The 997 Appreciation Thread
Discussion
I know it’s ‘just about the driving’ but being able to use the 997 for everything including work journeys enhances the pleasure and thus having a CarPlay with google maps and being able to plan where I’m going adds to the enhancement. As I’ve said, easy to fit. Hard to see the comparison with a Tesla though for the small amount of mileage the poster above has stated, for cost or enjoyment.
RDMcG said:
Very different choices to say the least..
I have driven most of the EVs including Teslas and the Taycan Turbo S. Amazingly impressive things.
Yet ,when I climb into my 13 year old 7.1RS with its vintage nav system,hydraulic steering,no stability control, heavy clutch and nervous wet handling, I am immediately engaged and stay that way. Any 997 is a much more tactile car. I like the 997 C4S personally of the non GT cars.
My hat off to you Sir I have driven most of the EVs including Teslas and the Taycan Turbo S. Amazingly impressive things.
Yet ,when I climb into my 13 year old 7.1RS with its vintage nav system,hydraulic steering,no stability control, heavy clutch and nervous wet handling, I am immediately engaged and stay that way. Any 997 is a much more tactile car. I like the 997 C4S personally of the non GT cars.
272BHP said:
RDMcG said:
One pedestrian thing to be aware of is how dated all of the electronics are...no bluetooth, silly little map, no Apple or other interfaces, obsolete nav, no voice control and of course none of the modern reversing cameras, adaptive cruise control and so on.
I know this is PH and we only care about raw white knuckle excitement ( as world class driver, powerfully built director and carrier of my own custard tin I can confirm this), but when I do drive my 997 I notice this.
I have retrofitted Bluetooth but the 997 does not have a Porsche Classic retrofit yet, so you have to go aftermarket if this matters. The Tesla OTOH is just plugged into the web in myriad ways.
I don't think I would miss any of that.I know this is PH and we only care about raw white knuckle excitement ( as world class driver, powerfully built director and carrier of my own custard tin I can confirm this), but when I do drive my 997 I notice this.
I have retrofitted Bluetooth but the 997 does not have a Porsche Classic retrofit yet, so you have to go aftermarket if this matters. The Tesla OTOH is just plugged into the web in myriad ways.
I have had top electronics on the last few cars I have had. Apple car play etc. Never used any of them, I don't even connect to our latest car, I use the radio and that's it. If I need to use sat nav I just start google maps on my phone and listen to the instructions - less faff
They’re both still here
Mariosbt said:
N111BJG said:
It never occurred to me that the inability to listen to DAB radio or yap on the phone impaired my drive to here in this
In my view their absence enhances my 997 experience
WOW... I’ve looked at these resin drives, but that is fantastic man. In my view their absence enhances my 997 experience
Anybody here share the view that the slightly rawer 997.1 with the slightly more engaging character engine adds up to a tastiest car than the gen 2?
I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
rootsandculture said:
Anybody here share the view that the slightly rawer 997.1 with the slightly more engaging character engine adds up to a tastiest car than the gen 2?
I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
I had owned the 7.1RS and the 7.2RS., The .2 is in my view the better car, especially when you are close to flat out. Also better wet handling. I just have a special feeling for .7.1 and could not part with it, but objectively I knew the difference.I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
RDMcG said:
I had owned the 7.1RS and the 7.2RS., The .2 is in my view the better car, especially when you are close to flat out. Also better wet handling. I just have a special feeling for .7.1 and could not part with it, but objectively I knew the difference.
Is the gen 2 rs engine dfi? rootsandculture said:
Anybody here share the view that the slightly rawer 997.1 with the slightly more engaging character engine adds up to a tastiest car than the gen 2?
I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
I've owned a gen 1, and gen 2 (both C2S). I much preferred the engine in the gen 1, but I found the handling on the gen 2 pipped the gen 1 - it had a slightly better tied-down front end (but again, this made it less characterful ,and more "normal"). My gen 2 was on the Sport PASM chassis though, so not like-for-like in that regard.I ask this as everything I’ve read (written by much more knowledgable people than myself) says the opposite, but that has been my brief impression.
I used my 7.1 as a daily for nearly 5 years, and absolutely adored it. I still utterly regret parting with it.
D.no said:
I've owned a gen 1, and gen 2 (both C2S). I much preferred the engine in the gen 1, but I found the handling on the gen 2 pipped the gen 1 - it had a slightly better tied-down front end (but again, this made it less characterful ,and more "normal"). My gen 2 was on the Sport PASM chassis though, so not like-for-like in that regard.
I used my 7.1 as a daily for nearly 5 years, and absolutely adored it. I still utterly regret parting with it.
