Time to buy my first 911
Discussion
Ok guys first of all let me just say I have the utmost respect for all such forums full of helpful wise old (but also sometimes young) heads who are generous with their time, thoughts and help on all such matters.
I have been considering a change for some time.
I have now hit the big 40, worked hard to establish my career (as a teacher - yes I often wonder why) and can actually now afford (while though not certainly not rich) to perhaps this time just go for it and buy the car I've always talked about and longed after - the Porsche 911 Carrera.
I appreciate this type of thread will have been covered before in many different ways / guises but would love you guys who know best to suffer me and help me out with my decision making. I've been reading a lot and researching over the last few months while also looking at adverts.
I already realise that I will just never have enough money for the 964 Turbo that haunts my dreams and can see that I will likely be purchasing a late 996 or early 997 to fit in with my budget. I have already seen some nice ones but really need your help on the correct model and aesthetics for me.
Can you help me out moving forward? - I'll answer all questions required to harness your suggestions.
I don't know much so do be gentle with me!
I have been considering a change for some time.
I have now hit the big 40, worked hard to establish my career (as a teacher - yes I often wonder why) and can actually now afford (while though not certainly not rich) to perhaps this time just go for it and buy the car I've always talked about and longed after - the Porsche 911 Carrera.
I appreciate this type of thread will have been covered before in many different ways / guises but would love you guys who know best to suffer me and help me out with my decision making. I've been reading a lot and researching over the last few months while also looking at adverts.
I already realise that I will just never have enough money for the 964 Turbo that haunts my dreams and can see that I will likely be purchasing a late 996 or early 997 to fit in with my budget. I have already seen some nice ones but really need your help on the correct model and aesthetics for me.
Can you help me out moving forward? - I'll answer all questions required to harness your suggestions.
I don't know much so do be gentle with me!
Edited by Dr Ing on Monday 3rd July 14:05
The obvious big question is budget, making sure you leave some cash aside for any immediate fixes required given that you're looking at a 10 year old car.
You need to consider whether you want a manual gearbox or the tiptronic, and 2 or 4 wheel drive. That should narrow down your options a little
You need to consider whether you want a manual gearbox or the tiptronic, and 2 or 4 wheel drive. That should narrow down your options a little
Yep ok.
I have a 2011 BMW 320d Touring Sport Plus (which I love) to trade in - hoping for around £9000 for that.
I'd can spend around the £20,000 - £22,500 mark. Would possibly stretch to £25,000 if the car was perfect.
Of course I'd like to spend a lot less (below £20,000) but after looking for a while I doubt it's going to happen.
I definitely want a manual and am keen on a sunroof (for summer). What I also have on my current car is heated seats, Sat Nav and bluetooth which I would be keen to have on the next car as I know in the long run I would miss it.
I am in Northern Ireland and am not sure whether 2 or 4wd is going to be best. I haven't had much bother with the BMW - if the weather's bad I don't have to take it out as I live pretty close to work! However I would appreciate your thoughts on this - I have up to now been imagining that the 2d is the much purer driver?
I love the Cobalt Blue but also can do Black or other Blues and the odd time I think actually no that Grey looks good too Your thoughts?
I have a 2011 BMW 320d Touring Sport Plus (which I love) to trade in - hoping for around £9000 for that.
I'd can spend around the £20,000 - £22,500 mark. Would possibly stretch to £25,000 if the car was perfect.
Of course I'd like to spend a lot less (below £20,000) but after looking for a while I doubt it's going to happen.
I definitely want a manual and am keen on a sunroof (for summer). What I also have on my current car is heated seats, Sat Nav and bluetooth which I would be keen to have on the next car as I know in the long run I would miss it.
I am in Northern Ireland and am not sure whether 2 or 4wd is going to be best. I haven't had much bother with the BMW - if the weather's bad I don't have to take it out as I live pretty close to work!
However I would appreciate your thoughts on this - I have up to now been imagining that the 2d is the much purer driver?I love the Cobalt Blue but also can do Black or other Blues and the odd time I think actually no that Grey looks good too
Your thoughts?Edited by Dr Ing on Monday 3rd July 14:48
I would suggest that Nav will be next to useless, so I'd write that off. Budget for an aftermarket head unit if you must have it or use a phone based app like I do. I don't know about bluetooth/phones in a 996/997 so someone else will have to comment on that.
