The Porsche GT allocation system...a good video view

The Porsche GT allocation system...a good video view

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RDMcG

Original Poster:

19,095 posts

206 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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An interesting view of the whole Porsche GT allocation system, and one I agree with,

rosino

1,346 posts

171 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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I knew which video you were referring to before even opening it smile

I don't necessarily agree the cat is out of the box with GT products, they still trade very firm, and require a premium for as long as the car are in production, they only start declining, and modestly as the new generation comes out.. because new shiny toy.

I think he is exposing the culture of corruption and silliness that has engulfed most UK dealers, exclusively due to the low allocation numbers destined for this country. Go to any EU country and you can pick up GT products, they might not be easily available, but you can find if you look, often even discounted brand new unregistered (Like my GT3 Touring picked up from Austria advertised with 2pct off list).

The solution would be simple : increase allocation, make it untenable to buy a car just to show off and on the basis it will not lose value, make it mandatory for said car to be resold to the supplying dealer if you are selling within 2years of purchase, and for said dealer not to be able to sell it more than list price for example.

That way you get more cars going around, at sensible prices and ending in the hands of people who would actually want to drive them properly. As opposed to posting on IG about their latest exclusive ride.

Just my 2 cents. But think with increased allocations, all of this is easily solved, the Dealer Principle won't be able to ask you 10k in a brown envelope and the order of 5 depreciating cars to "guarantee" you an allocation etc etc..

ChrisW.

6,210 posts

254 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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Part of the issue is that there are now a LOT of GT products in the market.

For new customers to buy new cars there needs to be a new customer to buy their old car ... and there is currently a lot of floating stock with a variety of dealers.

If Porsche succeed in alienating their historically loyal legacy customers sending them elsewhere, this reduces demand and diminishes their reputation and heritage.

If speculators do not see the profit they have paid for with the cars on which they have lost money to appease their OPC into releasing an allocation for a GT car, they will disappear even faster.

Customer loyalty is "money in the bank" for Porsche and their loyal legacy customers are worth the most.

Porsche should be very worried about this.

If not, they will receive their just deserts. The market is NEVER wrong.


Cheib

23,110 posts

174 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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ChrisW. said:
Part of the issue is that there are now a LOT of GT products in the market.

For new customers to buy new cars there needs to be a new customer to buy their old car ... and there is currently a lot of floating stock with a variety of dealers.

If Porsche succeed in alienating their historically loyal legacy customers sending them elsewhere, this reduces demand and diminishes their reputation and heritage.

If speculators do not see the profit they have paid for with the cars on which they have lost money to appease their OPC into releasing an allocation for a GT car, they will disappear even faster.

Customer loyalty is "money in the bank" for Porsche and their loyal legacy customers are worth the most.

Porsche should be very worried about this.

If not, they will receive their just deserts. The market is NEVER wrong.
Six months ago I might have agreed with you but right now on the AUC website there are 7 991.2 GT3's (600 plus in the UK)....and good one's are selling quickly. Roman's and RPM have both sold manual 991.2's very quickly in the last week. For whatever reason when manufacturers like Ferrari have a glut of cars on the market there are very few GT3's for sale.

I think Porsche will make a lot of 992 GT3's and they will all find home's very easily. Even if the market normalises to an extent and say a GT3 becomes a £15k a year depreciating car people will still be banging the doors down because it is still very cheap motoring for what you are getting.

Ferrari upped volumes and increased prices quite markedly at the same time (and buyers slapped ludicrous amounts of options on them)....to do both was greedy and it's fked their market. If Porsche up prices 10% they can probably increase volumes by 15% and not impact things too badly. Cars will probably be list within six to nine months but that's healthy.

RDMcG

Original Poster:

19,095 posts

206 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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I think if people regard the cars sensibly as to be driven and used properly we would be better off than the idea that they are a way to make some money or as some kind of investment. The days are long gone when they were rarity...just look as the number of 996RS there were...a handful compared to today's numbers. I am a GT fan so not knocking the cars, but we would be better off just meeting market demand rather than an artificial shortage.

