RE: VW Golf GTI (Mk5) | Shed of the Week
Discussion
kambites said:
An ever increasing number of minor issues which didn't seem worth fixing, culminating with an engine failure.
For a few years now it has had electrical issues, randomly flattening its battery for no obvious reason, losing the settings in its ECUs, doors refusing to lock or unlock, etc.; then when we came to try to use the air con this summer it was dead, got it regassed and it held pressure but still didn't work - probably another compressor failure (that would be the third time it had failed in the lifetime of the car, all OEM parts); the wheels had all gone porous so the tyres needed topping up every few days. Nothing which on its own would write the car off, but a list of faults which was building up faster than they were getting fixed... Then a few weeks ago, the oil pressure light came on; turned the engine off immediately and got it trailered home; dropped the sump to find it full of metal shavings. Not sure which bearings had actually failed, but from the amount of metal in the sump it was more than one. Those were just the things which were broken when we got rid of it, there were many, many more faults over the course of our ownership.
The car had always been serviced to schedule, using OEM filters, etc. and fully synthetic VAG spec oil; was completely standard; and had been driven pretty gently (it was my wife's car and whilst she appreciated the power, she hardly drove it hard). I stripped down many of the parts which failed and I had replaced over our ownership and came to the conclusion that they were simply not engineered to last much beyond the warranty period.
Of course you expect a few issues with an 18 year-old car which had done 150k miles, but the whole thing just gave the impression of being very poorly engineered once you dug beneath the veneer. The rust-proofing on the Skoda seemed impeccable though!
Unfortunate to hear, but I wouldn't call it an umbrella 'VAG' issue. I bought my 07 Audi A6 Avant 3.0TDi in 09 (so still had Audi warranty on it), and 15 years later and having crossed 250k miles, it is STILL my daily driver, and has NEVER let me down. Granted, after the warranty expired, I have religiously done all the servicing myself (due to the amount of other 'toys' I have, I have a fairly well equipped garage!), but the only issues I've had in that entire time have been: failed drivers door window regulator (€20 off ebay, though granted, took me about 3 hours to replace!), parking sensor module failure x 2 (€30 the first time, haven't bothered to replace the second one!), air flow meter (one and only time it went in to 'safe/limp' mode, but still drove home fine. €144 from Germany (2 day delivery), less than ten minutes to fit. Ummmmm, it's been a long time, but can't really remember anything outside standard servicing, and that is using Long Life oil (so yeah, 20k mile oil servicing), and for those saying that 'sealed for life' gearboxes are a scam? Well, my tiptronic (even with novel paddle shifters...... in a 3 litre diesel!) has NEVER been touched, and performing as new with 250k miles on the clock...... it never will! Oh, and I had it mapped the day after I bought it, making about 270-280bhp. However accurate that is, it has been GPS clocked at 154mph (had gone well past 160mph on the clock), and still had a bit left to go. It will haul my racebikes to the track, carry a GSD and Border Collie in the back with space to roam, put a 14ft kayak on the roof and still average well over 600 miles to the tank. I chop and change my other toys regularly, but my old diesel tank just keeps going and going without skipping the faintest of beats. I've been occasionally tempted to 'upgrade' (first when the BiTDi came out, and then when the S6 converted to the black stuff), but I would genuinely miss the old girl, so she's staying as long as she wants to stay with me!For a few years now it has had electrical issues, randomly flattening its battery for no obvious reason, losing the settings in its ECUs, doors refusing to lock or unlock, etc.; then when we came to try to use the air con this summer it was dead, got it regassed and it held pressure but still didn't work - probably another compressor failure (that would be the third time it had failed in the lifetime of the car, all OEM parts); the wheels had all gone porous so the tyres needed topping up every few days. Nothing which on its own would write the car off, but a list of faults which was building up faster than they were getting fixed... Then a few weeks ago, the oil pressure light came on; turned the engine off immediately and got it trailered home; dropped the sump to find it full of metal shavings. Not sure which bearings had actually failed, but from the amount of metal in the sump it was more than one. Those were just the things which were broken when we got rid of it, there were many, many more faults over the course of our ownership.
The car had always been serviced to schedule, using OEM filters, etc. and fully synthetic VAG spec oil; was completely standard; and had been driven pretty gently (it was my wife's car and whilst she appreciated the power, she hardly drove it hard). I stripped down many of the parts which failed and I had replaced over our ownership and came to the conclusion that they were simply not engineered to last much beyond the warranty period.
