End of tether with our son
Discussion
Anyone with the same problem?
Son is 15 and 6’2”. Lives with his mum and completely controls her. He steals her money by nicking her card, lies and hardly ever goes to school.
He has a brother and sister who are both suffering from being in a toxic home environment.
As he’s better when being looked after by me, I have left my home in the countryside and my nearby girlfriend to move back to London and live in a pokey flat in order to be around to help.
Thing is it has got to a point that he won’t even respond to me.
He was bullied in his first 2 years of secondary school and by 14, and at his request we moved him from that private school to the same state school that his younger brother is in.
For the beginning of his first term, the start of his GCSEs, everything seemed fine but then he would refuse to go in, citing the usual youth guff of what’s the point of school etc etc
Shame is, he’s a very bright lad, got a good Saturday job and started to save his wages which he bought a PS4 with but......
Now he’s on it from getting up till the early hours. His mum takes it away or turns off the wifi if he won’t get off it, refuse to go to school or is very rude to her.
He will then taunt her and get into a rage and start smashing the house up. The place is a wreck thanks just to his efforts.
His mum is broken. He was such a gentle lad but now a monster. We believe he is being bullied again despite his size but he refuses to snitch. We also think he’s depressed.
His only friends seem to be out there in PS4 land where he just yells obscenities into his mouthpiece.
We are going to try to get him to our GP on Monday. The School appear not to be bothered despite his constant absences.
It is an abusive relationship but as she’s his mum, she can’t run away.
Son is 15 and 6’2”. Lives with his mum and completely controls her. He steals her money by nicking her card, lies and hardly ever goes to school.
He has a brother and sister who are both suffering from being in a toxic home environment.
As he’s better when being looked after by me, I have left my home in the countryside and my nearby girlfriend to move back to London and live in a pokey flat in order to be around to help.
Thing is it has got to a point that he won’t even respond to me.
He was bullied in his first 2 years of secondary school and by 14, and at his request we moved him from that private school to the same state school that his younger brother is in.
For the beginning of his first term, the start of his GCSEs, everything seemed fine but then he would refuse to go in, citing the usual youth guff of what’s the point of school etc etc
Shame is, he’s a very bright lad, got a good Saturday job and started to save his wages which he bought a PS4 with but......
Now he’s on it from getting up till the early hours. His mum takes it away or turns off the wifi if he won’t get off it, refuse to go to school or is very rude to her.
He will then taunt her and get into a rage and start smashing the house up. The place is a wreck thanks just to his efforts.
His mum is broken. He was such a gentle lad but now a monster. We believe he is being bullied again despite his size but he refuses to snitch. We also think he’s depressed.
His only friends seem to be out there in PS4 land where he just yells obscenities into his mouthpiece.
We are going to try to get him to our GP on Monday. The School appear not to be bothered despite his constant absences.
It is an abusive relationship but as she’s his mum, she can’t run away.
Edited by croyde on Sunday 21st January 09:10
Is there any possibility of boarding school?
My son was very difficult though not abusive. Psych thought he was heading for a life of crime. A small outward bound school made a lot of demands on him and he became a functioning person. Today he is a wonderful adult and I have a great relationship although his relationship with his mother (my ex) remains strained. He had gone on to a very successful career and credits the school with saving him.
Not suggesting any magic here but just a thought. I admire you for making the personal sacrifice and hope he will recognize that in time.
My son was very difficult though not abusive. Psych thought he was heading for a life of crime. A small outward bound school made a lot of demands on him and he became a functioning person. Today he is a wonderful adult and I have a great relationship although his relationship with his mother (my ex) remains strained. He had gone on to a very successful career and credits the school with saving him.
Not suggesting any magic here but just a thought. I admire you for making the personal sacrifice and hope he will recognize that in time.
First of all my sympathies, this doesn’t sound great.
To some extent I suspect all teenagers go through a phase of being an arse. Most come out the other side.