As it happens I generally get the car I want from the dealer - they aren't worth the premium to me and I do not need to be the first to have one, or PTS or the like. If I did not get one its not the end of the world anyway.

GT4RS

4,395 posts

196 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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ChrisW. said:
Part of the issue is that there are now a LOT of GT products in the market.

For new customers to buy new cars there needs to be a new customer to buy their old car ... and there is currently a lot of floating stock with a variety of dealers.

If Porsche succeed in alienating their historically loyal legacy customers sending them elsewhere, this reduces demand and diminishes their reputation and heritage.

If speculators do not see the profit they have paid for with the cars on which they have lost money to appease their OPC into releasing an allocation for a GT car, they will disappear even faster.

Customer loyalty is "money in the bank" for Porsche and their loyal legacy customers are worth the most.

Porsche should be very worried about this.

If not, they will receive their just deserts. The market is NEVER wrong.
Spot on

Robbo66

3,828 posts

232 months

Tuesday 9th February 2021
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Been discussed a myriad of times.Same old. Nothing changes as it works for AG. Sells cooking models so what do they care how they are allocated so why change it.

What won’t have any difference whatsoever, is a patronising 15 min video from a sweaty bloke in a hat cupboard, stating the obvious.

The bigger question remains....who actually watches this ?.

MB140

4,027 posts

102 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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I don't know, why don't you ask JayEmm he's on here. Used to post quit a bit but I haven't seen him on here for a while although that might because he's quite busy producing his youtube videos. I quite like his presenting style and channel. Cant be doing to bad out of it although he probably isn't making a shed load. He's just bought a nice Ferrari from it though.


throt

3,038 posts

169 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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rosino said:
Dealer Principle won't be able to ask you 10k in a brown envelope
Any of you guys KNOW this actually does happen?

RC1

4,096 posts

218 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Its just an opinion piece and until we see some real evidence behind the claims its all bit meh

bigmowley

1,875 posts

175 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Not a bad watch and a valid opinion. However for me its very over simplified. I don't believe the GT4 market and the GT3 market can be treated with the same broad brush approach. Yes there is obviously some overlap but there is still a big enough price difference between the two ranges to differentiate. An oversaturated new GT4 market should have little if any effect on the GT3 market. Even second hand the GT3 product commands a much stronger price that a GT4.
The issue for me is that Porsche overdid the pricing a bit on the 718GT4 rather than have, or are, making to many. At £100K for a well specified 718GT4 there are a number of very tasty GT3 alternatives admittedly second hand but who cares for a toy? To compound this the 718 GT4 just doesn't quite seem to hit the sweet spot this time round. The quality or perceived quality of the product is still vitally important even at this level. The bigger risk is that Porsche make a duffer of a GT3 although to be fair I can't see this happening smile




rosino

1,346 posts

171 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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throt said:
Any of you guys KNOW this actually does happen?
Yep. First hand experience.

rosino

1,346 posts

171 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
quotequote all
Btw. This is a quite well known micro-economic phenomenon. You have the same with some theatre tickets (e.g. Hamilton). If the price is too low, artificially so, to keep the fan base happy. Then the markets are distorted.

And you need to find a way to regulate it. Again, like some theatre production companies did by issuing tickets that could not be resold. It’s the dilemma of the price vs community reaction to it.

I can assure you if GT3 were sold from 200k start price and produced in enough quantity to satisfy the market a lot of this would be solved.

Which is exactly what happens in continental Europe btw. Cars are much more expensive, numbers much bigger. Who wants one gets one. Easy.

In the U.K. some are ok with the system because they can play it to their advantage, others have a good relationship with their dealers, others pay directly or indirectly for the privilege of choosing the stitching colour. I will keep trying to get one at list of I can, but if I cannot (more likely) I will just pass and buy something else in the meantime.

Deansfield

223 posts

103 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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At 200k many real enthusiasts that are not as wealthy as the galloot that suggests prices like this would be stuffed

So back to the very wealthy multi car buyers!

Geoff39GL

573 posts

135 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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"To compound this the 718 GT4 just doesn't quite seem to hit the sweet spot this time round."


