Porsche 981 Boxtser / Cayman 20" tyre choices - P Zero N1s

[bcr5784]

Milnsey said:

Low speed graunching tends to gradually creep back as tyres wear out in my experience

I think that is inevitable - you rely on shuffling of the tread blocks to accommodate the deficiencies in adherance to Ackermann geometry. Obviously as the blocks wear they are less likely to shuffle - whatever the brand of tyre.

[ginettajoe]

I planned a 5000 mile trip around Europe starting at the beginning of May in my 981 3.4 Boxter 'S'. The trip took me through France, Switzerland, Italian Lakes, Slovenia, Croatia, Montenegro, Albania then a ferry to Bari, southern Italy, up to the Italian Riviera, the French Riviera, and back home to reality in Manchester.
My car has a top spec, with 20" wheels, sport suspension etc, and was fitted with Pirelli P-zero tyres which were very noisy from the rears! I did some research and decided to change them for Goodyear Eagle F1 asymmetrical which cost me £740 all inclusive, selling the Pirelli tyres for £250! The Goodyear tyres transformed the car, improving the ride quality, the noise from the rears reduced considerably, and I have covered over 6000 miles since they were fitted, with the fronts still showing 7mm, and the rears 6.5/7mmee. Fuel consumption was incredible, never returning less than 33mpg, and on AutoRoute sections of 100 to 300 miles it returned just over 40mpg.
The 'scrubbing' effect I had with the Pirelli, when on lock at low speed has disappeared completely, and I can say it was the best thing I could have done to the car, transforming it completely!!!

[DJMC]

hixster said:

The new tyres feel super smooth,

Take them back and demand replacements with tread!

[eggy41]

Picked the car up tonight from ATS, new Goodyears all round ... short drive home but I can feel the difference in ride comfort already, night and day .... one question ... they're inflated them to 33, I was running the Pirelli's at 31 which I thought was the recommendation, what are others running Goodyears at ?

981 GTS with steel suspension for ref

Thanks for the advice all, top tip

[hixster]

eggy41 said:

Picked the car up tonight from ATS, new Goodyears all round ... short drive home but I can feel the difference in ride comfort already, night and day .... one question ... they're inflated them to 33, I was running the Pirelli's at 31 which I thought was the recommendation

33 front and back on 20"

[7184c]

33 for me too.

Used to have on 31 which is the comfort pressure but picked up two screw punctures in a month.

[ATM]

7184c said:

33 for me too.

Used to have on 31 which is the comfort pressure but picked up two screw punctures in a month.

I thought comfort is 30. Is comfort different for 20, 19 and 18?

[hixster]

All the pressures are in the manual which says comfort pressure is only something which should be chosen on 20" wheels.

[ATM]

hixster said:

All the pressures are in the manual which says comfort pressure is only something which should be chosen on 20" wheels.

I dont have a manual?

[eggy41]

do you think you'd adjust for steel vs PASM ?

[SimonOcean]

eggy41 said:

do you think you'd adjust for steel vs PASM ?

No. Really don't think so. Not that sensitive.

[Flyferrari]

When I test drove a used GTS at Silverstone OPC I absolutely loved the way the steering had "feel" (unusual for a 981!) and flowed with the road/was comfortable despite having the X73 suspension (and PTV, PCCB etc.). I put this down to the way the car had been specified. There were a few spec choices I couldn't live with at the price asked so I walked away. 6 months later I managed to get a new GTS allocation and, on the strength of that test drive, I specified the car ,dynamically, exactly the same way. I even bit the bullet on the PCCB brakes as I couldn't bear the idea of "my" car being delivered and driving differently for the sake of one spec choice. Much as I absolutely love my GTS, I've always felt that my car never lived up to that test drive in terms of steering feel and comfort. Recently, that same car came up for sale again and I've now confirmed that it was fitted with the Goodyear F1s vs. the Pirelli P Zero (N0) on my car. Much as I hate burning money, I'm really tempted to remove my Pirellis and go for a set of F1s. The only thing stopping me is the thought that either the new P Zero (N1) or upcoming N rated Michelin PS4 may be even better in the areas that matter to me. Has anyone moved from the F1s to something else and felt that they got a better tyre?

[DJMC]

hixster said:

All the pressures are in the manual which says comfort pressure is only something which should be chosen on 20" wheels.

"If the tires are not yet taught."...
How do tyres learn anything?
Are they now made of memory foam?

[eggy41]

Flyferrari said:

'm really tempted to remove my Pirellis and go for a set of F1s. The only thing stopping me is the thought that either the new P Zero (N1) or upcoming N rated Michelin PS4 may be even better in the areas that matter to me.