Of course you expect a few issues with an 18 year-old car which had done 150k miles, but the whole thing just gave the impression of being very poorly engineered once you dug beneath the veneer. The rust-proofing on the Skoda seemed impeccable though!
Edited by kambites on Friday 12th July 18:25
kambites said:
An ever increasing number of minor issues which didn't seem worth fixing, culminating with an engine failure.
For a few years now it has had electrical issues, randomly flattening its battery for no obvious reason, losing the settings in its ECUs, doors refusing to lock or unlock, etc.; then when we came to try to use the air con this summer it was dead, got it regassed and it held pressure but still didn't work - probably another compressor failure (that would be the third time it had failed in the lifetime of the car, all OEM parts); the wheels had all gone porous so the tyres needed topping up every few days. Nothing which on its own would write the car off, but a list of faults which was building up faster than they were getting fixed... Then a few weeks ago, the oil pressure light came on; turned the engine off immediately and got it trailered home; dropped the sump to find it full of metal shavings. Not sure which bearings had actually failed, but from the amount of metal in the sump it was more than one. Those were just the things which were broken when we got rid of it, there were many, many more faults over the course of our ownership.
The car had always been serviced to schedule, using OEM filters, etc. and fully synthetic VAG spec oil; was completely standard; and had been driven pretty gently (it was my wife's car and whilst she appreciated the power, she hardly drove it hard). I stripped down many of the parts which failed and I had replaced over our ownership and came to the conclusion that they were simply not engineered to last much beyond the warranty period.
Of course you expect a few issues with an 18 year-old car which had done 150k miles, but the whole thing just gave the impression of being very poorly engineered once you dug beneath the veneer. The rust-proofing on the Skoda seemed impeccable though!
Ultimately engine failure killed it then.....surprising given it sounds like the car was regularly serviced.For a few years now it has had electrical issues, randomly flattening its battery for no obvious reason, losing the settings in its ECUs, doors refusing to lock or unlock, etc.; then when we came to try to use the air con this summer it was dead, got it regassed and it held pressure but still didn't work - probably another compressor failure (that would be the third time it had failed in the lifetime of the car, all OEM parts); the wheels had all gone porous so the tyres needed topping up every few days. Nothing which on its own would write the car off, but a list of faults which was building up faster than they were getting fixed... Then a few weeks ago, the oil pressure light came on; turned the engine off immediately and got it trailered home; dropped the sump to find it full of metal shavings. Not sure which bearings had actually failed, but from the amount of metal in the sump it was more than one. Those were just the things which were broken when we got rid of it, there were many, many more faults over the course of our ownership.
The car had always been serviced to schedule, using OEM filters, etc. and fully synthetic VAG spec oil; was completely standard; and had been driven pretty gently (it was my wife's car and whilst she appreciated the power, she hardly drove it hard). I stripped down many of the parts which failed and I had replaced over our ownership and came to the conclusion that they were simply not engineered to last much beyond the warranty period.
Of course you expect a few issues with an 18 year-old car which had done 150k miles, but the whole thing just gave the impression of being very poorly engineered once you dug beneath the veneer. The rust-proofing on the Skoda seemed impeccable though!
Edited by kambites on Friday 12th July 18:25
phumy said:
Ive had my MK5 GTi Edition Pirelli for about 3 years now, lovely little car, its never let me down and looks fantastic, as you can see. The Pirelli edition has the Pirelli tyre treads embelished into the aclantara on the seats. Not the most economical of cars, Im lucky if i get 36/7mpg on a motorway run but its lovely to drive. Has Pirelli tyreson it too.
That’s absolutely lovely and a real long term keeper. I always liked the MK5 GTI together with the MK2 16v (never saw the point of the slow 8v). ballans said:
Driven a few mk5 GTIs and standard ones are fabulous. Modifications seem to do them no favours at all though.
I seem to remember most manufacturers adding tartan to their sporty versions. Porsche have done it for years and even my Nova SR had it.
Has Jackie Stewart got anything to do with it?
I reckon it could be Fangio or Stirling Moss instead - I seem to remember their old Merc W 196 having a tartan seat?I seem to remember most manufacturers adding tartan to their sporty versions. Porsche have done it for years and even my Nova SR had it.
Has Jackie Stewart got anything to do with it?
Edited by ballans on Friday 12th July 08:53
Arsecati said:
Unfortunate to hear, but I wouldn't call it an umbrella 'VAG' issue.
