Advice on 997 turbo
Discussion
I’m getting that feeling that I need to change my 2017 991.2 Carrera manual.
Despite it not being a frontline car, my wife would still like the ability for us to put the 2 kids in the back occasionally, so GT3s are out sadly.
I’ve had a look at this 997 turbo in Wilmslow today. It’s one of the most expensive in the country, but has a very low mileage and they’ve been looking after it for years themselves.
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
It’s on at 75K and I’ve been offered 61K, which I don’t think is too bad really. I’m not a lover of the black wheels but they don’t look too bad in the flesh and could be changed.
I’m going to digest it and probably have a drive later on in the week. Me feeling is that over time, this may prove to be a little more exciting to drive than a ‘bog standard’ Carrera and probably hold onto more of its value, giving me more options should I decide to change again in a couple of years.
Any tips/advice would be welcome.
Despite it not being a frontline car, my wife would still like the ability for us to put the 2 kids in the back occasionally, so GT3s are out sadly.
I’ve had a look at this 997 turbo in Wilmslow today. It’s one of the most expensive in the country, but has a very low mileage and they’ve been looking after it for years themselves.
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
It’s on at 75K and I’ve been offered 61K, which I don’t think is too bad really. I’m not a lover of the black wheels but they don’t look too bad in the flesh and could be changed.
I’m going to digest it and probably have a drive later on in the week. Me feeling is that over time, this may prove to be a little more exciting to drive than a ‘bog standard’ Carrera and probably hold onto more of its value, giving me more options should I decide to change again in a couple of years.
Any tips/advice would be welcome.
Some initial thoughts and all IMHO
It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
Edited by Adam B on Monday 12th August 18:12
Make sure there are no rev ranges 5 or 6. I hear they do not renew OPC warranty on RR 4 now too? Also ask them to confirm original panel no accident car in writing. I’m sure all fine as they would not retail unless a minter but always best to check.
There’s a lovely one at 911 Virgin in polar silver and also has PCCB it’s a one off PTS colour. Long term the 911 Virgin car may have slightly better residuals too. The interior an acquired taste though on the polar silver car. Not sure what the first buyer was thinking!
There’s a lovely one at 911 Virgin in polar silver and also has PCCB it’s a one off PTS colour. Long term the 911 Virgin car may have slightly better residuals too. The interior an acquired taste though on the polar silver car. Not sure what the first buyer was thinking!
Adam B said:
It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
PDK is the 997.2 auto flappy paddle box, otherwise it would state Tiptronic for the 5 speed slushbox which is what the 997 1.5 had (like mine). The 1.5 came with auto box as well as manual. It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Updated PCM is useful as the centre console looks vaguely modern instead of having a dated telephone keypad built in. The BT functionality is however ONLY for calls, not music. Easy to add a BT adaptor to the Y cable though.
Whoozit said:
PDK is the 997.2 auto flappy paddle box, otherwise it would state Tiptronic for the 5 speed slushbox which is what the 997 1.5 had (like mine). The 1.5 came with auto box as well as manual.
I was well aware of all that - I meant the advert stated PDK when pictures clearly show a manual, so OP needs to check what this car actually is“Make sure there are no rev ranges 5 or 6. I hear they do not renew OPC warranty on RR 4 now too? Also ask them to confirm original panel no accident car in writing. I’m sure all fine as they would not retail unless a minter but always best to check.”
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
What does ‘no rev ranges 5 or ‘ actually mean? Surely these have Rev limiters?
andyglos said:
“Make sure there are no rev ranges 5 or 6. I hear they do not renew OPC warranty on RR 4 now too? Also ask them to confirm original panel no accident car in writing. I’m sure all fine as they would not retail unless a minter but always best to check.”
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
I would guess it is on SOR hence why the wheels haven’t been put back to factory correct diamond cut finish and the rusty wheel bolts etc looks like they are probably doing the customer a favour (and making a profit of course) for his continued service to them.
Make sure that you both drive it as the clutch is assisted on those so you don’t get as much clutch feel as other cars but will have to drive it to understand it.
The other thing that you have to think about is that it is less than 2000 miles away from 20k miles so whilst still low it looses its teen mileage and a lot of the value.
JZM have a same spec with only 13k miles for £1k more which gives you 5k miles to play with or the car at Bramleys with only 8k miles on it for £3k more which obviously buys you a lot more miles whilst still keeping it within the teens without being to conscious of the mileage and not using it to keep it down.
I would also consider a 991.1 GTS RWD for a curveball as more modern and last of the n/a wide body cars (rwd) but might be waiting a while to find a manual.
Have to be a RWD and have GTS Interior pack to hold value IMHO.
Or if it has to be a 997 Hexagon have a manual GTS coupe.
Make sure that you both drive it as the clutch is assisted on those so you don’t get as much clutch feel as other cars but will have to drive it to understand it.
