911 ST backdate....
Discussion
Redarress said:
Specifically what parts are difficult to source then ?
For example of you want something to be period, then some of the original stuff is massive money. But if you have proper car or hot rod you want best stuff then its worth it.Before I had my 911 I was into vintage guitars (still am) and I know guys that paid £20k for something that was original but a modern version is £40.. they look exactly the same except one was made in 1959 and one is made in 2018.. they do the same job.
Its same with Porsche, you can get decent stuff to do the job, but those that know.. know etc
Mintbird said:
Porsche911R said:
Taffy66 said:
Thanks Wizzbang on a fantastically educational post...Its really whetting my appetite as i really want one to my spec for a sensible budget,,Love your car as much as Mintbird's blue beauty...These posts are pointing me in the direction i need to go..
Are you at silver stone today ? I need to talk you out of it :-)
Most of these builds cost £200k min price and people will pick holes in them till the cows come home, and then cannot sell them for £60k.
Goto luft, or today at Silverstone, 95% cars there are poor.
Most reps are built by people who cannot afford the real thing, but then realise they cannot afford to build a good rep either, most are really tat.
The company who make then build to a price also, as they cannot spend the time on them at the cost they sell at, most again look a bit tat in the £120k range.
Hence people are saying it is £300k, with a min £200k spend imo.
Not a £70k project !
The “sensible budget” thing is not possible,
Buy a real car, or buy some one else £150k build for £60k
I could easily have bought a bonafide original S of any vintage for what Ive spent on mine, cost was not the issue!
I would also challenge the notion that there are all these bonafide 200k builds around that struggle to sell for 60k.
thats bulls
t! What you have is alot of cheap backdates with the absolutely minimum spent on em which is then hoyed into the classifieds for 80-100k and looking for a sucker! You can barely build a proper MFI high butterfly engine incl. donor engine for 60k!
As for comparing it to a "real" say 911E or maybe a ropey S....Then you would have a 50 year old car with the reliability to go with that, and obviously horsepower etc wouldnt be all that.
I wanted the oldschool short wheel base experience with a Light SWB SHELL, but I wanted a NEW wiring loom, NEW CDI box, NEW engine with added poke, along with Period correct MFI and FIA High Butterflies.
So i Sourced the best shell I could find, installed a brand new loom, a STREET RESTORATION SUSPENSION complete kit from Elephant Racing ( really nice quality) , the best SWB brakes I could find, a 915 box with a ZF diff and everything Wevo had including block inserts - I wanted a 60s smashing interior and new dials new everything!
For me it was about creating a Short Wheel base 911 with its inherent lightness, a big powerful MFI engine in the back, and an interior that would be an absolute Joy to open the door to. The next 20 years with this car should be changing the oil and rowing the gears, it should be run on buttons really - can you say that about an old ferrari or a 50 year old 911 with hidden rust, rotting wire loom, an engine where internals are from 1970 etc ?
Anyway Im rambling...
Edited by Mintbird on Saturday 27th July 16:18
What a cracking build you have there,really cool to see some one building a car for what he wants rather than budget controlled or sticking some crapy koni,s on ,changing carbs ,arches and calling it a st rep etc,thats going to be a heap of fun to drive.
Do it right once,you know what you have and can enjoy it forever and as you say change the oil regularly,keep it in servicable condition and drive away.
Taffy66 said:
Yellow491 said:
Taffy,investment is the wrong word for a hotrod,it also depends on the sum of the parts fitted.
If you could find a nice s at the right money to turn into some sort of safe house for your spend,is not a bad move.Nice mods can be done with out spoiling the original.
My old 2.4s that i converted to st,never owed me a penny and could be reversed at any time,but much better car as a st though.Sold now i believe.
Does robbo not have his yellow st for sale,thats a cracking car will depreciate less than you worrying about the state of the 991rs and gt3 market all over the winter with the normalisation of the latest and greatest.
I have to think about the depreciation side of my cars as i'm not a multi millionaire hotel magnate.;) A nice 72 S is £175k, can't the same be done with a nice 911E which is a fraction of the price for whatever reason..If you could find a nice s at the right money to turn into some sort of safe house for your spend,is not a bad move.Nice mods can be done with out spoiling the original.
My old 2.4s that i converted to st,never owed me a penny and could be reversed at any time,but much better car as a st though.Sold now i believe.
Does robbo not have his yellow st for sale,thats a cracking car will depreciate less than you worrying about the state of the 991rs and gt3 market all over the winter with the normalisation of the latest and greatest.
A good E is a good prospect if purchased well and has been properly restored,and i mean properly restored with bare bones shell etc.There should be some nice s cars about as prices are coming back to some sort of sensible state.You just heed to go and drive a few good ones and make your mind up,a good standard car which is not that fast and limited grip,or loads of grip with a fiery engine.
Get robbo to let you drive his yellow peril,he may then take you out in olive,then go drive a standard s or e!
Mintbird said:
Ok I`ll bite...Im not sure if you are refering to me in particular or just in general -
I could easily have bought a bonafide original S of any vintage for what Ive spent on mine, cost was not the issue!
I would also challenge the notion that there are all these bonafide 200k builds around that struggle to sell for 60k.
thats bullst! What you have is alot of cheap backdates with the absolutely minimum spent on em which is then hoyed into the classifieds for 80-100k and looking for a sucker!
You can barely build a proper MFI high butterfly engine incl. donor engine for 60k!
As for comparing it to a "real" say 911E or maybe a ropey S....Then you would have a 50 year old car with the reliability to go with that, and obviously horsepower etc wouldnt be all that.