I know my lad had a couple of moments, again living with the ex-wife. At one time I had to give him the Army standard interview without coffee. Where it was explained in no uncertain terms that I was bigger, meaner and nastier than him and if he didn’t book his ideas up things would change in his life for the worse. It seemed to work and i now couldn’t be prouder of him, doing well at college, unconditional Uni offers and a job he works hard at.
Not a solution for everyone I’ll be the first to admit, but it did work in this case.
If it is depression, or even you suspect it is, I’d suggest a chat with your GP to see if your suspicions may be correct?
Good luck, all you can do is play it as you see it.
To some extent I suspect all teenagers go through a phase of being an arse. Most come out the other side.
I know my lad had a couple of moments, again living with the ex-wife. At one time I had to give him the Army standard interview without coffee. Where it was explained in no uncertain terms that I was bigger, meaner and nastier than him and if he didn’t book his ideas up things would change in his life for the worse. It seemed to work and i now couldn’t be prouder of him, doing well at college, unconditional Uni offers and a job he works hard at.
Not a solution for everyone I’ll be the first to admit, but it did work in this case.
If it is depression, or even you suspect it is, I’d suggest a chat with your GP to see if your suspicions may be correct?
Good luck, all you can do is play it as you see it.
what was the reason for the bullying, when did you an your wife part ways, does he fit in with the norm i.e. when inwas a teen jean t shirt jumper was ok but long hair listening to differnet music liking games workshop an wearing coloured laces in your dm's marked you out as odd an right or wrong people picked on you or excluded you. (when you get to uni non of that s
t matters anymore but 13 to 16 is hard).
Does he have friends are they in same socio economic group etc harsh but true hang around withs you often become one. Is he gay etc coming to terms with your own sexuality might be very hard. Does he have or ever had a disability.
really could be many things but talking likely best thing to start with. Oh an if he smashed the house up ebay the ps4 ffs its your house st has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.
t matters anymore but 13 to 16 is hard).Does he have friends are they in same socio economic group etc harsh but true hang around with
s you often become one. Is he gay etc coming to terms with your own sexuality might be very hard. Does he have or ever had a disability.really could be many things but talking likely best thing to start with. Oh an if he smashed the house up ebay the ps4 ffs its your house s
t has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.Gecko1978 said:
Oh an if he smashed the house up ebay the ps4 ffs its your house st has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.
Actions have consequences as they say. I'd flog it in a heartbeat. t has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.He needs rules and boundaries. I dread to think what would've happened to me at that age, had I behaved like that.
I remember the mechanic who trained me telling me once how his daughter kept paying really loud music on her stereo, wouldn’t turn it down etc. He went up with wire snippers cut the plug off and went back downstairs.
Worth planning to use that at some point at the right moment. Eg he kicks off and gets rude, stomps up to his room and goes on ps4. You stomp up after and cut the plug off and stomp back downstairs.
Worth planning to use that at some point at the right moment. Eg he kicks off and gets rude, stomps up to his room and goes on ps4. You stomp up after and cut the plug off and stomp back downstairs.
DuraAce said:
Gecko1978 said:
Oh an if he smashed the house up ebay the ps4 ffs its your house st has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.
Actions have consequences as they say. I'd flog it in a heartbeat. t has to be paid for so he looses the ps4 simple as that.He needs rules and boundaries. I dread to think what would've happened to me at that age, had I behaved like that.
But it's about the only way his mum can make him, some of the time, to go to school.
He doesn't go, she takes it off him.
I have given him the army interview sans coffee as suggested, but it has little effect.
I'd gladly pack him off to a boarding school but day school costs were crippling enough.
I know he's deeply unhappy but seems unable or unwilling to explain what's going on.
Feel for you OP.
I went through a similar scenario about 5 years ago and it got to a point where I had to drive to their home in North Devon (from SW London) and take him to live with me. He didn't know I was coming and kicked off when he realised why I was there. There was lots of shouting, lots of tears and even the Police (who were fantastic) had to come and tell him to leave his mums house. It was a horrible few hours.