I would look for a car with heated seats and a sunroof in a colour you like and see what turns up, be it 2WD or 4WD if you're not too fussed.
I would look for a car with heated seats and a sunroof in a colour you like and see what turns up, be it 2WD or 4WD if you're not too fussed.
My '04 996 had heated seats and nav. The latter was pretty old school as you'd expect. No Bluetooth (had it been invented then?) and a little slot in the dash for a SIM card, very cool back in the day!
My advice to the OP is stick to simple cars with as broad appeal as possible, after all you might not like it! A really nice 996/997 C2 with manual box and a sunroof will always sell on if the history is right. Sounds like you're already looking at colours, some 996's have pretty unpleasant combos!
My advice to the OP is stick to simple cars with as broad appeal as possible, after all you might not like it! A really nice 996/997 C2 with manual box and a sunroof will always sell on if the history is right. Sounds like you're already looking at colours, some 996's have pretty unpleasant combos!
As has been said, don't fixate on the Nav/Bluetooth thing.
Bluetooth can be retrofitted with different modules, or the whole unit can be updated with a new unit, incl. BT and Nav. Have a look at Zenec, if you want something OEM looking.
As for C2 or C4, take whatever comes up that you like the look of it (goes without saying that you need to do all the important mechanical inspections first).
I have been dead set on a C4 and ended up with a C2. Never regretted it. To be brutally honest, there is not such a huge difference in them. You really have to be driving on the limit all the time to get the advantage of the C4. On those test drives I did over the course of two years in various C4s, I frankly couldn't tell them apart from the C2s under normal driving conditions.
I also wanted a sunroof car, but again I ended up with a non sunroof model. But the sunroof is made of metal (no extra light when closed as on a glass one) and rather small. Some people prefer a non sunroof one because of the greater torsional rigidity. But since I'm driving a normal road car and 99.99% of the time in normal traffic, even on an early sunday morning blast I highly doubt I could ever tell a difference in torsional rigidity.
And regarding the colours, I also wanted a blue car. Ended up with a black one.
Hmmm.... What else was a must for me??
Ah, yes. I absolutely wanted the sport seats! Does my car have them? No. And today I actually prefer them. To look at (they are more elegant and less sporty) but also to sit in them (if you have wide shoulders they might be to snug). And the standard seats tend to wear better as they don't have such high side bolsters. And they are absolutely fine to hold you in place in fast bends.
The only thing I'm glad I didn't deviate from my wish list is the extended leather! So much nicer!
I don't advocate that you buy a car that is not right for you. I would never buy a car that doesn't speak to me, but my experience tells me not to dismiss a good car in the first place just because I set my mind for something else. You might fall for it nevertheless
ETA:
Just go and have a look at just about any 996/997 Coupe in your budget and area. And also go and have a look at the cheap and high milers! You will learn more with every car you look at and when the right one comes up, go for it!!!
Bluetooth can be retrofitted with different modules, or the whole unit can be updated with a new unit, incl. BT and Nav. Have a look at Zenec, if you want something OEM looking.
As for C2 or C4, take whatever comes up that you like the look of it (goes without saying that you need to do all the important mechanical inspections first).
I have been dead set on a C4 and ended up with a C2. Never regretted it. To be brutally honest, there is not such a huge difference in them. You really have to be driving on the limit all the time to get the advantage of the C4. On those test drives I did over the course of two years in various C4s, I frankly couldn't tell them apart from the C2s under normal driving conditions.
I also wanted a sunroof car, but again I ended up with a non sunroof model. But the sunroof is made of metal (no extra light when closed as on a glass one) and rather small. Some people prefer a non sunroof one because of the greater torsional rigidity. But since I'm driving a normal road car and 99.99% of the time in normal traffic, even on an early sunday morning blast I highly doubt I could ever tell a difference in torsional rigidity.
And regarding the colours, I also wanted a blue car. Ended up with a black one.
Hmmm.... What else was a must for me??
Ah, yes. I absolutely wanted the sport seats! Does my car have them? No. And today I actually prefer them. To look at (they are more elegant and less sporty) but also to sit in them (if you have wide shoulders they might be to snug). And the standard seats tend to wear better as they don't have such high side bolsters. And they are absolutely fine to hold you in place in fast bends.
The only thing I'm glad I didn't deviate from my wish list is the extended leather! So much nicer!
