Final Cayman question
Discussion
anonymous said:
[redacted]
As you say - no evidence. If Porsche conservative performance claims were as a result of gentle driving then US testers being brutal would gain more time over Porsche figures with manual cars than they do with PDK (where technique/brutality doesn't gain you anything - it's all down to the software). BUT they gain similar amounts over Porsche figures with both PDK and manual. Hence technique (as opposed to test conditions) seem to have little to do with it - as any sane person would ACTUALLY realise. Whichever way you look at it PDK has a performance advantage as (almost) everyone would agree. Making silly (juvenile) statements about "form" is really no substitute for evidence or logic.
By all means argue that the manual gearbox has tactile advantages and that PDK deskills the driving experience (it does), but don't look silly by denying that PDK conveys performance advantages in a straight line - and makes no difference around the corners.
bcr5784 said:
I've had enough. I'll leave it to whoever wants to to argue that despite Porsche's figures and every independent test to the contrary that a manual car accelerates through the gears as fast as a PDK one
- and that the world is flat.
Most threads in which cmoose makes comment leads at least one person to this very understandable conclusion. He really is the most awful buffoon! I think he has very little else in his life but contraryness. Be a proud member of the massive that is 'people who have basically given up trying to reason with cmoose'. He has a reputation for it.- and that the world is flat.
One other thing to bear in mind (it may not be the case for 987s but worth checking) is that in-gear max speeds can vary quite a lot between manual and PDK. Top of 2nd in a manual 981 is about 84mph, in the PDK it's about 75mph. The gap is even bigger in 3rd with the manual coming in at about 115mph and the PDK a bit over 100mph. If you like working the top end of the rev range you may find that the PDK is more conducive to being able to enjoy it at less naughty speeds. Personally this was one of the reasons I went PDK with my old BGTS even though in general I prefer manuals.
Just for those of you that drive normally on the roads, and on an odd occasion blat it up a straight road...... Which is all you should be doing on todays roads.....
Quite a few people have driven my 981 2.7 and have said how powerful the car feels just driving on normal roads.
Funny thing is, it appears to have plenty of torque in high gears to get round junctions and roundabouts in third gear, which I did not expect, so in normal driving its much more usable than I thought it would be.
The gap in power comes to notice when you want to get by something really quickly.
You have to drop down two gears to reach the power point, and not one.
However for normal overtaking on dual carriages and motorways at 70mph 6th gear has been fine for me everytime so its never been a problem.
The point I'm making is that for most people its well fast enough, and I don't want to overtake everthing involving a gut wrenching experience everytime....
We are talking about overtaking and cornering on public roads, and some people can't control what they do enough to protect someone just chugging along.
If you want to drive really fast, take it on a track day......
But, of course a normal Porsche is not designed as a racing car, so you will be thrashed by most other cars there, but will learn that a Porsche is designed for the road only, and just be happy with that.
I assume that most of you here will already understand that anyway.
So for me, the 2.7 981 does all I need now, but for some that will not be enough...
Remember, the 981 2.7 beat the alfa c4 round the track.......
What a belter???
Quite a few people have driven my 981 2.7 and have said how powerful the car feels just driving on normal roads.
Funny thing is, it appears to have plenty of torque in high gears to get round junctions and roundabouts in third gear, which I did not expect, so in normal driving its much more usable than I thought it would be.
The gap in power comes to notice when you want to get by something really quickly.
You have to drop down two gears to reach the power point, and not one.
However for normal overtaking on dual carriages and motorways at 70mph 6th gear has been fine for me everytime so its never been a problem.
The point I'm making is that for most people its well fast enough, and I don't want to overtake everthing involving a gut wrenching experience everytime....
We are talking about overtaking and cornering on public roads, and some people can't control what they do enough to protect someone just chugging along.
If you want to drive really fast, take it on a track day......
But, of course a normal Porsche is not designed as a racing car, so you will be thrashed by most other cars there, but will learn that a Porsche is designed for the road only, and just be happy with that.
I assume that most of you here will already understand that anyway.
So for me, the 2.7 981 does all I need now, but for some that will not be enough...
Remember, the 981 2.7 beat the alfa c4 round the track.......
What a belter???
Nick Murray is sporting an interesting PDK t-shirt in his latest video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuisdwkh5EI
Disclaimer - I've specced PDK.
Disclaimer - I've specced PDK.
Johnniem said:
Most threads in which cmoose makes comment leads at least one person to this very understandable conclusion. He really is the most awful buffoon! I think he has very little else in his life but contraryness. Be a proud member of the massive that is 'people who have basically given up trying to reason with cmoose'. He has a reputation for it.
I'm not so sure cmoose and bcr5784 aren't one and the same person.Mario149 said:
One other thing to bear in mind (it may not be the case for 987s but worth checking) is that in-gear max speeds can vary quite a lot between manual and PDK. Top of 2nd in a manual 981 is about 84mph, in the PDK it's about 75mph. The gap is even bigger in 3rd with the manual coming in at about 115mph and the PDK a bit over 100mph. If you like working the top end of the rev range you may find that the PDK is more conducive to being able to enjoy it at less naughty speeds. Personally this was one of the reasons I went PDK with my old BGTS even though in general I prefer manuals.
I THINK the gearing on the 987 is the same as the 981 - but if you look through previous posts you will see there is considerable confusion on this matter. Porsche literature quotes the same manual and PDK final drive ratios for both cars.
HOWEVER the figures Porsche quote are 3.89 for the manual and 3.25 for PDK which might lead you to believe that PDK cars have longer not shorter intermediates - and 40.5mph/1000 in 7th - but as you say that is not the case. Looking at diagrams of the gearbox, you will see that each of the two gearbox shafts is geared to the output shaft. I suspect that either the diff ratio quoted is just wrong or (perhaps more likely) that both gearbox shafts are geared down to the output shaft.
Certainly measurements on my car (GPS vs revcounter - which will have a margin of error) suggests that the "effective" final drive ratio of PDK is about 3.7. The PDK intermediate gear ratios are much lower than manual ones leading to lower overall gearing (7th apart).
Anyone know for sure?
Johnniem said:
bcr5784 said:
I've had enough. I'll leave it to whoever wants to to argue that despite Porsche's figures and every independent test to the contrary that a manual car accelerates through the gears as fast as a PDK one
- and that the world is flat.
Most threads in which cmoose makes comment leads at least one person to this very understandable conclusion. He really is the most awful buffoon! I think he has very little else in his life but contraryness. Be a proud member of the massive that is 'people who have basically given up trying to reason with cmoose'. He has a reputation for it.- and that the world is flat.
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