Seems my hankering for a gen 1 in a good colour is growing I used my 7.1 as a daily for nearly 5 years, and absolutely adored it. I still utterly regret parting with it.
Thank you
rootsandculture said:
Is the gen 2 rs engine dfi?
No. Both gen1 and gen2 RS engines are the same Mezger units, except the gen 2 displacement increased from 3.6 to 3.8, and had the addition of variable exhaust valve timing (both have variable inlet valve timing). I believe the question related to the differences between the non-GT M97(997.1) and 9A1(997.2 DFI) engines.
rootsandculture said:
D.no said:
I've owned a gen 1, and gen 2 (both C2S). I much preferred the engine in the gen 1, but I found the handling on the gen 2 pipped the gen 1 - it had a slightly better tied-down front end (but again, this made it less characterful ,and more "normal"). My gen 2 was on the Sport PASM chassis though, so not like-for-like in that regard.
I used my 7.1 as a daily for nearly 5 years, and absolutely adored it. I still utterly regret parting with it.
Seems my hankering for a gen 1 in a good colour is growing I used my 7.1 as a daily for nearly 5 years, and absolutely adored it. I still utterly regret parting with it.
Thank you
I much prefer the look of the gen.1 over the gen.2
And have been told often that they Look EXACTLY the same ?
Same with the GT cars, early ones look more purposeful, slightly more aggressive if that makes any sense ? To my eye the gen.1 is more old school looking back and the gen.2 is more new age looking forward.
The gen.1 aero kitted cars are amongst some of the nicest looking 911’s ever produced.
Of course the interior of the gen.2 is updated, the PCM slightly updated and the PDK out strips the tiptronic at every given turn, which is not difficult as the Tip is appalling and the first PDK cars are only marginally more compliant.
I find the 997.1 to be a well rounded modern classic, most things that were wrong with the 996 were addressed on the 997 “apart from the engine woes” which can be addressed by buying a later 06 .1 with larger IMS and also buying a manual which doesn’t create the stress on the drive line from low down torque applications that the tip creates.
There’s the argument that a 997.2 interior is vastly superior as it’s newer ? Which is ridiculous, if I wanted a new interior I’d buy a 992. !
It’s got 3 pedals and a gear stick, everything else is irrelevant !
hyphen said:
Are the gen 1 engines at risk to the same issues as the 996? I.e. May require a rebuild
In short YES !But do your home work, read up on the gen.1’s.
One snippet of information you will never learn from the service history or from a folder full of receipts is how the engine was driven from Cold ? Have the previous owners bestowed mechanical sympathy when setting off for work at 6AM in the middle of January when its -2 degrees ?
The same can be said for any car but when these have an Achilles heel some careful thought needs to be given to its past life.
I looked at a car a few years ago and the owner was so confident that his engine was tip top he dropped the oil while we stood chatting and dropped in what he said was a rare earth magnet ! “Strong” after removing the filter and cutting it open it looked like a conveyor belt off gold diggers, removing the magnet was his second mistake, as his confidence slipped away I made my excuses and sloped off whilst the realisation of what he’d just done dawned him !
Over revs tell you basically nothing, apart from a few misses gear changes from the flappy paddles, which I believe speeds up the detonation of the IMS in the Tip cars.
As a above after 06 they increased the size of the IMS which ran for almost 2 years ? Apparently some 05 cars do have them and the line in the sand is marked by an engine number, anything after that has the larger bearing.
hyphen said:
Are the gen 1 engines at risk to the same issues as the 996? I.e. May require a rebuild
All carry a risk of bore-scoring (though 7.2 seem less prone), and 997.1's carry the risk of IMS bearing failure - there's loads of info' on here (and elsewhere) about both issues, with pre-06 cars seemingly more afflicted. Mine was an 06 car, and suffered neither issue in nearly 60k miles of my tenure, but you tend not to hear about none-issues on the internet. With a reputable rebuild, a reasonable slush fund, or a 4-leaf clover in your top pocket, they make a fantastically rewarding, characterful, and practical sports car.
D.no said:
hyphen said:
Are the gen 1 engines at risk to the same issues as the 996? I.e. May require a rebuild
All carry a risk of bore-scoring (though 7.2 seem less prone), and 997.1's carry the risk of IMS bearing failure - there's loads of info' on here (and elsewhere) about both issues, with pre-06 cars seemingly more afflicted. Mine was an 06 car, and suffered neither issue in nearly 60k miles of my tenure, but you tend not to hear about none-issues on the internet. With a reputable rebuild, a reasonable slush fund, or a 4-leaf clover in your top pocket, they make a fantastically rewarding, characterful, and practical sports car.
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