RE: SOTW: Honda Accord Type R
Discussion
If you think the few people who have driven ATR's on PH are bad you should head over to accordr.org!
There is a chap on there that lives north of the border; his day job is with the police in Trafpol. He is or was one of the most experiences drivers in the Scottish police, chief instructor or akin to it that also did a bit of part time driving to VIP's. IAM, Road craft etc he had done it all.
He also was involved in appraising vehicles prior to their selection for use by the police. You may be wondering where this is going, well this chap had driven virtually every performance vehicle possible and still thought that the ATR was streets ahead as a driving tool than the majority of cars he had driven. He sold his ATR a few years ago, and bought either a high spec EVO or Scooby as he needed more "speed" he reckoned that he could keep up 99.99% of other drivers in any other car in the ATR.
I think alot of people miss the point of the ATR, it was and is an extremely well balanced car that is immensely rewarding on those days when the road opens up, traffic disappears and you redline it through every gear until she will go no further (north of 150 mph), for 1996 209 bhp from 2.2l, LSD the car was a genuine star and deserves the 5 Stars EVO gave it at the time, its only a 4 or 4.5 now but who cares.
This place is about driving cars, and until you have spent some time with an ATR don't judge them. In days of instant gratification they probably aren't the best car to drive as they require some time and effort but boy is that effort returned 10 fold.
I can remember a few PH meetings where I have piloted mine through Surry, Hampshire in much better company than a poxy Type-R, she gave it her best against EVO, Scoobies, TVR's etc and that was with 150k miles at the time with the original suspension. Most of the other cars on those drives will never see half that mileage.
I think I have just convinced myself to spend a couple of grand on mine to see her over 200k miles. Mechanically she is fine, rust has talken hold of all the doors.
There is a chap on there that lives north of the border; his day job is with the police in Trafpol. He is or was one of the most experiences drivers in the Scottish police, chief instructor or akin to it that also did a bit of part time driving to VIP's. IAM, Road craft etc he had done it all.
He also was involved in appraising vehicles prior to their selection for use by the police. You may be wondering where this is going, well this chap had driven virtually every performance vehicle possible and still thought that the ATR was streets ahead as a driving tool than the majority of cars he had driven. He sold his ATR a few years ago, and bought either a high spec EVO or Scooby as he needed more "speed" he reckoned that he could keep up 99.99% of other drivers in any other car in the ATR.
I think alot of people miss the point of the ATR, it was and is an extremely well balanced car that is immensely rewarding on those days when the road opens up, traffic disappears and you redline it through every gear until she will go no further (north of 150 mph), for 1996 209 bhp from 2.2l, LSD the car was a genuine star and deserves the 5 Stars EVO gave it at the time, its only a 4 or 4.5 now but who cares.
This place is about driving cars, and until you have spent some time with an ATR don't judge them. In days of instant gratification they probably aren't the best car to drive as they require some time and effort but boy is that effort returned 10 fold.
I can remember a few PH meetings where I have piloted mine through Surry, Hampshire in much better company than a poxy Type-R, she gave it her best against EVO, Scoobies, TVR's etc and that was with 150k miles at the time with the original suspension. Most of the other cars on those drives will never see half that mileage.
I think I have just convinced myself to spend a couple of grand on mine to see her over 200k miles. Mechanically she is fine, rust has talken hold of all the doors.
Gwagon111 said:
I'm referring to all iVTEC equiped cars I've driven, type R included. People who bleat on about "ohhh the Vtec" and my personal favourite "when the Vtec kicks in it's like a turbo" crack me right up 
. It's a gimmick, it doesn't do much, certainly absolutely nothing like a turbo.
That statement actually reads "I have never been out in an ATR or the original Civic 1.6 Vti, both of which are mild-mannered cars upto the VTEC point and then tear-off like mad b. It's a gimmick, it doesn't do much, certainly absolutely nothing like a turbo. 
ds). The CTR isn't exactly shameless in that dept either - but you do realise that VTEC in other models is more a fuel economy tool than a power enhancer...Even my s
tty 1.8 picked-up noticeably once you passed a certain point - that was if you could ignore the mechanical crashing from the engine (which, as it was a company car - I could!!)I drove the ATR in the same week I had a Fiat Coupe Turbo and an Impreza (gen 2) - the other cars were quicker at illegal speeds but the ATR was quicker within the limit - and was a better cruiser when you weren't pushing on and didn't 'egg you on' as the other 2 cars seem to do, constantly.
Not for everyone perhaps - but it's a GREAT shed. As I've said twice now, if nothing else someone just bought 2 of the comfiest seats in the world
Gwagon111 said:
No, someone needs to take you for a blast in any one of a miriad of better cars, then you might drop the blinkered fanboy outlook and see what I mean. Type R Hondas are a good giggle, and relatively cheaper than some of the better performing opposition. You would then "have a clue what you are talking about", and I might give more credence to what you say. When I was test driving some Hondas, with a mind to either saving a lot of money by going for a frugal shopping type car, or saving a bit of money, but maintaining a bit of a smile, I test drove a DC5, an FN2 CTR, and the shopping trolley I settled for. The sales guy I went out in the type Rs with, was banging on about "can you feel the extra grunt the Vtec gives you", and "these handle really nicely on these twistys don't they?". I could hardly stop myself laughing. They handled okay, given they were FWD front engined, but not on a par with something like a Scooby, Evo, Elise / Exige. Obviously we are not comparing like for like here, but some of the fanboy crap I was being subjected to was hilarious.
sorry mate but i have to disagree with you here. i think during higher cam lift you can feel a slight pull. nothing compared to a turbo but its there. just like the toyotas vvti version. i think they are great engines and this is a great shed. at 1K you could have a bit of fun in this for a year then chop it. i would rather spend 1k on this than the rover brm we had a couple of weeks ago.Edited by Gwagon111 on Sunday 24th April 14:16
As with every 'performance car' only a well maintained and cared for car will deliver performance 'as is'.