Sapphire Blue @ Silverstone ? I had exactly the same experience as you, now wish I had moved to the Goodyears a lot earlier. I would recommend you change, what to ? Well the Goodyears are a known quantity and available at approx £800 for the set. The Michelin's are 3-4 months away, will cost £1100+ and your then taking a punt on an unknown quantity. The Pirelli N1 seem to be better but I'd not give them the benefit of the doubt after the N0, so I'd go with F1's

Hindsight and all that but I wish I'd done it 18 months ago

[bcr5784]

Flyferrari said:

The only thing stopping me is the thought that either the new P Zero (N1) or upcoming N rated Michelin PS4 may be even better in the areas that matter to me. Has anyone moved from the F1s to something else and felt that they got a better tyre?

I've had F1s and both N0 and N1 Pirellis on my car. However my experience on F1s was on 18" wheels , my Pirellis on 19s. The ride was bit better on the F1s - but you'd expect that because of the smaller wheels. Importantly steering feel was better on the F1s too. However there was much more understeer with the F1s and that was a killer for me. Of course it's impossible to be sure how much that is influenced by wheel size - I suspect not much.

Personally I find the N1 Pirellis a much more "fun" tyre than either of the other 2. The car loses that resolutely planted feel on N1s and becomes much more throttle adjustable. Outright grip may be lower on N1s (though I haven't any proof of that - just a feeling), but that doesn't matter to me. Having driven a 718 on N1 Pirellis I certainly put down some of the improvement in handling over the 981 down to the change of tyres.

N0 and N1 Pirellis feel very different. Scrub is much reduced to the point it is not an issue at any decent temperature. However tyre roar remains high and the ride is very similar (mind you it is exceptionally good with PASM on all 3 tyres)

[JayK12]

hixster said:

eggy41 said:

Picked the car up tonight from ATS, new Goodyears all round ... short drive home but I can feel the difference in ride comfort already, night and day .... one question ... they're inflated them to 33, I was running the Pirelli's at 31 which I thought was the recommendation

33 front and back on 20"

Starting at 33 is too high in my opinion, as the tyres get warm hot pressures will be way past 33 psi. I found this to be the optimum.

Had my nitrogen filled but its just as expansive as air. Run mine cold at 27 psi, and hot 33 psi in the summer currently.

[Bennachie]

Why bother with a nitrogen fill? Air is 75% nitrogen anyway................

[Flyferrari]

eggy41 said:

Sapphire Blue @ Silverstone ? I had exactly the same experience as you, now wish I had moved to the Goodyears a lot earlier. I would recommend you change, what to ? Well the Goodyears are a known quantity and available at approx £800 for the set. The Michelin's are 3-4 months away, will cost £1100+ and your then taking a punt on an unknown quantity. The Pirelli N1 seem to be better but I'd not give them the benefit of the doubt after the N0, so I'd go with F1's

Hindsight and all that but I wish I'd done it 18 months ago

No, interestingly. It was the Carmine red one. Perhaps Silverstone have a monopoly on F1 shod cars . I'm not a "red car" person but it did look good. The deal breaker was the carbon buckets, which I didn't think would work on a DD, and the £73K price on a year old car.

Bcr5784's experience of understeer on the F1s concerns me a bit but that could easily be the tyre size differences. As I have X73 suspension a compliant tyre is more important than it would be if I had PASM.

Any more thoughts?

[JayK12]

Bennachie said:

Why bother with a nitrogen fill? Air is 75% nitrogen anyway................

A friend did it for free so i thought it was work a try to keep pressures constant at HOT. i.e always at 33psi. This keeps optinum pressure and tyre contact patch, but after a few runs out, i think unless its F1 technology its alot of nonsense.

[bcr5784]

Flyferrari said:

Bcr5784's experience of understeer on the F1s concerns me a bit but that could easily be the tyre size differences.

Any more thoughts?

I'd be doubtful. Sure the bigger sidewalls of the tyre on the 18" rims will result is slightly bigger slip angles, and therefore a less sharp turn in, however mid corner on a neutral throttle that should even out . So I'm bound to think it's a characteristic of the F1s rather than the rim size.

I can well understand the reluctance of some with experience of N0 Pirellis to risk N1 - my N0s suffered the cracking that others experience and were replaced free by Pirelli - but I'd try N1s if you can. (A bit cheeky but you could ask for a demo of a 718 - it'll very likely be on N1s)

Edited by bcr5784 on Thursday 29th June 17:52