He came to live with my partner and I for the next year or so. We set clear boundaries, made sure he searched for and got work. Made him pay rent each week etc. I actually just saved his rent and gave it back once he'd found his own place and proved himself. We all just tried to be consistent with the rules we put in place. It wasn't easy and he clearly blamed me for the break up of his parents marriage and the family home years earlier. We kept talking and tried to let him see we were all doing the best we could. I also tried to help him see how lucky he was to have 2 parents that love him and although not spoilt, he's not exactly had it tough.
He's in a much better place now and our relationship is far better. The consistency of parenting is still there and hopefully he's more secure nowadays. All we can do, as parents, is be there and let our kids know they're loved whilst being an example to them. I'm sure your boy knows his behaviour has been unacceptable but he's hitting out at those closest to him. Low self worth and low self esteem take time to change.
I went through a similar scenario about 5 years ago and it got to a point where I had to drive to their home in North Devon (from SW London) and take him to live with me. He didn't know I was coming and kicked off when he realised why I was there. There was lots of shouting, lots of tears and even the Police (who were fantastic) had to come and tell him to leave his mums house. It was a horrible few hours.
He came to live with my partner and I for the next year or so. We set clear boundaries, made sure he searched for and got work. Made him pay rent each week etc. I actually just saved his rent and gave it back once he'd found his own place and proved himself. We all just tried to be consistent with the rules we put in place. It wasn't easy and he clearly blamed me for the break up of his parents marriage and the family home years earlier. We kept talking and tried to let him see we were all doing the best we could. I also tried to help him see how lucky he was to have 2 parents that love him and although not spoilt, he's not exactly had it tough.
He's in a much better place now and our relationship is far better. The consistency of parenting is still there and hopefully he's more secure nowadays. All we can do, as parents, is be there and let our kids know they're loved whilst being an example to them. I'm sure your boy knows his behaviour has been unacceptable but he's hitting out at those closest to him. Low self worth and low self esteem take time to change.
Sorry to hear that, it’s a sad situation. Could be many things as stated before. Why was he bullied at school initially? Probably has a component of that maybe adding the split with your wife. Seems to me he is angry with everyone and life in general but he also has been through a lot himself at earlier formative years.
Frank talking at an equal level and neutral grounds would be my choice. Why not bring him up to the countryside one weekend and go for a walk and pub lunch just you and him? That could help him to actually speak out what he feels/thinks?
Going harsh and shouty might exacerbate the problem but you know your lad might be what he needs also. Best of luck.
Frank talking at an equal level and neutral grounds would be my choice. Why not bring him up to the countryside one weekend and go for a walk and pub lunch just you and him? That could help him to actually speak out what he feels/thinks?
Going harsh and shouty might exacerbate the problem but you know your lad might be what he needs also. Best of luck.
Limiting time on devices is the key IMO. Our 14yo lad is gifted 2 hours playing time at the weekend. He can earn additional time in 15 minute chunks through good deeds / showing respect, but loses time in 30 minute chunks if he starts swearing at us / showing no respect etc. It seems to work for him as he has clear guidelines on how he can gain and lose time.
ETA. We don’t have the not going to school issue, as it’s a 40 minute drive each day. He also competes at rugby to a pretty high level so has that outlet (he does turn into a st if he hasn’t had a match in a while, though)
ETA. We don’t have the not going to school issue, as it’s a 40 minute drive each day. He also competes at rugby to a pretty high level so has that outlet (he does turn into a s
t if he hasn’t had a match in a while, though)Edited by schmalex on Sunday 21st January 09:50
Thanks e30m3 and Justinio I'm at work at the moment, have been since 1am, and one of the guys here was similar as a teen then he discovered karate.
Still does it 20 years later.
I did think boxing. Trouble is getting him to go out and do it.
At his private school he got into rowing on the Thames and even came in top 10 of his age group in the UK indoor rowing at the Olympic Park.
But then he stopped going saying he only did it cos we wanted him to do it.
