How long before a £100k 992 GTS?
Discussion
Too many 992GTS cars were built to preserve residuals let alone overs. Same goes for the 718GT4 and 992 Turbo S. These are all mass produced cars and the residuals will reflect this from now on.
Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
GT4P said:
I say by the end of the year going by this one https://finder.porsche.com/gb/en-GB/details/porsch...
I know, terrible right.To spec that car now, it would cost pretty much £120,000.00 to the penny, so its £5,000.00 under list for a 15 month old, 12000 mile example, ie retaining 96% of current value. However, with price increases since original purchase it was probably nearer a £115,000.00 car, so retaining 100%, and the owner likely got around £105,000.00 for it from the dealer, so in 15 months and 12000 miles has lost 10k, or 91% of its original value to them.
This isn't a limited run car, so what are you all expecting ? Personally I didn't expect to trade my Targa at overs (although could have likely made a quick 15-20k on delivery if I wanted to), but if I keep it another 6-12 months and lose 20k in the 2 years I've had it then I'll be more than happy to be honest. It it does better than that, then so be it. If it does worse, again, so be it.
I do think values will firm up in the run up to summer, as per normal with sports cars, but losses are to be expected with these cars.
Taffy66 said:
Too many 992GTS cars were built to preserve residuals let alone overs. Same goes for the 718GT4 and 992 Turbo S. These are all mass produced cars and the residuals will reflect this from now on.
Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
Would agree to some degree, although certain GTS's will do better than others as has always been the case.Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
Taycan's are a whole different thing. The issue with EV's is the market is moving too quickly and no one wants out of date tech in old EV's. I have an Etron (55 engine model) which is just over 3 years old (very early adopter) and it has a range of around 170 miles in winter & 200 in summer. I have an order in on a replacement model (Q8 Etron), again the 55 model, and it will likely do nearer 225 miles in winter & 275 in summer, which is a considerable increase, and it isn't anywhere near the longest range EV out there. I'm also assuming most EV's are company cars for tax reasons, and therefore have to be new(ish) and therefore this further effects older models values. How many people buy 2nd hand laptops with old operating systems, processors, etc. The same goes for EV's, ie its generally old tech by the times its available to purchase.
Hence me purchasing my 992, and leasing my Etron.
Taffy66 said:
Too many 992GTS cars were built to preserve residuals let alone overs. Same goes for the 718GT4 and 992 Turbo S. These are all mass produced cars and the residuals will reflect this from now on.
Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
Spot on Taff.Same goes for Taycans where you currently have a huge choice for £20-30k under new invoice cost.
Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
GT4RS said:
Spot on Taff.
Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
I more question why anyone would want to purchase a base 992 rather than a GTS version. A Carrera is £90k, a Carrera S is £103k & a GTS is £115k.Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
The market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
Hobo said:
GT4RS said:
Spot on Taff.
Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
I more question why anyone would want to purchase a base 992 rather than a GTS version. A Carrera is £90k, a Carrera S is £103k & a GTS is £115k.Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
The market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
I’ve got a base Carrera , I was waiting for a T but got an allocation early last year and took it as the T launch was dragging on and to be fair it is as fast as required for uk roads. For an everyday sports car it ticks all the boxes.
Hobo said:
I know, terrible right.
To spec that car now, it would cost pretty much £120,000.00 to the penny, so its £5,000.00 under list for a 15 month old, 12000 mile example, ie retaining 96% of current value. However, with price increases since original purchase it was probably nearer a £115,000.00 car, so retaining 100%, and the owner likely got around £105,000.00 for it from the dealer, so in 15 months and 12000 miles has lost 10k, or 91% of its original value to them.
This isn't a limited run car, so what are you all expecting ? Personally I didn't expect to trade my Targa at overs (although could have likely made a quick 15-20k on delivery if I wanted to), but if I keep it another 6-12 months and lose 20k in the 2 years I've had it then I'll be more than happy to be honest. It it does better than that, then so be it. If it does worse, again, so be it.
I do think values will firm up in the run up to summer, as per normal with sports cars, but losses are to be expected with these cars.