I wanted the oldschool short wheel base experience with a Light SWB SHELL, but I wanted a NEW wiring loom, NEW CDI box, NEW engine with added poke, along with Period correct MFI and FIA High Butterflies.
So i Sourced the best shell I could find, installed a brand new loom, a STREET RESTORATION SUSPENSION complete kit from Elephant Racing ( really nice quality) , the best SWB brakes I could find, a 915 box with a ZF diff and everything Wevo had including block inserts - I wanted a 60s smashing interior and new dials new everything!
For me it was about creating a Short Wheel base 911 with its inherent lightness, a big powerful MFI engine in the back, and an interior that would be an absolute Joy to open the door to. The next 20 years with this car should be changing the oil and rowing the gears, it should be run on buttons really - can you say that about an old ferrari or a 50 year old 911 with hidden rust, rotting wire loom, an engine where internals are from 1970 etc ?
Anyway Im rambling...
:-) my post was not aimed at you, you just confirmed my postings really that you cannot do it on the cheap ie £70k gets you nothing inc the donar.I could easily have bought a bonafide original S of any vintage for what Ive spent on mine, cost was not the issue!
I would also challenge the notion that there are all these bonafide 200k builds around that struggle to sell for 60k.
thats bulls
t! What you have is alot of cheap backdates with the absolutely minimum spent on em which is then hoyed into the classifieds for 80-100k and looking for a sucker! You can barely build a proper MFI high butterfly engine incl. donor engine for 60k!
As for comparing it to a "real" say 911E or maybe a ropey S....Then you would have a 50 year old car with the reliability to go with that, and obviously horsepower etc wouldnt be all that.
I wanted the oldschool short wheel base experience with a Light SWB SHELL, but I wanted a NEW wiring loom, NEW CDI box, NEW engine with added poke, along with Period correct MFI and FIA High Butterflies.
So i Sourced the best shell I could find, installed a brand new loom, a STREET RESTORATION SUSPENSION complete kit from Elephant Racing ( really nice quality) , the best SWB brakes I could find, a 915 box with a ZF diff and everything Wevo had including block inserts - I wanted a 60s smashing interior and new dials new everything!
For me it was about creating a Short Wheel base 911 with its inherent lightness, a big powerful MFI engine in the back, and an interior that would be an absolute Joy to open the door to. The next 20 years with this car should be changing the oil and rowing the gears, it should be run on buttons really - can you say that about an old ferrari or a 50 year old 911 with hidden rust, rotting wire loom, an engine where internals are from 1970 etc ?
Anyway Im rambling...
we are all trying to help Taffy not make a BIG mistake.
you have built a nice hot rod, but it's cost a lot more than what people want to pay in general.
BertBert said:
So a choice for your rep...
Turbo brakes, awesome, cost quite a lot, hard to find
Boxster brakes probably stop better, much cheaper
Which would you choose?
Bert
Me?Turbo brakes, awesome, cost quite a lot, hard to find
Boxster brakes probably stop better, much cheaper
Which would you choose?
Bert
If Boxster brakes to fit with 15s then I would use them, for me the important bit is the engine.. thats where I would spend the money
Chris Stott said:
Most looked as rough as a dogs arse.
I often use my Dads 70 Hot rod for blasts and Porsche events and I wouldn't say its a as rough as a dogs arse but Im sure if some of you guys saw it up close maybe you would say so.. the rear bumper is 2 inches short one side than the other! Some of the paint is flaking..Im sure will get it fixed at some point. But the important bit is the engine, gear box and running gear, its all 70s, turbo breaks, 15s wheels, Weber Carbs.Its either on or off.. such a great drive
Ragatha christie said:
I often use my Dads 70 Hot rod for blasts and Porsche events and I wouldn't say its a as rough as a dogs arse but Im sure if some of you guys saw it up close maybe you would say so.. the rear bumper is 2 inches short one side than the other! Some of the paint is flaking..Im sure will get it fixed at some point. But the important bit is the engine, gear box and running gear, its all 70s, turbo breaks, 15s wheels, Weber Carbs.
Its either on or off.. such a great drive
The car in question had an an auction estimate of 85-95k plus fees. In addition to the general shoddy panels, the sunroof fit wad horrendous - can’t believe it wouldn’t leak. Its either on or off.. such a great drive
If the exterior is like that, I’d question what other corners had been cut underneath.
Having a personal hot rod is one thing. But paying 100k+ for that car would be daft IMO.
Chris Stott said:
The car in question had an an auction estimate of 85-95k plus fees. In addition to the general shoddy panels, the sunroof fit wad horrendous - can’t believe it wouldn’t leak.
If the exterior is like that, I’d question what other corners had been cut underneath.
Having a personal hot rod is one thing. But paying 100k+ for that car would be daft IMO.
And had fish eyes in the paint.If the exterior is like that, I’d question what other corners had been cut underneath.
Having a personal hot rod is one thing. But paying 100k+ for that car would be daft IMO.
all these cars are built to a price, no other way to knock them out at £120k.
would not give £30k for it let alone £100k.
Porsche911R said:
Ragatha christie said:
I want to get a SWB so a twin plug 2ltr
About 230bhp and £75k then.Bert
Depends which st you want to build,2.3 on carbs or 2.5 on high butterflys,also 2.3 on 901 box and 2.5 on 915 box.
Near perfect st,not many of them around or built.
You can buy recon alloy s callipers
Build as close as you can to get fia papers,may get you a better return when you finished playing with it.
Near perfect st,not many of them around or built.
You can buy recon alloy s callipers
Build as close as you can to get fia papers,may get you a better return when you finished playing with it.
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