I don't advocate that you buy a car that is not right for you. I would never buy a car that doesn't speak to me, but my experience tells me not to dismiss a good car in the first place just because I set my mind for something else. You might fall for it nevertheless
ETA:
Just go and have a look at just about any 996/997 Coupe in your budget and area. And also go and have a look at the cheap and high milers! You will learn more with every car you look at and when the right one comes up, go for it!!!
Edited by Filibuster on Monday 3rd July 17:32
"caveat emptor"- you really, really need to do your homework, before you dive in.
Start looking around, get a feel for whats out there for condition/mileage /price. Kick a few tyres and drive a few.
Plenty of reading to be had here;
https://www.hartech.org/ they have several in-depth downloads w.r.t. some of the "foibles" of the water cooled Porsche engines, and there are some scary stories out there on 996 and 997s. Cylinder liners, IMS bearings, bore scoring, cooling etc etc;
also this is a useful & friendly forum. http://911uk.com/
your budget will get you into an early 997.1.
3.6 or 3.8? I'd say a negligible difference for most mortals.
Yes the PCM is as dated as a bowler hat- I use a Garmin and just burn CDs until I can be arsed ripping it out -I'd rather be driving it.
I have the sports seats- (love `em- yes the bolsters get scuffed), Full leather, and most other options on mine apart from the sunroof.
good luck & happy hunting
Start looking around, get a feel for whats out there for condition/mileage /price. Kick a few tyres and drive a few.
Plenty of reading to be had here;
https://www.hartech.org/ they have several in-depth downloads w.r.t. some of the "foibles" of the water cooled Porsche engines, and there are some scary stories out there on 996 and 997s. Cylinder liners, IMS bearings, bore scoring, cooling etc etc;
also this is a useful & friendly forum. http://911uk.com/
your budget will get you into an early 997.1.
3.6 or 3.8? I'd say a negligible difference for most mortals.
Yes the PCM is as dated as a bowler hat- I use a Garmin and just burn CDs until I can be arsed ripping it out -I'd rather be driving it.
I have the sports seats- (love `em- yes the bolsters get scuffed), Full leather, and most other options on mine apart from the sunroof.
good luck & happy hunting
Edited by brownspeed on Monday 3rd July 18:42
I did exactly what the OP is planning to, quite frankly I wish I had just bought an mx-5 instead.
If you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
If you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
You really need to drive a few different models, some say they prefer the rawer 996, others prefer the interior of the 997.
C4 offers little benefit the majority of the time yet adds weight & further reduces the already small boot space.
996 C4S would be at the top end of your budget yet is arguably the best looking 996.
996's seem to be slowly appreciating, 997's may still have some depriciation yet, 3.8's more prone to bore score.
Don't get too hung up on spec, PSE, M030 etc will all likely need replacing soon anyway. Buy a good one that's had some money spent on it & you'll be a very happy man.
Had my 996 C2 manual coupe for 8yrs, still love it to bits.
C4 offers little benefit the majority of the time yet adds weight & further reduces the already small boot space.
996 C4S would be at the top end of your budget yet is arguably the best looking 996.
996's seem to be slowly appreciating, 997's may still have some depriciation yet, 3.8's more prone to bore score.
Don't get too hung up on spec, PSE, M030 etc will all likely need replacing soon anyway. Buy a good one that's had some money spent on it & you'll be a very happy man.
Had my 996 C2 manual coupe for 8yrs, still love it to bits.
Aesthetics 996 vs 997 is your call.
I wanted a non silver manual coupe with black leather. Everything else i was flexible on. Ended up with a complete basic spec but in the right colour (ocean blue) and have upgraded to sports seats, double din Sat nav radio had unit, and 3 spoke wheel.
I don't care that the case wasn't originally specced with those bits, I care that it's got them now.
Would have liked pse but if original it would have needed replacing and I can just change mine out for Top Gear switchable etc
I wanted a non silver manual coupe with black leather. Everything else i was flexible on. Ended up with a complete basic spec but in the right colour (ocean blue) and have upgraded to sports seats, double din Sat nav radio had unit, and 3 spoke wheel.
I don't care that the case wasn't originally specced with those bits, I care that it's got them now.
Would have liked pse but if original it would have needed replacing and I can just change mine out for Top Gear switchable etc
gottans said:
I did exactly what the OP is planning to, quite frankly I wish I had just bought an mx-5 instead.
If you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
Exact oposite of what he ^ said.If you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
Never had a hand signal, perhaps because i dont drive like a t*t.