I bet there are more neglected cars out there than minters. It's a TVR discussion really: most peeps dunno what they are talking about. Spend no money on a car and you'll will get sh@te in return.
Shame Honda went the 'wrong way' and fails to produce true drivers cars like the ATR . . .
I bet there are more neglected cars out there than minters. It's a TVR discussion really: most peeps dunno what they are talking about. Spend no money on a car and you'll will get sh@te in return.
Shame Honda went the 'wrong way' and fails to produce true drivers cars like the ATR . . .
ALawson said:
I think alot of people miss the point of the ATR, it was and is an extremely well balanced car that is immensely rewarding on those days when the road opens up, traffic disappears and you redline it through every gear until she will go no further (north of 150 mph), for 1996 209 bhp from 2.2l, LSD the car was a genuine star and deserves the 5 Stars EVO gave it at the time, its only a 4 or 4.5 now but who cares
I must have a dud one, on the flat, mine has given up at 148 mph 
Another virtue is it's superb high speed handling & steering feedback. Also, in the wet it's brilliant - I run Good Year F1 Asymmetricals, very progressive and massive amounts of fun at sensible speeds with a lot in reserve. A remarkably practical solution too - massive boot, 4 doors and great head room. I would love a spare Ricardo bucket seat from an ATR to adapt as a seat for my computer at home.
Ive got an ATR, Currently up for sale simply because im after a 2wheeled item instead
Well what can i say, best car ive owned, handling is like a small hatchback, best handling car ive ever owned, would have left my old pulsar in the first hedge, and on par possibly better than my old clio hybrid which had full williams running gear, If you havent driven one dont slate it, i was a vtec hater until i drove the accord and well jekyll n hyde come to mind, 115mph in 5th and vtec comes in...
you can certainly feel it start to pull Again!! as to comparing proper vtec with iVtec haha!!
It does Everything, Cruises nicely, comfortable, best seats ever! then hit 5750rpm and get enthusiastic and you feel like jason plato
Phenomenal handling for a big car, really does feel half the size! Brakes are amazing too, belive the front calipers to be off a honda nsx
Mines on 149k and drives like new, engine sounds like a sewing machine!
I keep talking myself out of selling it tbh! Fairly economical on a run for a 2.2 also manage 36mpg on runs up to the midlands in it, could get more if i didnt venture over 70
They can be pricey when they go wrong, lambda sensors have to be OE Denso, 5th gear/reverse issue is £500 upwards job, just had to do mine.. plugs are expensive etc, but when you compare it to another car of similar point to point capabilitys then its not that bad!
Well what can i say, best car ive owned, handling is like a small hatchback, best handling car ive ever owned, would have left my old pulsar in the first hedge, and on par possibly better than my old clio hybrid which had full williams running gear, If you havent driven one dont slate it, i was a vtec hater until i drove the accord and well jekyll n hyde come to mind, 115mph in 5th and vtec comes in...
you can certainly feel it start to pull Again!! as to comparing proper vtec with iVtec haha!!It does Everything, Cruises nicely, comfortable, best seats ever! then hit 5750rpm and get enthusiastic and you feel like jason plato
Phenomenal handling for a big car, really does feel half the size! Brakes are amazing too, belive the front calipers to be off a honda nsx
Mines on 149k and drives like new, engine sounds like a sewing machine!
I keep talking myself out of selling it tbh! Fairly economical on a run for a 2.2 also manage 36mpg on runs up to the midlands in it, could get more if i didnt venture over 70
They can be pricey when they go wrong, lambda sensors have to be OE Denso, 5th gear/reverse issue is £500 upwards job, just had to do mine.. plugs are expensive etc, but when you compare it to another car of similar point to point capabilitys then its not that bad!
carsnapper said:
I would love a spare Ricardo bucket seat from an ATR to adapt as a seat for my computer at home.
You'll need a few quid - tatty pairs on eBay are £300+ - tidy/decent ones are more like £450+ a pair...Recaro actually make office chairs - if you have the monies!!
I don't get the idea of putting a car seat onto an office chair frame tho - in a car you're sitting close to the ground with your legs ahead of you - in the office you sit more upright, surely the posture will be totally wrong??
Unless you have your desk 18" from the ground?
For the office, get a Herman Miller Aeron - you'll never ever regret it...
johnpeat said:
Even my stty 1.8 picked-up noticeably once you passed a certain point - that was if you could ignore the mechanical crashing from the engine (which, as it was a company car - I could!!)
My Ford Focus had something similar to this, when you got to 3000rpm you'd have a 'Zetec just kicked in, yo' moment and the car would suddenly find it's power band. tty 1.8 picked-up noticeably once you passed a certain point - that was if you could ignore the mechanical crashing from the engine (which, as it was a company car - I could!!)In all seriousness, I do like VTEC engines for what they do.
irf said:
no rose tinted glasses anywhere near me, me and mine at brands a couple of weeks ago.
taken by a PH'er
and a quick vid at brands hatch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvPUDvIsy00
good to see you are still enjoying her Irf...catch you soon mate taken by a PH'er
and a quick vid at brands hatch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvPUDvIsy00
johnpeat said:
For the office, get a Herman Miller Aeron - you'll never ever regret it...
£950 - for a chair?! Hmmm, i'll pass. Besides, I have a clutch that needs replacing right now. Thanks I do use that chair at one of my clients whenever i'm photographing there, It's comfortable, but not a grands worth comfortable!
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