Evora, great car though the Evora is. Though the Evora steering is lauded, the Plus 2 steering really is better in both feel and sensitivity - amazing for something built from bits robbed off a Triumph Herald/Spitfire.
Modern cars are too disconnected in my experience and have no 'sense of occassion' - the latter is somewhat indefinable but you know it when you feel it
Edited by Lotobear on Wednesday 23 June 15:46
I like both. I enjoy older cars - 80s/90s for me - as they are simple, light and fun to drive. They remind me you don't need lots of power to have fun.
Modern cars are great for family days out, getting to work or driving in the winter salt and not giving a monkeys.
You could argue the latter has nothing about enjoying cars and I guess you would be right. However as a utility to do a job modern cars are great. As a passion/hobby/interest then they are pretty numb.
Modern cars are great for family days out, getting to work or driving in the winter salt and not giving a monkeys.
You could argue the latter has nothing about enjoying cars and I guess you would be right. However as a utility to do a job modern cars are great. As a passion/hobby/interest then they are pretty numb.
I don't actively dislike new cars but they offer nothing which interests me and as such what I'd be willing to pay for one and what everyone else is willing to pay for one is rather different.
I do happen to like older cars a lot more. I have a big ego, you see, and I enjoy managing a car complete with its deficiencies - both driving and keeping them roadworthy. Modern cars that try to do everything for me leave me cold. I didn't even realise acceleration was boring until electric cars and turbocharged AWD hatchbacks started making sub-5 seconds to 60 times common. I'd rather sit and read a book than go for a drive in something like a Golf R. It's just not something I consider entertaining.
The only thing about new cars I wish I could take and apply to old cars is the corrosion protection technology.
I do happen to like older cars a lot more. I have a big ego, you see, and I enjoy managing a car complete with its deficiencies - both driving and keeping them roadworthy. Modern cars that try to do everything for me leave me cold. I didn't even realise acceleration was boring until electric cars and turbocharged AWD hatchbacks started making sub-5 seconds to 60 times common. I'd rather sit and read a book than go for a drive in something like a Golf R. It's just not something I consider entertaining.
The only thing about new cars I wish I could take and apply to old cars is the corrosion protection technology.
SidewaysSi said:
Toys that people have becomes accustomed to and which they "can't do without" are largely just tat.
If you are that lazy/reliant on modern tech that it makes an older car "difficult to drive/use", then it is the individual who has the issue.
Very little built in the last 30 odd years is remotely hard to live with/drive on the road today.
There's no denying that modern tech makes life much more convenient. Older cars are not impossible to live with but given the choice, I'd much rather have the convenience of modern tech to old skool basics.If you are that lazy/reliant on modern tech that it makes an older car "difficult to drive/use", then it is the individual who has the issue.
Very little built in the last 30 odd years is remotely hard to live with/drive on the road today.
My son phoned me at the weekend wanting to meet up and he was at his girlfriends over the water (a town I hardly know). I jumped in my car, pressed a button on the wheel and said "navigate to xxx". Job done. No maps or route planning. Half way there Mrs toon phoned me. Press of the iDrive wheel and I was getting my orders (sorry, having a discussion). Again, no pulling over or calling back at the side of the road. Stopped at the traffic lights on a hill. Auto hold handbrake engaged by default, no need to worry about rolling back pulling away. That was just one 25 minute journey.
The older I get, comfort and convenience are more important to me for 95% of my journeys than a car that lights up on a twisty lane.
...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I've thought for a long time that I prefer older cars, and until recently only ran older stuff. Our 2004 Lexus IS300 Sportcross remains an almost impossible thing to replace at any cost due it's incessant reliability, practicality and lack of value. And the fact remains that it's a very nice thing. I could spend more than 10 times what it's worth and end up with a worse car.
Since I bought the MR2, I find myself driving more for pleasure, as it's not really fast enough to get me into trouble and it's fun wringing it's neck everywhere. Worryingly, the Boxster and Evo have pretty much taken a back seat to this, and as much as I still like them and want to keep them, the 33 year old Toyota tends to be the one I default to.
However, out of necessity, I recently replaced my 2009 Ford Connect with another from 2018, and every time I drive it, I'm amazed at how much I got for how little I spent. It feels modern, it's quiet and frugal, and full of equipment. Nothing like any van I've ever had previously, and arguably a nicer place to spend time than the Lexus, which feels like an outrageous thing to say.
Maybe I should try newer stuff, but I'm almost scared I'll like it too much and want rid of the stuff I'm currently happy with!
Since I bought the MR2, I find myself driving more for pleasure, as it's not really fast enough to get me into trouble and it's fun wringing it's neck everywhere. Worryingly, the Boxster and Evo have pretty much taken a back seat to this, and as much as I still like them and want to keep them, the 33 year old Toyota tends to be the one I default to.
However, out of necessity, I recently replaced my 2009 Ford Connect with another from 2018, and every time I drive it, I'm amazed at how much I got for how little I spent. It feels modern, it's quiet and frugal, and full of equipment. Nothing like any van I've ever had previously, and arguably a nicer place to spend time than the Lexus, which feels like an outrageous thing to say.
Maybe I should try newer stuff, but I'm almost scared I'll like it too much and want rid of the stuff I'm currently happy with!
toon10 said:
The older I get, comfort and convenience are more important to me for 95% of my journeys than a car that lights up on a twisty lane.
