991.1 GT3-RS: GOOD TIME TO BUY...??
Discussion
blackmamba said:
Question is - do you want to pay up for one now so you can use over the summer? I wouldn’t. Plenty of fun to be had with other cars at more sensible money and look again in 6 months when I think prices will be usefully lower.
That's far too sensible. Plenty of impatient, fickle, over leveraged 'must have it now's' to take advantage of.991 gen 1 gt3 not a safe bet over a long term, but you if look hard enough you can pick up a excellent usable low mileage car for less the 120k with a warranty.
991 gen 1 gt3 rs are not selling, they seem to be dropping in price weekly. Imo a safer bet long term but now isn’t the time to buy. Plus if you use it like the gt4 the price will fall massively. Remember many people think a gt3rs with 5000 miles on the clock is high mileage and would be far more tempted to buy the car with 800 miles on the clock for not much more money. Many have been bought to look at not drive and that’s why you are seeing so many for sale at the moment as people can see prices changing weekly. I personally love the look of the gen1 gt3rs
If money is a concern it’s safer to keep the gt4 and spend a little on it and still use it like you are. Or consider a new gt4 if you can get a build slot? That way you get new technology and a warranty.
991 gen 1 gt3 rs are not selling, they seem to be dropping in price weekly. Imo a safer bet long term but now isn’t the time to buy. Plus if you use it like the gt4 the price will fall massively. Remember many people think a gt3rs with 5000 miles on the clock is high mileage and would be far more tempted to buy the car with 800 miles on the clock for not much more money. Many have been bought to look at not drive and that’s why you are seeing so many for sale at the moment as people can see prices changing weekly. I personally love the look of the gen1 gt3rs
If money is a concern it’s safer to keep the gt4 and spend a little on it and still use it like you are. Or consider a new gt4 if you can get a build slot? That way you get new technology and a warranty.
I've recently just gone through this exact scenario. I got rid of my GT4 and replaced it with a 991.1 RS. I own a number of other RS and GT cars so the PDK only box in the 991.1 RS didn't really bother me, that said it is very impressive.
My thoughts on the 991.1 GT3 was that it was just a bit "normal". It's a very accomplished car but just didn't feel special enough. As someone else has said it would make a great daily driver, but that's also its downfall. There is also the engine issue and it will be an issue in years to come in much the same way as early 997's have engine issues which are well publicised.
By contrast, the 991.1 RS feels like a motorsport car. To be fair it is a bit too fast. It's not the most subtle of cars either, but neither is the 997 RS, or the 996 RS for that matter. But that's all part of the allure if it's your thing.
On values, given your mileage and usage, I would opt for one of the 9,000 ish mile examples from an OPC. Just make sure it has a leather dash, axle lift and ceramics. My research led me to believe these were must-haves if you want to move it on quickly later down the line. It will make more financial sense given the mileage you intend to do. I reckon if you bought a good car for 180K and put 15 k miles on it you should expect to get 145k for it come trade-in time. That may seem like a lot, but I've lost money on every new GT / RS car I've bought up until recently and I've been buying them for 20 years!
Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
My thoughts on the 991.1 GT3 was that it was just a bit "normal". It's a very accomplished car but just didn't feel special enough. As someone else has said it would make a great daily driver, but that's also its downfall. There is also the engine issue and it will be an issue in years to come in much the same way as early 997's have engine issues which are well publicised.
By contrast, the 991.1 RS feels like a motorsport car. To be fair it is a bit too fast. It's not the most subtle of cars either, but neither is the 997 RS, or the 996 RS for that matter. But that's all part of the allure if it's your thing.
On values, given your mileage and usage, I would opt for one of the 9,000 ish mile examples from an OPC. Just make sure it has a leather dash, axle lift and ceramics. My research led me to believe these were must-haves if you want to move it on quickly later down the line. It will make more financial sense given the mileage you intend to do. I reckon if you bought a good car for 180K and put 15 k miles on it you should expect to get 145k for it come trade-in time. That may seem like a lot, but I've lost money on every new GT / RS car I've bought up until recently and I've been buying them for 20 years!
Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
JulierPass said:
I've recently just gone through this exact scenario. I got rid of my GT4 and replaced it with a 991.1 RS. I own a number of other RS and GT cars so the PDK only box in the 991.1 RS didn't really bother me, that said it is very impressive.
My thoughts on the 991.1 GT3 was that it was just a bit "normal". It's a very accomplished car but just didn't feel special enough. As someone else has said it would make a great daily driver, but that's also its downfall. There is also the engine issue and it will be an issue in years to come in much the same way as early 997's have engine issues which are well publicised.
By contrast, the 991.1 RS feels like a motorsport car. To be fair it is a bit too fast. It's not the most subtle of cars either, but neither is the 997 RS, or the 996 RS for that matter. But that's all part of the allure if it's your thing.
On values, given your mileage and usage, I would opt for one of the 9,000 ish mile examples from an OPC. Just make sure it has a leather dash, axle lift and ceramics. My research led me to believe these were must-haves if you want to move it on quickly later down the line. It will make more financial sense given the mileage you intend to do. I reckon if you bought a good car for 180K and put 15 k miles on it you should expect to get 145k for it come trade-in time. That may seem like a lot, but I've lost money on every new GT / RS car I've bought up until recently and I've been buying them for 20 years!
Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
This chap talks sense..My thoughts on the 991.1 GT3 was that it was just a bit "normal". It's a very accomplished car but just didn't feel special enough. As someone else has said it would make a great daily driver, but that's also its downfall. There is also the engine issue and it will be an issue in years to come in much the same way as early 997's have engine issues which are well publicised.
By contrast, the 991.1 RS feels like a motorsport car. To be fair it is a bit too fast. It's not the most subtle of cars either, but neither is the 997 RS, or the 996 RS for that matter. But that's all part of the allure if it's your thing.
On values, given your mileage and usage, I would opt for one of the 9,000 ish mile examples from an OPC. Just make sure it has a leather dash, axle lift and ceramics. My research led me to believe these were must-haves if you want to move it on quickly later down the line. It will make more financial sense given the mileage you intend to do. I reckon if you bought a good car for 180K and put 15 k miles on it you should expect to get 145k for it come trade-in time. That may seem like a lot, but I've lost money on every new GT / RS car I've bought up until recently and I've been buying them for 20 years!
Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
Or for something a bit different I was in JZM last week.They had a white/red 997.2 RS just in with just over 20 k miles....been used as it should but looked in VGC. They were going to advertise it for £152k. Completely standard car apart from Sport Chrono. Maybe given that and the mileage/use it was a tad pricey but it’s £30k cheaper than the high spec/very low mileage cars that collectors buy.
JulierPass said:
On values, given your mileage and usage, I would opt for one of the 9,000 ish mile examples from an OPC. Just make sure it has a leather dash, axle lift and ceramics. My research led me to believe these were must-haves if you want to move it on quickly later down the line. It will make more financial sense given the mileage you intend to do. I reckon if you bought a good car for 180K and put 15 k miles on it you should expect to get 145k for it come trade-in time. That may seem like a lot, but I've lost money on every new GT / RS car I've bought up until recently and I've been buying them for 20 years!
Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
Yep.... This is pretty much my line of thinking at the mo... What a bloody shame that these beauties get “devalued” so ridiculously for being used “as intended” (ie. actually DRIVEN).... It’s not like the motors can’t handle a bit of flippin mileage....!! I had a 987 Boxster a few years back that had 120k on the clock when I came to sell it...!! Never had ANY issues with it....Buy it, use and enjoy it. The price of the enjoyment is what it is, but it is well worth it. Good luck with it.
Anyways.... On the subject of used “high mileage” 3RSs, I’ve been looking at these 2 in particular..... (I’m a huge fan of white on any GT car....!)... Any opinions/thoughts would be much appreciated....!
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Again— mega thanks for all the input so far.... I continually find it incredulous that OPC staff (in general) seem to either know so little about—or have such little passion for— these machines, whereas Porsche forum members know so much....!! So ironic really.... I still remember when i test drove the 991.1 GTS a few years ago, the OPC salesman didn’t know how to operate the electronic handbrake....!! Didn’t particularly inspire me with confidence......