Agree with everything you have said here and the later posts. Well put and I'm of the same thinking. To spec that car now, it would cost pretty much £120,000.00 to the penny, so its £5,000.00 under list for a 15 month old, 12000 mile example, ie retaining 96% of current value. However, with price increases since original purchase it was probably nearer a £115,000.00 car, so retaining 100%, and the owner likely got around £105,000.00 for it from the dealer, so in 15 months and 12000 miles has lost 10k, or 91% of its original value to them.
This isn't a limited run car, so what are you all expecting ? Personally I didn't expect to trade my Targa at overs (although could have likely made a quick 15-20k on delivery if I wanted to), but if I keep it another 6-12 months and lose 20k in the 2 years I've had it then I'll be more than happy to be honest. It it does better than that, then so be it. If it does worse, again, so be it.
I do think values will firm up in the run up to summer, as per normal with sports cars, but losses are to be expected with these cars.
Hobo said:
I more question why anyone would want to purchase a base 992 rather than a GTS version. A Carrera is £90k, a Carrera S is £103k & a GTS is £115k.
The market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
Porsche pricing is weirdly inconsistentThe market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
The 'T' has circa 9-10k of desirable options on top of a base or s car, plus some bits you can't option or buy.
The GTS has various bits of spec [such as sport design pack] on top of an S but its £2800 to upgrade the interior to match the base car.
A 718 cab is a 2k premium over a hard top, a 911 Cab is a 10k premium over a tin top
A 992 can be had with PDK or manual as a nco. A Boxster is a 2k option to add a PDK.
They must chuckle when they pull the pricing together.
ClubsportStr said:
Not everyone has 115k plus options to spend.
I’ve got a base Carrera , I was waiting for a T but got an allocation early last year and took it as the T launch was dragging on and to be fair it is as fast as required for uk roads. For an everyday sports car it ticks all the boxes.
Genuinely get that, but suspect many people are on some sort of PCP, ie deposit & guaranteed value so they wouldn't be overly concerned about the actual 25k difference, as the monthly cost to them would be marginal.I’ve got a base Carrera , I was waiting for a T but got an allocation early last year and took it as the T launch was dragging on and to be fair it is as fast as required for uk roads. For an everyday sports car it ticks all the boxes.
I'd also agree the standard Carrera is likely fast enough for UK road, but when has that ever been the point
I've said it on other chats that I would love to own a GT3 or Turbo S, however suspect in reality for 90% of time I would prefer my current Targa, as is certainly fast enough, and has the option for a bit of open air motoring which the others do not, and I'm not someone who is going to track it anymore, so the urge is just one to 'tick a box' I suspect
Hobo said:
GT4RS said:
Spot on Taff.
Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
I more question why anyone would want to purchase a base 992 rather than a GTS version. A Carrera is £90k, a Carrera S is £103k & a GTS is £115k.Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
The market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
GT4P said:
I say by the end of the year going by this one https://finder.porsche.com/gb/en-GB/details/porsch...
Seems to have a defective gear knobfranki68 said:
People buy Base 911s as they are a better daily than gts models .
All depends on what you prefer. I always wanted a 992 GTS, because it's a car I can daily, do some nice roads trips in it, occasional track/Nurburgring trip, and it's faster than a 992 GT3 in the real world and in 95% of situations.Clearly the base Carrera and S are softer cars and some may prefer that, I totally get it. I think it's fair to say from the thread that Pivo put up of people with 992's on order, it's quite a decent spread of orders across the whole range just of people on this forum. So Porsche have it right and there's a market for all, otherwise they simply wouldn't produce them.
Also, most respected motoring journalists if not all see the GTS as the sweet spot, I think it was Henry Catchpole or Rory Reid who said that in reality, they see the 992 GTS as kind of between the GT3 and Turbo S, in that it's more dynamic to drive than a Turbo S and therefore has elements closer to a GT3, yet it has a Turbo engine with more than enough power, but still more useable than that of a Turbo S which is too much for the road. Think he also said the 992 GTS kind of makes the 992 Turbo redundant, because a lot of parts in the 992 GTS come from 992 Turbo/S, chassis, suspension, brakes, helper springs etc..... Therefore, I think you have the best of both worlds and makes the perfect one Porsche 911 garage IMHO.