Brilliant ownership and driving experience everywhere from the Outer Hebrides to German Autobahn.
Have used Cambridge OPC over 10 years for sales (3 cars) and service which has always been exemplary, both scheduled or emergency (dead battery).
Ah you lovely people - I've learnt so much already.
Please do continue to just post your thoughts if anything more comes to mind - this is totally invaluable to me and I really do appreciate it.
I understand what you are all now saying about Sat Nav and Bluetooth (either outdated or not invented back then) - I can just clear that out of mind for now then and consider upgrades later - excellent call.
On what I've seen I think I prefer the look of the dash layout of the 997 but am not opposed to the 996. I will not insult anyone's pride and joy. I am envious of you whatever you have! I also don't quite get the dislike of the 996's headlights - I actually quite like them. If anything the 996 looks like it has a thinner nose on the bonnet or something - maybe that's just me. It's not that I don't like it - it's just different. I like both versions.
Can I just check for your forum etiquette - would it be permissible for me to post a link to one advertised car that I like just to get your initial advice or response to it in terms of spec, condition and pricing. This would help me going forward and I don't mind if you annihilate it. Perhaps this is not the done thing? I would certainly be interested to see how you would look at the car and am sure I'd learn from this.
The more I know, the more I realise what I really don't know! I have never driven one and I'm not sure I'd know what I'm looking for and listening for?! But heh I like learning new things...
On your advice I'm now thinking - Carrera 2 with a Sunroof (I thought perhaps that in our NI rain here the 4 might be a better all rounder but if there's not much in it then to be honest I'd prefer the 2).
Please do continue to just post your thoughts if anything more comes to mind - this is totally invaluable to me and I really do appreciate it.
I understand what you are all now saying about Sat Nav and Bluetooth (either outdated or not invented back then) - I can just clear that out of mind for now then and consider upgrades later - excellent call.
On what I've seen I think I prefer the look of the dash layout of the 997 but am not opposed to the 996. I will not insult anyone's pride and joy. I am envious of you whatever you have! I also don't quite get the dislike of the 996's headlights - I actually quite like them. If anything the 996 looks like it has a thinner nose on the bonnet or something - maybe that's just me. It's not that I don't like it - it's just different. I like both versions.
Can I just check for your forum etiquette - would it be permissible for me to post a link to one advertised car that I like just to get your initial advice or response to it in terms of spec, condition and pricing. This would help me going forward and I don't mind if you annihilate it. Perhaps this is not the done thing? I would certainly be interested to see how you would look at the car and am sure I'd learn from this.
The more I know, the more I realise what I really don't know! I have never driven one and I'm not sure I'd know what I'm looking for and listening for?! But heh I like learning new things...
On your advice I'm now thinking - Carrera 2 with a Sunroof (I thought perhaps that in our NI rain here the 4 might be a better all rounder but if there's not much in it then to be honest I'd prefer the 2).
Edited by Dr Ing on Monday 3rd July 21:11
Edited by Dr Ing on Monday 3rd July 21:16
You are doing the right thing and asking questions before you buy but whichever way you think about it these are expensive cars and can throw some eye watering bills. They have some well known weak points that create eye watering bills.
My experience has been very poor and is official dealer related rather than the car.
My experience has been very poor and is official dealer related rather than the car.
I assume you've seen this other thread that's currently running? There is some useful info in there
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Good luck with the search. I'm still sure there's some gems out there. It's just a question of finding them. My search continues.... There was a 996 in NI listed in the classifieds. Morgan Car Sales I think it was?
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Good luck with the search. I'm still sure there's some gems out there. It's just a question of finding them. My search continues.... There was a 996 in NI listed in the classifieds. Morgan Car Sales I think it was?
Greggy69 said:
There was a 996 in NI listed in the classifieds. Morgan Car Sales I think it was?
This one: https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...gottans said:
I did exactly what the OP is planning to, quite frankly I wish I had just bought an mx-5 instead.
If you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
I'm afraid that's more to do with you than your car. After 3 years a 2 Porsches the only hand signal I can recall was I cocked up. Never anything for simply having the car, that's a mythIf you can put up with the offensive hand signals and other general abuse you will get driving a Porsche, the OPC I used for servicing were awful beyond belief.
I though Audi were bad but in comparison to the OPC I used they are complete novices. My first and last Porsche, never ever again!
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