Swimfinz said:
Yep.... This is pretty much my line of thinking at the mo... What a bloody shame that these beauties get “devalued” so ridiculously for being used “as intended” (ie. actually DRIVEN).... It’s not like the motors can’t handle a bit of flippin mileage....!! I had a 987 Boxster a few years back that had 120k on the clock when I came to sell it...!! Never had ANY issues with it....
Anyways.... On the subject of used “high mileage” 3RSs, I’ve been looking at these 2 in particular..... (I’m a huge fan of white on any GT car....!)... Any opinions/thoughts would be much appreciated....!
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Again— mega thanks for all the input so far.... I continually find it incredulous that OPC staff (in general) seem to either know so little about—or have such little passion for— these machines, whereas Porsche forum members know so much....!! So ironic really.... I still remember when i test drove the 991.1 GTS a few years ago, the OPC salesman didn’t know how to operate the electronic handbrake....!! Didn’t particularly inspire me with confidence......
The OPC car will come with a 2 year warranty so for me that would be the one I’d go for.Anyways.... On the subject of used “high mileage” 3RSs, I’ve been looking at these 2 in particular..... (I’m a huge fan of white on any GT car....!)... Any opinions/thoughts would be much appreciated....!
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Again— mega thanks for all the input so far.... I continually find it incredulous that OPC staff (in general) seem to either know so little about—or have such little passion for— these machines, whereas Porsche forum members know so much....!! So ironic really.... I still remember when i test drove the 991.1 GTS a few years ago, the OPC salesman didn’t know how to operate the electronic handbrake....!! Didn’t particularly inspire me with confidence......
I also agree that White looks great on the GT3RS
I heard talk of 991.1 GT3's with unhealthily noisy engines .... there are cars on their third engine ... and I have even heard of an early engine replacement on a 991.2 GT3 ...
I was asked at the RS day if I could spare my litre of Mobil 1 for somebody who had a problem requiring more than this ...
10 years warranty can pass quickly ... and what's it worth in year 11 ? The extended warranty finishes at 15 years ...
The 964RS is a great looking car many of which have suffered endless abuse on track and just bounce back ... now becoming extremely desirable even in this sliding market. But what would their status be now had they had the engine issues of the 991.1 GT3 ??
The problems of the 996.1 / 2 / 997.1 non Mezger engines were never really resolved by P ... not until the the new 997 Gen2 series of 9A1 engines came out, ... hence look at the secondhand prices of the cars with known chocolate engines ...
Why should the 991.1 GT3 be any better unless the problems are repaired ... rather than just guaranteed for a time ....
Are P becoming accident prone ? Are they cutting corners ? Are they pushing the spec too far ? Are they becoming complacent of the low mileages of commodity cars ?
I really want to believe in them, but the problems cannot continue forever, can they ?
I was asked at the RS day if I could spare my litre of Mobil 1 for somebody who had a problem requiring more than this ...
10 years warranty can pass quickly ... and what's it worth in year 11 ? The extended warranty finishes at 15 years ...
The 964RS is a great looking car many of which have suffered endless abuse on track and just bounce back ... now becoming extremely desirable even in this sliding market. But what would their status be now had they had the engine issues of the 991.1 GT3 ??
The problems of the 996.1 / 2 / 997.1 non Mezger engines were never really resolved by P ... not until the the new 997 Gen2 series of 9A1 engines came out, ... hence look at the secondhand prices of the cars with known chocolate engines ...
Why should the 991.1 GT3 be any better unless the problems are repaired ... rather than just guaranteed for a time ....
Are P becoming accident prone ? Are they cutting corners ? Are they pushing the spec too far ? Are they becoming complacent of the low mileages of commodity cars ?
I really want to believe in them, but the problems cannot continue forever, can they ?
Cheib said:
Or for something a bit different I was in JZM last week.They had a white/red 997.2 RS just in with just over 20 k miles....been used as it should but looked in VGC. They were going to advertise it for £152k. Completely standard car apart from Sport Chrono. Maybe given that and the mileage/use it was a tad pricey but it’s £30k cheaper than the high spec/very low mileage cars that collectors buy.