...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I'm definitely heading in this direction sadly as well. I've been out roof down this afternoon in the 370Z...and the noisy exhaust was starting to get on my nerves a tiny bit, and I got sick of changing gear myself with the manual gearbox too. I'm losing the plot it seems for sure! ...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I definitely want to be young again.
Al Gorithum said:
I often have disagreements in my social circle over whether older of newer cars are best.
I grew up in the 70's and 80's and drove the best at the time such as Mexico's, RS2000's, 2.8i Capris, HSR Chevette etc, then went on the Astra GTE's, Manta's etc, then on into the 90's with Supra's, Skylines etc.
Loved them all at the time but wouldn't drive one now, because IMO newer cars are better. I normally invoke the line "you wouldn't use a 20-30 year old phone/laptop/TV etc, so why would you use a car of the same era?"
I understand that folk have preferences, but to argue that older cars are better seems off to me.
Thoughts?
I often see petrolheads make this statement as if it were a given that no-one wants old tech and appliances. And yet, search up the price of a decent 80's-90's PC on ebay and you'll have a heart attack!I grew up in the 70's and 80's and drove the best at the time such as Mexico's, RS2000's, 2.8i Capris, HSR Chevette etc, then went on the Astra GTE's, Manta's etc, then on into the 90's with Supra's, Skylines etc.
Loved them all at the time but wouldn't drive one now, because IMO newer cars are better. I normally invoke the line "you wouldn't use a 20-30 year old phone/laptop/TV etc, so why would you use a car of the same era?"
I understand that folk have preferences, but to argue that older cars are better seems off to me.
Thoughts?
I have a 20 year old CRT I use from time to time with VHS, old games, and early DVDs because it sometimes genuinely looks better/smoother than it does blown up on a 50 inch LED. Great fun, just as much as I can have on my modern telly and the lot cost me around £40, £30 of which was the 20 year old high-end DVD player. Not to mention the light gun games, unplayable on modern TVs unless you're willing to spend a fortune on a Sinden Light Gun.
I have an enormous 80's stereo which could realistically be replaced by a DAC the size of my hand plugged into my phone and it would probably sound better too. But "better" doesn't always equate to listening pleasure. Plus it looks awesome.
Heck, I even "daily drive" my Grandad's old HP scientific calculator at work just because, guess what, it looks cool!
Old tech has its enthusiasts too you know
The sweet spot for me is 15-20 years old. By then you can buy a quality brand car at a fully depreciated price and you'll know enough about to have a good understanding of all the problems that you may encounter in the future so that they won't nickel and dime you every week or fold up like an accordion in an accident.
There's no question that a new car today is many MANY times better than a new car 20-30 years ago. If you're the type that likes to just get from A to B, you can't beat them. 300hp got you into the supercar club in 1990. Today? That's what you get from a Chrysler minivan. How they will hold up in 20 years is anybody's guess. There's a lot of cars that were new 20 years ago that you just don't see anymore.
There's no question that a new car today is many MANY times better than a new car 20-30 years ago. If you're the type that likes to just get from A to B, you can't beat them. 300hp got you into the supercar club in 1990. Today? That's what you get from a Chrysler minivan. How they will hold up in 20 years is anybody's guess. There's a lot of cars that were new 20 years ago that you just don't see anymore.
I prefer 90s-00s cars to what's available new now, for a few reasons. Partly affordability, partly they're smaller and lighter with HPAS rather than EPAS, generally more manual, better visibility. Also, I'm not really into Porsches, but most other performance cars are too big or have boring inline four engines.
Sometimes when I get into my RX-7 after driving something newer and heavier, I've laughed out loud at the immediacy and directness - how small it is, the weight and response of the steering, the noise, how low you sit. But it's still manageable for longer journeys.
The other part is that these are the cars I remember reading about in magazines and playing in video games from my childhood, so they're more emotionally significant to me than newer cars.
Hereward said:
Whenever this subject pops up I always say that Peak Car for me was reached in the 1990's to early 2000's.
I totally agree. You get all the modern conveniences like good rust resistance, fuel injection, power steering, airbags, ABS, air-con, electric windows, etc. But without the bad stuff like key-less entry, electric parking brakes, EPAS, touchscreens, automatic emergency braking, etc. The fact that cars from this era can be picked up for less than a grand is just the icing on the cake. Just try not to crash one!cerb4.5lee said:
toon10 said:
The older I get, comfort and convenience are more important to me for 95% of my journeys than a car that lights up on a twisty lane.
...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I'm definitely heading in this direction sadly as well. I've been out roof down this afternoon in the 370Z...and the noisy exhaust was starting to get on my nerves a tiny bit, and I got sick of changing gear myself with the manual gearbox too. I'm losing the plot it seems for sure! ...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I definitely want to be young again.
Om said:
cerb4.5lee said:
toon10 said:
The older I get, comfort and convenience are more important to me for 95% of my journeys than a car that lights up on a twisty lane.
...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I'm definitely heading in this direction sadly as well. I've been out roof down this afternoon in the 370Z...and the noisy exhaust was starting to get on my nerves a tiny bit, and I got sick of changing gear myself with the manual gearbox too. I'm losing the plot it seems for sure! ...I'll hand my PH membership in on the way out
I definitely want to be young again.
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