The ultimately failure, perhaps not, but the numerous ancillary failures it had over the years were clearly down to VAG specifying low quality components; or I suppose more precisely failing to specity high quality ones. Take the air con compressors for example, the car had three of them over the period we had it (the original and two replacements), all OEM but three different manufacturers (for some reason VAG had three different OEM suppliers for that part) and all of them failed. I stripped each of them down (except the last one) and they were full of "load bearing" plastic components which seemed to have simply gone brittle with age and failed. Similarly the PCV valve - it was on its third when it died and the first two both failed in the same way at roughly the same age - they clearly just weren't up to the job they were designed to do. Another indication of the company's attitude they had to design is the connectors they use on the wiring looms. They're great when newish, nice positive solid clip together and easy to release once you have the knack... once they get to about ten-fifteen years old some of them just snap when you try to release them, no matter how careful you are.
Obviously far less important but the switch gear was crap too; not the electrical switches themselves (although the temperature control knobs both failed) but the plastic covers. They'd basically taken clear plastic switches and sprayed/painted black rubberised stuff over them using stencils to leave cut-outs for the light-up bits. Given how ALL of the switches had the black rubberised material wear off, they clearly didn't do any proper longevity testing on the process.
We liked the car overall, it did what we wanted it to very well, but having seen what's under the surface by taking so much of it apart over the years, I wouldn't buy another VAG car if I intended to keep it more than a few years.
evojam said:
Ultimately engine failure killed it then.....surprising given it sounds like the car was regularly serviced.
Ultimately yes, although we'd already decided we weren't going to bother to fit a fourth air con compressor after the first three failed so the car would likely have ended up being scrapped within a year or so even had the engine not died. To be fair to the engine, I don't know how it was treated in the first five years of its life before we got it. I suspect it was run low on oil at least once in its early life. The PCV valve diaphragm was holed when we got it and it was drinking oil, so I wouldn't be surprised if the previous owners had failed to notice and run it low at some point. It did have a very occasional, faint knock when we got it which remained for its entire life. I never did figure out the cause but it could have potentially been a sign of bottom end damage which then slowly got worse over the 80k miles we had the car.
I could easily forgive the car the engine failure because I don't know what caused it and 150k miles with no internal work is hardly a terrible lifespan for an engine; it was the hundreds of smaller things which went wrong due to obvious design flaws which rather puts me off VAG.
Edited by kambites on Saturday 13th July 10:14
s m said:
Always imagined they’d have a bit more top end for that power
- my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
My old S14 200SX had similar power to this as standard, and the top speed in that was 146mph in comparison as well. I did actually see 160mph on the clock after I'd tuned it up a bit though. - my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
136mph for this does seem a bit on the limp side as you say.
cerb4.5lee said:
s m said:
Always imagined they’d have a bit more top end for that power
- my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
My old S14 200SX had similar power to this as standard, and the top speed in that was 146mph in comparison as well. I did actually see 160mph on the clock after I'd tuned it up a bit though. - my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
136mph for this does seem a bit on the limp side as you say.
Recently sold my white mk5 3dr for 1600. It needed a clutch and flywheel and was on 160k hence the low price.
Nice enough daily car, agreed it was nicely put together inside, but rust was coming through (tailgate, drivers door, rear of sills, bottom of front panel) so it was really showing its age.
I wanted one due to the excellent reviews at launch but was left underwhelmed by its agility and steering feel (or rather the lack of either).
I’m surprised to see people recommending them for track days, to me the first thing you want is to be able to use a decent level of grip from both ends of the car, and the second is to know what the chassis is doing through your hands and your arse. And for me the Golf falls well short in both areas.
And as a daily the ride quality was harsh.
Swapped for a 325ti compact and much happier.
Nice enough daily car, agreed it was nicely put together inside, but rust was coming through (tailgate, drivers door, rear of sills, bottom of front panel) so it was really showing its age.
I wanted one due to the excellent reviews at launch but was left underwhelmed by its agility and steering feel (or rather the lack of either).
I’m surprised to see people recommending them for track days, to me the first thing you want is to be able to use a decent level of grip from both ends of the car, and the second is to know what the chassis is doing through your hands and your arse. And for me the Golf falls well short in both areas.
And as a daily the ride quality was harsh.
Swapped for a 325ti compact and much happier.