The other thing that you have to think about is that it is less than 2000 miles away from 20k miles so whilst still low it looses its teen mileage and a lot of the value.
JZM have a same spec with only 13k miles for £1k more which gives you 5k miles to play with or the car at Bramleys with only 8k miles on it for £3k more which obviously buys you a lot more miles whilst still keeping it within the teens without being to conscious of the mileage and not using it to keep it down.
I would also consider a 991.1 GTS RWD for a curveball as more modern and last of the n/a wide body cars (rwd) but might be waiting a while to find a manual.
Have to be a RWD and have GTS Interior pack to hold value IMHO.
Or if it has to be a 997 Hexagon have a manual GTS coupe.
Edited by kev.RS on Wednesday 14th August 08:26
Blowfish said:
What does ‘no rev ranges 5 or ‘ actually mean? Surely these have Rev limiters?
I’m not sure a soft Rev limiter can do anything to prevent damage with ham-fisted downshifts....2nd instead of 4th at 95mph? Ouch.andyglos said:
“Make sure there are no rev ranges 5 or 6. I hear they do not renew OPC warranty on RR 4 now too? Also ask them to confirm original panel no accident car in writing. I’m sure all fine as they would not retail unless a minter but always best to check.”
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
Depends when and how many. Mine had 1 spurious count in R5 and 1 spurious count in R6 when I bought it back in 2013. Never had a problem putting the warranty on it and will continue to do so for as long as possible.......
there is a good article on 911 Virgin about over revs.
Blowfish said:
For that sort of money you should be going 997.2 Turbo S!
Agree!<cough>
http://www.nineexcellence.com/porsche-sales/sales-...
Well enjoyed by me for the last 18 months, including several LeMans trips!
Adam B said:
Some initial thoughts and all IMHO
It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
Are the Gen 1.5 not desirable any more?It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
Edited by Adam B on Monday 12th August 18:12
stormblack said:
Are the Gen 1.5 not desirable any more?
Not sure who dreamt up the Gen 1.5 tag. It's a Gen 1 with a better PCMPersonally, I wouldn't be swapping a 991 for a 997 Turbo, though.
I've has a new 911 every 2-3 years since the '80s, so two of each generation, and a few classic/collectables alongside. Had a 997 Turbo S for 3 years and never really gelled with it. Incredibly fast and capable, but actually found it quite dull and uninvolving. The power delivery is nowhere near as intoxicating as a really good NA Porsche. The sound lacks the emotion and engagement I expect from a 911, and the cabin is dominated by too much road noise (certainly in the UK).
I look back on it as one of the most disappointing 911s in my tenure, although I do think a 'manual' (not available on the S) would have been better.
stormblack said:
Adam B said:
Some initial thoughts and all IMHO
It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
Are the Gen 1.5 not desirable any more?It is a manual but description says PDK, not confidence inspiring.
It is pricey as it appears to be (you need to check given the above) a “gen 1.5” which used to be the desirable combination of Mezger engine and manual gearbox but with updated PCM and BT tech (which is hopelessly outdated now too).
Speccing a fire extinguisher is plain weird but obv doesn’t decrease its value
You are paying a big premium for OPC and those miles (my better spec, same age and colour, manual with 37k sold for 57k a year ago and prices have softened slightly) which may be OK if you are doing only 1-2k per year.
Personally I would go for a slightly higher miles car for much less and forget the premium for “1.5”
Black wheels are possibly to hide old damage, would look nicer if the outside edge was silver IMHO or put back to standard
Edited by Adam B on Monday 12th August 18:12
Gen 2 PDK cars with dfi better but as these cars get older PDK will be an expensive repair if the cars not in warranty. Also doesn’t have pedigree of Mezger. I’ve run real 650-720bhp for 5 years and 40,000 miles no issues at all. 720bhp on track and 650bhp on road. Gen 2 cars okay to about 640bhp. Run them above that and you’re asking for trouble.
Thank you for the very useful responses.
I think the value in the car has some question marks over it, given what's been said.
Apparently it's not a SOR vehicle and was traded in against a GT3.
I do enjoy a manual gearbox, which is why I'm interested in this model. If I could get over this problem, then I would be happy to pay more and go to a 991 turbo or turbo S.
My inclination is to keep looking for now and not jump in. I'm keeping my eye on a few non Porsche options also, given that the whole Brexit scenario seems to be having a very negative effect the value of a lot of models, opening up a bit of a buyers market.
I think the value in the car has some question marks over it, given what's been said.
Apparently it's not a SOR vehicle and was traded in against a GT3.
I do enjoy a manual gearbox, which is why I'm interested in this model. If I could get over this problem, then I would be happy to pay more and go to a 991 turbo or turbo S.
My inclination is to keep looking for now and not jump in. I'm keeping my eye on a few non Porsche options also, given that the whole Brexit scenario seems to be having a very negative effect the value of a lot of models, opening up a bit of a buyers market.
