Is the 987 Spyder worth the money…
Discussion
johnfm said:
harryblue said:
Lovely car, I'm a big fan of the Spyder and tried to buy one last year but my offer was rejected, ironically just before they dropped a bit and the guy ended up selling it for less than my offer.
But I'm struggling to see £60k worth there when a very nice 997.2 could be had for a fair bit less.
Have you driven a 997 back to back wiht a Spyder?But I'm struggling to see £60k worth there when a very nice 997.2 could be had for a fair bit less.
Wife has a 991 S. Lovely car. Sounds great. PDK in sport mode is fantastic.
But it is not in the same bracket for handling as the Spyder. Not close.
But I agree that £60k is getting a bit punchy.
I might need to re-price mine upwards a bit if these two at Ashgoods sell!
I don't like the PDK box, I swore I'd never have another one and I've gone back on that twice and regretted it both times.
A manual Spyder of any model is a lovely car, not knocking it, there is definitely room in my garage for the right model, but if we're comparing them then I still think the 911 is the premium product.
Im not sure it's the same with the newer models though.
With 718 spyders and RS having 420 and 500 hp the new 911's are more GT cars whereas the 718's are still relatively small and agile
My issue with the 987 spyder, after owning two of them, is that whilst they are no doubt a step up from the 987.2 S model the difference is not massive. I've also owned a 987.2 S alongside my spyders and can definitely say the spyder is not worth 3 times the value of the 987.2 S.
It has the same engine with only a tweak giving it an extra 10bhp which isn't noticeable.
Don't get me wrong I loved my spyders and at 40-45k are more special than the S model. Putting them at 60k against 981 Spyders and 718 4.0 GTS model with 400 bhp Im not so sure. Time will tell but they are a very niche model so who knows!
With 718 spyders and RS having 420 and 500 hp the new 911's are more GT cars whereas the 718's are still relatively small and agile
My issue with the 987 spyder, after owning two of them, is that whilst they are no doubt a step up from the 987.2 S model the difference is not massive. I've also owned a 987.2 S alongside my spyders and can definitely say the spyder is not worth 3 times the value of the 987.2 S.
It has the same engine with only a tweak giving it an extra 10bhp which isn't noticeable.
Don't get me wrong I loved my spyders and at 40-45k are more special than the S model. Putting them at 60k against 981 Spyders and 718 4.0 GTS model with 400 bhp Im not so sure. Time will tell but they are a very niche model so who knows!
Edited by jimmy p on Tuesday 15th July 07:31
I think the 987 Spyder is a pretty unique car in the modern Porsche line-up and feels as such when driving it. In my opinion it's the combined little things, lower CoG and less unsprung weight than a 987 Boxster makes it a sweeter drive.
It's not a GT car with (comparatively) high HP and levels of grip, it's quite delicate and feels a little old school. I had a 987 Spyder back in the days when you could pick up a one owner, 3k miles car for £30k and wish I'd kept mine! I also had a 997 GTS which is the 911 of the same year and while again it was a great car it didn't have the special feel of the Spyder.
I'm now driving a 718 Spyder, which again is a really good car but hasn't got the delicate feel of the 987. Would I buy a 987 Spyder for £60k though....I'm not so sure!
It's not a GT car with (comparatively) high HP and levels of grip, it's quite delicate and feels a little old school. I had a 987 Spyder back in the days when you could pick up a one owner, 3k miles car for £30k and wish I'd kept mine! I also had a 997 GTS which is the 911 of the same year and while again it was a great car it didn't have the special feel of the Spyder.
I'm now driving a 718 Spyder, which again is a really good car but hasn't got the delicate feel of the 987. Would I buy a 987 Spyder for £60k though....I'm not so sure!
The 911 is the premium product? I really struggle to understand that.
It's around 80% the same car.
The only real differences are:
1. mid engine 2 seats vs rear engine 2+2.
2. Power - the hobbling power reduction for the lower price point and marketing it thusly, for the understandable reason to create the 'extra' model lines.
Other than that it's the same materials, same nuts and bolts and manufacturing techniques. Everything up to the back of the front seats (underneath) is the same...I don't feel there is a premium or sub-premium between the two.
IF that term were to be used, I'd aim it at the cross brand platform sharing Cayenne, Macan and Taycan.
The 987 is a 'reduced fat', mid engine'd 997
It's not even that much smaller... approx 60mm in length, <10mm width
Status and in-brand snobbery I understand, 911=icon and very unique dynamics, but it's not more premium.... different not better, I reckon.
It's around 80% the same car.
The only real differences are:
1. mid engine 2 seats vs rear engine 2+2.
2. Power - the hobbling power reduction for the lower price point and marketing it thusly, for the understandable reason to create the 'extra' model lines.
Other than that it's the same materials, same nuts and bolts and manufacturing techniques. Everything up to the back of the front seats (underneath) is the same...I don't feel there is a premium or sub-premium between the two.
IF that term were to be used, I'd aim it at the cross brand platform sharing Cayenne, Macan and Taycan.
The 987 is a 'reduced fat', mid engine'd 997
It's not even that much smaller... approx 60mm in length, <10mm width
Status and in-brand snobbery I understand, 911=icon and very unique dynamics, but it's not more premium.... different not better, I reckon.
harryblue said:
I've tried a few, borrowed a mates for the day, etc, but in my opinion they don't feel as special as a 911, plus if you know how to use the 911 to it's advantages then it will also outpace the Spyder, Porsche knew what they were doing and they purposely made the Spyder less capable than an equivalent 911 so it wouldn't tread on it's toes, they want to keep the 911 as the premium product.