Here’s my Edition 30’”Shed”. Owned for 6 years and is just about to tick over to 110,000 miles. It’s a definite long term keeper , mainly because I’ve spent a small fortune on modifications and maintenance and it’s fairly clean corrosion wise. A lot of the mk5’s beaters you see on the roads now are rusting to bits and it’s not often you see a nice well looked after example.
njw1 said:
rottenegg said:
The difference between the MK5 and MK4 is chalk and cheese. The MK5's body shell is 125% stiffer. Torsional rigidity improvements between models is NEVER that great. Usually between 15-20% on average. That and the independent rear suspension is why they drive so well, and the same underpinnings are still used on the MK8 to this day.
The late Richard Parry Jones, the very, very talented engineer responsible for how well a mk1 Focus drives was also responsible for most of the underpinnings on the mk5 Golf so it's absolutely no coincidence at all that they drive as well as they do.
The MK1 Focus also drives very well indeed and if Mr RPJ was responsible for both, which I didn't know, I tip my hat to him 
The MK1 Focus and MK5 GTI both introduced a much needed turning point in FWD dynamics. Lets not also forget the EP3 Civic Type R as well for its independent rear suspension. Shame Honda went back to a torsion beam for the FN2. It didn't drive quite as nicely as the EP3, imo.
The E91 and F30 BMW also kinda copied that rear layout, albeit ditching the trailing arms in favour of thrust arms.
spikyone said:
I'd prefer to get public transport than buy a car like this.
- Crappy aftermarket badging
- Tacked on carbon bits
- Heavily tinted rear windows
- Wind deflectors
Pretty much a full house of ugly, tasteless modifications commonly done by oiks and which instantly devalue a car in my eyes. Probably been ragged to within an inch of its life with the bare minimum of maintenance. Kill it with fire.
All those bits can be fixed in afternoon. The windows and badges will just need a hair dryer.- Crappy aftermarket badging
- Tacked on carbon bits
- Heavily tinted rear windows
- Wind deflectors
Pretty much a full house of ugly, tasteless modifications commonly done by oiks and which instantly devalue a car in my eyes. Probably been ragged to within an inch of its life with the bare minimum of maintenance. Kill it with fire.
Then find a decent set of secondhand alloys and it will look a lot better.
Arsecati said:
Unfortunate to hear, but I wouldn't call it an umbrella 'VAG' issue. I bought my 07 Audi A6 Avant 3.0TDi in 09 (so still had Audi warranty on it), and 15 years later and having crossed 250k miles, it is STILL my daily driver, and has NEVER let me down. Granted, after the warranty expired, I have religiously done all the servicing myself (due to the amount of other 'toys' I have, I have a fairly well equipped garage!), but the only issues I've had in that entire time have been: failed drivers door window regulator (€20 off ebay, though granted, took me about 3 hours to replace!), parking sensor module failure x 2 (€30 the first time, haven't bothered to replace the second one!), air flow meter (one and only time it went in to 'safe/limp' mode, but still drove home fine. €144 from Germany (2 day delivery), less than ten minutes to fit. Ummmmm, it's been a long time, but can't really remember anything outside standard servicing, and that is using Long Life oil (so yeah, 20k mile oil servicing), and for those saying that 'sealed for life' gearboxes are a scam? Well, my tiptronic (even with novel paddle shifters...... in a 3 litre diesel!) has NEVER been touched, and performing as new with 250k miles on the clock...... it never will! Oh, and I had it mapped the day after I bought it, making about 270-280bhp. However accurate that is, it has been GPS clocked at 154mph (had gone well past 160mph on the clock), and still had a bit left to go. It will haul my racebikes to the track, carry a GSD and Border Collie in the back with space to roam, put a 14ft kayak on the roof and still average well over 600 miles to the tank. I chop and change my other toys regularly, but my old diesel tank just keeps going and going without skipping the faintest of beats. I've been occasionally tempted to 'upgrade' (first when the BiTDi came out, and then when the S6 converted to the black stuff), but I would genuinely miss the old girl, so she's staying as long as she wants to stay with me!
An interesting read, but a hard read.Any chance of a paragraph or two?
s m said:
cerb4.5lee said:
s m said:
Always imagined they’d have a bit more top end for that power
- my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
My old S14 200SX had similar power to this as standard, and the top speed in that was 146mph in comparison as well. I did actually see 160mph on the clock after I'd tuned it up a bit though. - my old 16v Astra was similar but was a lot lighter I guess
136mph for this does seem a bit on the limp side as you say.
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