Hang off mate. 997 turbo prices massively inflated.
Have access to both whenever in UK. Never picked up the keys to the 991.2 turbo s once but in all fairness it’s the best turbo Porsche have ever made. The stability of the 991 platform otherworldly. Not sure how Porsche make the 1650kg 991 handle like a 1350kg car. It’s incredible but so easy to drive you fall asleep.
The 997 at 8/10ths is a surprisingly physical car to drive when on it. Far more physical than the aircooled I also have access to. We should really sell the 997 but my 13yr old son won’t hear any of it having seen it demolish most supercars up the runway at VMAX - he is defo starting to warm to 720s though - keeps on sending me pics of them
Have access to both whenever in UK. Never picked up the keys to the 991.2 turbo s once but in all fairness it’s the best turbo Porsche have ever made. The stability of the 991 platform otherworldly. Not sure how Porsche make the 1650kg 991 handle like a 1350kg car. It’s incredible but so easy to drive you fall asleep.
The 997 at 8/10ths is a surprisingly physical car to drive when on it. Far more physical than the aircooled I also have access to. We should really sell the 997 but my 13yr old son won’t hear any of it having seen it demolish most supercars up the runway at VMAX - he is defo starting to warm to 720s though - keeps on sending me pics of them
Geneve I’d invite you to drive 997. You’ll get out with your knees shaking. 50-70mph in 1 sec. 60-130 in a smidge under 6 secs. With a handling kit it and Cup 2 tyres quite frankly it’s a ridiculous road car. The road noise etc much improved with wider Cup 2 tyres which is surprising. Out of the box all of them as dull as dishwater and yes from handling perspective 991 on another level. It’s a far better 911 turbo no doubt.
Grantstown said:
Thank you for the very useful responses.
I think the value in the car has some question marks over it, given what's been said.
Apparently it's not a SOR vehicle and was traded in against a GT3.
I do enjoy a manual gearbox, which is why I'm interested in this model. If I could get over this problem, then I would be happy to pay more and go to a 991 turbo or turbo S.
My inclination is to keep looking for now and not jump in. I'm keeping my eye on a few non Porsche options also, given that the whole Brexit scenario seems to be having a very negative effect the value of a lot of models, opening up a bit of a buyers market.
Erm.... That's my old car! I think the value in the car has some question marks over it, given what's been said.
Apparently it's not a SOR vehicle and was traded in against a GT3.
I do enjoy a manual gearbox, which is why I'm interested in this model. If I could get over this problem, then I would be happy to pay more and go to a 991 turbo or turbo S.
My inclination is to keep looking for now and not jump in. I'm keeping my eye on a few non Porsche options also, given that the whole Brexit scenario seems to be having a very negative effect the value of a lot of models, opening up a bit of a buyers market.
It's not a SOR car, I did indeed trade it in for a 991 GT3 after owning it for over six years. It was papmered to death during that time, and I only put about 10k on the car (it was a weekender, and for a couple of years hardly driven). I've no interest in it anymore, other than a sense of nostalgia for having spent over six years driving it, so here goes...
It is a genuine gen 1.5 manual car, with sports chrono (which you need for the 1.2 bar overboost). People forget that the PCM3 had a touch screen and bluetooth too... which makes a big difference. The wheels were, believe it or not, painted black at the factory and I had them redone about six months ago as they were looking a bit tired. They could be cut back, I was told at the time it would be about £100 a wheel, but I liked the all black colour so I just had them powder coated at the OPC's wheel place instead. And I put a new set of tyres on then too, which much have about 300 miles on them since. But have a look at the wheel balance, I wasn't convinced that they did that very well.
It was maintained at Wilmslow and Chester (after I worked out that Chester was a lot closer to us) and kept under warranty, and no expense spared when needed. In terms of rev ranges, I had it tested when I bought it, and there were just a few revs in range 4 which then required the OPC to do a test on the engine, which it passed with flying colours and the warranty was applied. Absolutely nothing in ranges 5 or 6, and I didn't track or thrash the car so I never got up there!
In terms of damage... none at all whilst I had it, but I did put a dent in the passenger seat leather, whcih could he taken out with some heat but I never got around to it. I am sure they could fix this for you, if they haven't already.
It is ferociously quick, and handles very well, but after owning it for a long time I needed to scratch the GT3 itch. I love my new car, but I have to say that the 991s are definitely not as well built as the 997s, this car was a lot more solid than my GT3 and the Mezger gives you a lot of confidence.
Oh, and the owner before me was a Ryder Cup golfer, if youre into that sort of thing!
PM me if you want to know any more details. There shouldn't be any question marks over the car, other than the OPC seem to be a bit incompetent in marketing it so far! I'd love to see it go to a good home, preferably a PHer :-)
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