That wasn't true. He trained and even ate a good diet. All his idea. He got taller and stronger and started to get a good physique.
But then gave up.
Still does it 20 years later.
I did think boxing. Trouble is getting him to go out and do it.
At his private school he got into rowing on the Thames and even came in top 10 of his age group in the UK indoor rowing at the Olympic Park.
But then he stopped going saying he only did it cos we wanted him to do it.
That wasn't true. He trained and even ate a good diet. All his idea. He got taller and stronger and started to get a good physique.
But then gave up.
Edited by croyde on Sunday 21st January 09:54
At 15 years old I'm wondering what part girls play in his life?
At that age its easy to become a bit of an outcast..
My son went through the constant gaming phase and became a bit reclusive..but then got introduced to climbing walls and surfing and through this got very confident and met girls outside of his school group. ( also I quite enjoy a weekend blast down to Devon for surfing/sinus flushing )
Having said that he is currently online in some multiplayer Xbox game that seems to require a lot of shouting
At that age its easy to become a bit of an outcast..
My son went through the constant gaming phase and became a bit reclusive..but then got introduced to climbing walls and surfing and through this got very confident and met girls outside of his school group. ( also I quite enjoy a weekend blast down to Devon for surfing/sinus flushing )
Having said that he is currently online in some multiplayer Xbox game that seems to require a lot of shouting
It's likely the PS4 is an escape for him and the anti-social, unpleasant behaviour is a front... the thing is, that doesn't mean it isn't utter hell for all around him and it certainly doesn't mean that you should let it continue.
The PS4 is a good carrot / stick and it sounds like it's being used well. But it strikes me that this level of malevolent rejection of the things closest around him (the front) is potentially quite dangerous and could easily get out of hand.
I'd suggest taking steps to engage with him - and create situations where others might engage with him - in order to see if there's not a better way to address the things he seeks to escape from and perhaps begin to try and understand - and allow him to understand - why his aggressive, detached front is actually no good for anyone. GP is a good call, but it'll only work if your son is up for it and happy to genuinely talk... another route (that GP will likely also mention) is CAMHS, but you'll likely face a lengthy wait for anything useful: https://youngminds.org.uk/find-help/your-guide-to-...
It's easy to guess from the comfort of a distant armchair, but this sounds like an angry and confused young man who has limited avenues to vent his rage into. Maybe he is still hurt, processing... blaming himself, from the separation... who knows. But teenagers have a lot going on biologically and they are adapting and growing into a world that most of us will never really understand... add to this some subconscious issues, unresolved anger, confusion, etc... and you can end up with a good kid, who just wants to curl up in a ball and angrily shoot imaginary cyber enemies that he never needs to meet.
Is there anything in the "real world" he likes?
Is there any common ground that could be the foundation of repair?
It is very difficult.
The PS4 is a good carrot / stick and it sounds like it's being used well. But it strikes me that this level of malevolent rejection of the things closest around him (the front) is potentially quite dangerous and could easily get out of hand.
I'd suggest taking steps to engage with him - and create situations where others might engage with him - in order to see if there's not a better way to address the things he seeks to escape from and perhaps begin to try and understand - and allow him to understand - why his aggressive, detached front is actually no good for anyone. GP is a good call, but it'll only work if your son is up for it and happy to genuinely talk... another route (that GP will likely also mention) is CAMHS, but you'll likely face a lengthy wait for anything useful: https://youngminds.org.uk/find-help/your-guide-to-...
It's easy to guess from the comfort of a distant armchair, but this sounds like an angry and confused young man who has limited avenues to vent his rage into. Maybe he is still hurt, processing... blaming himself, from the separation... who knows. But teenagers have a lot going on biologically and they are adapting and growing into a world that most of us will never really understand... add to this some subconscious issues, unresolved anger, confusion, etc... and you can end up with a good kid, who just wants to curl up in a ball and angrily shoot imaginary cyber enemies that he never needs to meet.
Is there anything in the "real world" he likes?
Is there any common ground that could be the foundation of repair?
It is very difficult.
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