I've done 3 PEC's at Silverstone, different instructors each time. Each time I asked them which is their favourite 911, 2 out of 3 said the GTS, one said Turbo S. Trusted opinions from people who drive all of them across the range day in day out.
Schuey_911 said:
All depends on what you prefer. I always wanted a 992 GTS, because it's a car I can daily, do some nice roads trips in it, occasional track/Nurburgring trip, and it's faster than a 992 GT3 in the real world and in 95% of situations.
Clearly the base Carrera and S are softer cars and some may prefer that, I totally get it. I think it's fair to say from the thread that Pivo put up of people with 992's on order, it's quite a decent spread of orders across the whole range just of people on this forum. So Porsche have it right and there's a market for all, otherwise they simply wouldn't produce them.
Also, most respected motoring journalists if not all see the GTS as the sweet spot, I think it was Henry Catchpole or Rory Reid who said that in reality, they see the 992 GTS as kind of between the GT3 and Turbo S, in that it's more dynamic to drive than a Turbo S and therefore has elements closer to a GT3, yet it has a Turbo engine with more than enough power, but still more useable than that of a Turbo S which is too much for the road. Think he also said the 992 GTS kind of makes the 992 Turbo redundant, because a lot of parts in the 992 GTS come from 992 Turbo/S, chassis, suspension, brakes, helper springs etc..... Therefore, I think you have the best of both worlds and makes the perfect one Porsche 911 garage IMHO.
I've done 3 PEC's at Silverstone, different instructors each time. Each time I asked them which is their favourite 911, 2 out of 3 said the GTS, one said Turbo S. Trusted opinions from people who drive all of them across the range day in day out.
All good points……but have you driven a GT3? THAT engine eclipses any other points that may (or may not) make a GTS a better car in a wider variety of driving situations.Clearly the base Carrera and S are softer cars and some may prefer that, I totally get it. I think it's fair to say from the thread that Pivo put up of people with 992's on order, it's quite a decent spread of orders across the whole range just of people on this forum. So Porsche have it right and there's a market for all, otherwise they simply wouldn't produce them.
Also, most respected motoring journalists if not all see the GTS as the sweet spot, I think it was Henry Catchpole or Rory Reid who said that in reality, they see the 992 GTS as kind of between the GT3 and Turbo S, in that it's more dynamic to drive than a Turbo S and therefore has elements closer to a GT3, yet it has a Turbo engine with more than enough power, but still more useable than that of a Turbo S which is too much for the road. Think he also said the 992 GTS kind of makes the 992 Turbo redundant, because a lot of parts in the 992 GTS come from 992 Turbo/S, chassis, suspension, brakes, helper springs etc..... Therefore, I think you have the best of both worlds and makes the perfect one Porsche 911 garage IMHO.
I've done 3 PEC's at Silverstone, different instructors each time. Each time I asked them which is their favourite 911, 2 out of 3 said the GTS, one said Turbo S. Trusted opinions from people who drive all of them across the range day in day out.
If a 1 is a Carrera and a 2 is a Carrera S, a 3 is a GTS, a GT3 must be a 6,7 or 8……THAT engine is a different animal and damn right phenomenal in both sound and performance…
Hobo said:
GT4RS said:
Spot on Taff.
Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
I more question why anyone would want to purchase a base 992 rather than a GTS version. A Carrera is £90k, a Carrera S is £103k & a GTS is £115k.Porsche are in it for the profit hence them ramping up
the production of the Turbo s / GTS 992 and 718 gt4.
These cars make Porsche good profit, why build a base Carrera 992 or a base 718 cayman when you can build and sell products which makes a far higher £ value.
They are currently doing the same churning out high spec end of line Cayennes before the new model lands.
The market for the non GTS models must be small as a marque selling sports cars to enthusiasts, surely ? Moreso, with the T model at 100k.
Another thing to consider is the more you spend on run of the mill Porsches when new normally means the more you loose in depreciation.
To many people have tried to jump on the let’s make a profit bandwagon. If a 992 gt3 is now loosing money there’s zero hope for a gts to hold its money.
Long term I feel the bases cars will do ok due to the lower entry point and fact that they have produced such low volumes over recent years.
Cheap financing is long gone and many will feel the pain when they need to refinance their ballon’s after 3 years.
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