What's faster? CHAMP car or F1?

What's faster? CHAMP car or F1?

Author
Discussion

Don1

Original Poster:

15,936 posts

207 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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Just a thought really - a normal track (not street), both on optimum tyres, fuel load and in the dry.

Any ideas?

Viper

10,005 posts

272 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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thought this been already been proven to be F1

acf8181

797 posts

233 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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yeah, f1 by a fair bit

oh...and you realise champcars dont exist anymore right?

wackojacko

8,581 posts

189 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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I'd have thought the F1....

deveng

3,917 posts

179 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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F1. Close thread?

stabilio

568 posts

170 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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In a straight line theres prob not much in it but braking is where you'll see a huge difference in F1. Cornering forces (grip) too.

TXWRX

312 posts

167 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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champ car raced at montreal in 2006 and the cars were 7 seconds a lap slower than f1 that year, on a more aero circuit this would be a bigger gap

davepoth

29,395 posts

198 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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On an oval, probably a champ car just because of the power. Anywhere else an F1 car will be much better.

Don1

Original Poster:

15,936 posts

207 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
quotequote all
Cheers - thought as such, and couldn't be arsed to wade through lap times of potential shared tracks. So that's why the F1 wash-outs end up there...

Regiment

2,799 posts

158 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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TXWRX said:
champ car raced at montreal in 2006 and the cars were 7 seconds a lap slower than f1 that year, on a more aero circuit this would be a bigger gap
How would that compare to a 908HDI FAP?

acf8181

797 posts

233 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
quotequote all
davepoth said:
On an oval, probably a champ car just because of the power. Anywhere else an F1 car will be much better.
i reckon if an f1 car was set up for an oval it would still be quicker...they weigh less and have more power as well as more grip

SlipStream77

2,153 posts

190 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
quotequote all
acf8181 said:
davepoth said:
On an oval, probably a champ car just because of the power. Anywhere else an F1 car will be much better.
i reckon if an f1 car was set up for an oval it would still be quicker...they weigh less and have more power as well as more grip
Mass has no effect on top speed, power, drag (aero and mechanical) and frontal area are the factors.

Champ cars are more powerful as well, 950hp is the figure quoted here...

http://champcar-ws.com/series_tech___dp01_champ_ca...

I think even if an F1 was set up for a fast oval such as Indy, the Champ car would still be faster by virtue of the generally more slippery aero design and extra power.

On a non oval the F1 would be faster.


Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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F1 car no question.

Thing is though which sounds better? F1 currently certainly doesn't sound great the v10's and v12's and v8's of old most certainly did

Talksteer

4,843 posts

232 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
quotequote all
Regiment said:
TXWRX said:
champ car raced at montreal in 2006 and the cars were 7 seconds a lap slower than f1 that year, on a more aero circuit this would be a bigger gap
How would that compare to a 908HDI FAP?
The LMP1 cars can lap Silverstone in 1:43 and the F1 cars can do it in 1:30, ergo you would expect the Champ car to beat an LMP1, which given that it is considerably lighter and more powerful is hardly surprising.

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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Would many disagree that the race today was so entertaining throughout the field the entire race.

Monty Python

4,812 posts

196 months

Sunday 17th April 2011
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Well according to this (http://champcar-ws.com/series_tech___dp01_champ_car), a champ car can do 240mph tops, while a 2011 F1 car (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/circuit_guide/default.stm) reaches 215mph, so it would appear the champ car is faster.

Also, the champ car has a higher power to weight ratio (~1340bhp/ton compared to ~1250bhp/ton for the F1).

Monty Python

4,812 posts

196 months

Monday 18th April 2011
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The question was "which is faster", which I assumed to mean top speed. Which would have the quickest lap time depends on the circuit, so without that information it's impossible to say.

ringerz

139 posts

225 months

Monday 18th April 2011
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I seem to remember a few years ago, back before F1 went to Indy there was speculation about how fast an F1 car would be on the oval. Can't find the quote now but Jacques Villeneuve said that he thought an F1 car, setup correctly would be quicker round the oval than the Champ Cars of the time.

All speculation of course! Would love to see one have a go mind...

CK_N4S

468 posts

181 months

Monday 18th April 2011
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Depends on what tune you have the F1 car in.

Before Honda ceased interest and sold out to Brawn, I seem to recall them preparing and maybe succeeding in bringin one of their V10 cars up to 400 km/h. I would expect with the vast adjustments available, that for any situation the F1 car can be adapted to be quicker than a champ car.

CK

GroundEffect

13,819 posts

155 months

Monday 18th April 2011
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It depends what era you're talking about - Champ cars no longer exist.

If we go for the end of the Champ car era (2007):

F1 car: 750BHP, 605kg, 1240BHP/tonne
Champcar: 750BHP (800BHP using push-to-pass), 727kg, 1031BHP/tonne

And an F1 car has a bit more downforce. So F1 car faster.

If we look at the peak of F1 cars with peak of Champ cars

F1 car (2004): 950BHP, 605kg, 1560BHP/tonne
Champ car (2001): 950BHP, 727kg, 1306BHP/tonne

And if we compare pole times of these cars:

F1 - 1:12.275
Champ car - 1:18.959

It's pretty conclusive.