Tried to sell a B-25 Mitchell Maintenance Manual

[DickyC]

eBay said no.

Trying to sell it contravenes a US law about selling military secrets and hardware and jeopardizing the rights of peace loving folk. Something like that.

It was among my dad's collection of aeroplane books. It was a USAF publication right enough but I doubt they'd want it back.

Someone would like it but I don't want to give it away.

[DocJock]

Try Amazon.

[DickyC]

That's an idea. Thanks.

[Jimbo.]

How much would you be wanting for it? A guy I work with may be interested.

[DickyC]

The pilot's manuals go for £300 but I haven't found a maintenance manual for sale so I set the reserve at £300 and the Buy Now price at £500.

Tried to.

[lufbramatt]

That’s rediculous! When we contacted the smithsonian for copies of some of the b-25 engineering drawings they happily sent us an entire set of drawings on microfilm!

[Simpo Two]

Somebody with a B-25 might be interested!

[DickyC]

Some people prefer the real thing to a copy. It's a nice thing; big and heavy.

An auction would have found its true value but eBay weren't having it.

[Simpo Two]

I suppose there are insufficient veterans to buy it. But it might be possible to track down and contact the people who operate them now.

[DickyC]

Some people collect all manner of military stuff. Or aeroplane stuff. Non-enthusiasts can't explain why. My dad was a dyed-in-the-wool aircraft man. "Hey, John, were chucking out a load of books. See if there's anything you want." He had it for years and he would have said he just liked having it.

[Simpo Two]

Can you change the description so it doesn't trigger the alarm bells? 'B-25 book' for example?

[steveo3002]

lots of militaria forums where folk would want it

[DickyC]

Simpo Two said:

Can you change the description so it doesn't trigger the alarm bells? 'B-25 book' for example?

I wondered about that but eBay tell transgressors not to try selling the offending item again. It may be an empty threat but I have a 100% positive eBay history and it's vulnerable enough without courting disaster.



There doesn't seem to be a time limit to the restrictions. The legislation seems to catch everything including historical items. It's heavy handed but they may think making exceptions would open up a legal quagmire.

[DickyC]

steveo3002 said:

lots of militaria forums where folk would want it

That's an idea.

[aeropilot]

Put a post on Flypast Forum

https://forum.keypublishing.com/forumdisplay.php?4...

or Warbirds Information Exchange Forum.

http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/phpBB3/viewf...

[DickyC]

Thanks. I'll look into those.

[dnb]

If it is indeed ITAR then you'll most likely have no luck selling it with any large US based company. ITAR is a real set of laws where the fines for violations are unlimited and they can be awfully heavy handed. The burden of proof that the item is not ITAR rests with you the seller, but ebay would be liable too for facilitating the sale. Things can also become ITAR retrospectively, so just because it wasn't when you got hold of it doesn't mean it isn't ITAR now. In short, it's far too big a risk for them to touch anything that might even have a sniff of needing an export licence, even though we all know there would be no problem in a sane world because of its age.

ITT were fined $100M and BAE $400M for ITAR violations, so ebay has every right to be cautious over such items, daft as it may seem to us.
BTW, the potato peeler from a US nuclear sub has been classified as ITAR, as are certain warship deck fittings (bollards etc) that can in fact be bought off the shelf in normal shops so the law can be fantastically silly...

[DickyC]

I wonder why US the courts uphold the legislation if it's so ridiculous. Could it be their way of showing their government the absurdity?

[aeropilot]

DickyC said:

I wonder why US the courts uphold the legislation if it's so ridiculous. Could it be their way of showing their government the absurdity?

ITAR isn't ridiculous, its just that trigger words will be mean ebay is very nervous about being done, so they apply a blanket no-go, and military manuals will trigger that, it doesn't matter that it's a manual for 75 year WW2 era aircraft or one for a B2 stealth bomber which obviously would be ITAR.
You have to remember that the US is paranoid about this sort of stuff. Logic and common sense doesn't come into it.

[DickyC]

Sorry, I didn't express myself very well. The absurdity I meant is the catch-all nature of the legislation. Sixty year old maintenance literature is covered by the same rules as modern equipment and the only tools at the hands of the courts to highlight this is the publicity that would come from an individual selling memorabilia being prosecuted like a dodgy arms dealer.