If you want an investment or should I say protection from depreciation, a 9972RS is a far a better buy than a 991 - IMHO the 991 RS will continue to fall - especially if there is a second later batch of 991.2 RS’s and the GT3 .2 will follow the depreciation curve that all modern GT cars have followed - big overs eventually back to list or near to it as the new bauble takes over. The 997.2’s really low numbers will, to some extent, protect it from depreciation and may even, over time do the opposite : I imagine there are about 130 997.2 GT3RS’s - maybe 20% of the GT3 (both gens) and significantly less than the 991.1/2 RS (dependent on what happens with a second run of the .2) Also it’s olds skool in comparison and is very sexy - but most importantly it’s way more fun & engaging than the 991.1 RS IMHO (had both - kept the 992.2 RS without hesitation!)
Look at this .....
Personally I think you’d be crazy to buy a car like this ahead of March 29th 2019, just as you’d need to think very carefully about a house purchase given the potential for negative equity and rising interest rates.
Buy something that you won’t lose your shirt on if it drops 50% of its value. That may still be the GT3-RS of course, depending on your circumstances- but then I doubt you’d be asking these questions if that were the case.
Best case scenario is a recession twice as bad as the last financial crash- for London. Head North East and it gets pretty dire. We are in for trouble, shortly.
Buy something that you won’t lose your shirt on if it drops 50% of its value. That may still be the GT3-RS of course, depending on your circumstances- but then I doubt you’d be asking these questions if that were the case.
Best case scenario is a recession twice as bad as the last financial crash- for London. Head North East and it gets pretty dire. We are in for trouble, shortly.
Dammit said:
Best case scenario is a recession twice as bad as the last financial crash- for London. Head North East and it gets pretty dire. We are in for trouble, shortly.
Bloody hell— I think I might need some Prozac to go with my morning latte...!! I was feeling quite chipper before I read that post...!! I’m no financial expert, so unable to comment on the likelihood of such catastrophic fiscal events, however: if such a financial crash does happen, i’ll probs have more pressing concerns than just my cars....!!
RSVP— What a stunner....!! Yep— you’ve certainly got me reconsidering whether the 991 model is necessarily the best option here.... As a die-hard manual shift lover— and someone who REALLY misses the “tactility” of my 987 Spyder (should have never sold that car...!!), the 997.2 RS does tick many of the boxes.....
There is currently one at PPM, although it does seem a tad overpriced atm, considering 911 Sport sold an almost identical car for £10k less recently.... Although it is pretty gorgeous...!!
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
I’ll keep pondering— first world problems and all that...!! That is, if I don’t jump in front of a train at the prospect of losing my job/house etc. following Brexit....!!
v8ksn said:
Porsche911R said:
I take you are a non brexit person :-)
Dammit said:
I'm someone who can read the governments own forecasts on the matter.
Please can we keep politics off this forum. Lets not ruin an informative thread. 
It’s so much more fun talking about cars....
v8ksn said:
Please can we keep politics off this forum. Lets not ruin an informative thread.
The question was whether it was a good time to buy - avoiding mention of the developing economic disaster in that context is to choose to give bad advice.Rich enough to swallow a hundred grand loss? Then it doesn't matter.
But if losing that money is a problem for you then you have to go into this with eyes open.
hornbaek said:
I think we need a photo to get this thread back on track:
A big part of owning a car is going through the deliberations before you take the final decision - so enjoy the moment.
Absolutely gorgeous pair! A big part of owning a car is going through the deliberations before you take the final decision - so enjoy the moment.
Edited by hornbaek on Wednesday 14th March 09:47
This might sound a little trite and lacking in originality but how do you decide which one you want to drive?
hornbaek said:
I think we need a photo to get this thread back on track:
A big part of owning a car is going through the deliberations before you take the final decision - so enjoy the moment.
WOW— What a dream pairing....!! Probably the best of the Porsche “analogues” alongside the best of the “modern”.....!! Stunning.....A big part of owning a car is going through the deliberations before you take the final decision - so enjoy the moment.
Edited by hornbaek on Wednesday 14th March 09:47
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