Where did you get that from ?
Have you owned both to make a judgement ?

From my point of view having owned both that is just not true, the issue with the 718 is noise in all other areas it is a typical Porsche next generation everything moved slightly on, evolution not revolution .

The gearing is a problem on both if anything I would say the 718 is slightly more usable everyday.

All just my opinion smile

theRossatron

1,028 posts

231 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Geoff39GL said:
"To compound this the 718 GT4 just doesn't quite seem to hit the sweet spot this time round."


Where did you get that from ?
Have you owned both to make a judgement ?

From my point of view having owned both that is just not true, the issue with the 718 is noise in all other areas it is a typical Porsche next generation everything moved slightly on, evolution not revolution .

The gearing is a problem on both if anything I would say the 718 is slightly more usable everyday.

All just my opinion smile
I've had both and I actually felt simliar about the 718 "not hitting the sweet spot". Partially the noise, partially the dealer pissing me off and partially the fact isn't wasn't that much different to the 981. I think had I had both but had the 718 1st I might have felt differently. Like you say though, evolution so I'm not really sure what I was expecting!

av185

18,433 posts

126 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Geoff39GL said:
"To compound this the 718 GT4 just doesn't quite seem to hit the sweet spot this time round."


Where did you get that from ?
Have you owned both to make a judgement ?

From my point of view having owned both that is just not true, the issue with the 718 is noise in all other areas it is a typical Porsche next generation everything moved slightly on, evolution not revolution .

The gearing is a problem on both if anything I would say the 718 is slightly more usable everyday.

All just my opinion smile
For the record BM obviously owns a 718 Spyder.

I have a 718 GT4 from new and agree with you it is a far better package than both the 981 GT4 and 981 Spyder both of which I owned from new. The 718 Spyder is just a GT4 with a cab.

All this talk of 718 GT4s being readily available but Spyders hard to get is bks in fact I know of three customers across two OPCs who have swapped their GT4 PDK allocations for Spyder PDKs so hardly difficult to obtain in that sense. I have been also been offered a no strings Spyder PDK allocation too but declined.

SRT Hellcat

7,017 posts

216 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Deansfield said:
At 200k many real enthusiasts that are not as wealthy as the galloot that suggests prices like this would be stuffed

So back to the very wealthy multi car buyers!
The 991GT2RS was list at £235k I believe and I do not know anyone personally that managed to get an allocation

bigmowley

1,875 posts

175 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
quotequote all
Geoff39GL said:
"To compound this the 718 GT4 just doesn't quite seem to hit the sweet spot this time round."


Where did you get that from ?
Have you owned both to make a judgement ?

From my point of view having owned both that is just not true, the issue with the 718 is noise in all other areas it is a typical Porsche next generation everything moved slightly on, evolution not revolution .

The gearing is a problem on both if anything I would say the 718 is slightly more usable everyday.

All just my opinion smile
Partly from my own judgement, which i recognize is flawed as I have a 718 Spyder this time round rather than the GT4 that I had in the 981 generation. I have tracked them both as well as plenty of road miles. Partly through reviews, videos and road tests.

For me purely In my opinion and taking everything into consideration, including price, the 981 generation is the better car. My 981 was a well loaded clubsport at £81K ready to go, the equivalent 718 is just under £100K, so nearly 25% more expensive. The extra weight and the extra torque of the new car just seems to make everything work a little bit harder and I certainly preferred the 981 on track. I am not dissing the 718 generation cars they are great allrounders and the differences are marginal and subtle. However they are definitely not a 25% better car!


anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 10th February 2021
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Interesting view but as Porsche don't talk about how GT car allocations work it is speculation but obvious that increasing production volumes can dilute a brand which carries risk.

It could be that Porsche don't like speculators buying and flipping GT cars for profit and want to disrupt/discourage this by slowly diluting the brand so cars go back to people that will drive and enjoy them rather than speculate with them. By doing this slowly there won't be a price crash with all the pain that causes everyone, again pure speculation but doing my bit to help the internet fill the gaps.

The video begs the question why does he care so much about it, does he have skin in the game?