I don't like the PDK box, I swore I'd never have another one and I've gone back on that twice and regretted it both times.
A manual Spyder of any model is a lovely car, not knocking it, there is definitely room in my garage for the right model, but if we're comparing them then I still think the 911 is the premium product.
We all like different things. I don't like the PDK box, I swore I'd never have another one and I've gone back on that twice and regretted it both times.
A manual Spyder of any model is a lovely car, not knocking it, there is definitely room in my garage for the right model, but if we're comparing them then I still think the 911 is the premium product.
Good that you like a 997. I'm sure a manual 997 copue that's a bit lighter than a cab handles great - but my direct experience is that the Spyder isn't 'less capable' other than Vmax on a motorway. You're probably just a better driver than me so can get more out of a 911 than I can.
Big E 118 said:
I think the 987 Spyder is a pretty unique car in the modern Porsche line-up and feels as such when driving it. In my opinion it's the combined little things, lower CoG and less unsprung weight than a 987 Boxster makes it a sweeter drive.
It's not a GT car with (comparatively) high HP and levels of grip, it's quite delicate and feels a little old school. I had a 987 Spyder back in the days when you could pick up a one owner, 3k miles car for £30k and wish I'd kept mine! I also had a 997 GTS which is the 911 of the same year and while again it was a great car it didn't have the special feel of the Spyder.
I'm now driving a 718 Spyder, which again is a really good car but hasn't got the delicate feel of the 987. Would I buy a 987 Spyder for £60k though....I'm not so sure!
Do tell ...It's not a GT car with (comparatively) high HP and levels of grip, it's quite delicate and feels a little old school. I had a 987 Spyder back in the days when you could pick up a one owner, 3k miles car for £30k and wish I'd kept mine! I also had a 997 GTS which is the 911 of the same year and while again it was a great car it didn't have the special feel of the Spyder.
I'm now driving a 718 Spyder, which again is a really good car but hasn't got the delicate feel of the 987. Would I buy a 987 Spyder for £60k though....I'm not so sure!
johnfm said:
harryblue said:
I've tried a few, borrowed a mates for the day, etc, but in my opinion they don't feel as special as a 911, plus if you know how to use the 911 to it's advantages then it will also outpace the Spyder, Porsche knew what they were doing and they purposely made the Spyder less capable than an equivalent 911 so it wouldn't tread on it's toes, they want to keep the 911 as the premium product.
I don't like the PDK box, I swore I'd never have another one and I've gone back on that twice and regretted it both times.
A manual Spyder of any model is a lovely car, not knocking it, there is definitely room in my garage for the right model, but if we're comparing them then I still think the 911 is the premium product.
We all like different things. I don't like the PDK box, I swore I'd never have another one and I've gone back on that twice and regretted it both times.
A manual Spyder of any model is a lovely car, not knocking it, there is definitely room in my garage for the right model, but if we're comparing them then I still think the 911 is the premium product.
Good that you like a 997. I'm sure a manual 997 copue that's a bit lighter than a cab handles great - but my direct experience is that the Spyder isn't 'less capable' other than Vmax on a motorway. You're probably just a better driver than me so can get more out of a 911 than I can.
I feel like a 911 is more predictable because you know what it's going to do and if you follow the slow in/fast out method then you can really hammer it out of bends and it's less likely to spin than the Spyder. Maybe it was just my style suits the 911.
I still stand by what I say though and I think Porsche very much keep their 911 as the premium offering, that's not a slight on the Spyder though, exactly the opposite, I'd love one if space and money were no object, and I'd probably enjoy driving it more on those days when I don't feel like a 911, but I've still just never felt that it had that special feel that you get in a 911 and so I'd struggle paying a premium over the same era 911 or even much over the Boxster, which is essentially the same car in a different dress.
Quickmoose said:
The 911 is the premium product? I really struggle to understand that.
It's around 80% the same car.
The only real differences are:
1. mid engine 2 seats vs rear engine 2+2.
2. Power - the hobbling power reduction for the lower price point and marketing it thusly, for the understandable reason to create the 'extra' model lines.
Other than that it's the same materials, same nuts and bolts and manufacturing techniques. Everything up to the back of the front seats (underneath) is the same...I don't feel there is a premium or sub-premium between the two.
IF that term were to be used, I'd aim it at the cross brand platform sharing Cayenne, Macan and Taycan.
The 987 is a 'reduced fat', mid engine'd 997
It's not even that much smaller... approx 60mm in length, <10mm width
Status and in-brand snobbery I understand, 911=icon and very unique dynamics, but it's not more premium.... different not better, I reckon.
Like all good Porsche models, the 987 Spyder is more than the sum of it parts. Same with the Cayman R, E46 M3 CSL, 964 RS and latterly pretty much every GTS badged 911/Boxster/Cayman Porsche have produced.It's around 80% the same car.
The only real differences are:
1. mid engine 2 seats vs rear engine 2+2.
2. Power - the hobbling power reduction for the lower price point and marketing it thusly, for the understandable reason to create the 'extra' model lines.
Other than that it's the same materials, same nuts and bolts and manufacturing techniques. Everything up to the back of the front seats (underneath) is the same...I don't feel there is a premium or sub-premium between the two.
IF that term were to be used, I'd aim it at the cross brand platform sharing Cayenne, Macan and Taycan.
The 987 is a 'reduced fat', mid engine'd 997
It's not even that much smaller... approx 60mm in length, <10mm width
Status and in-brand snobbery I understand, 911=icon and very unique dynamics, but it's not more premium.... different not better, I reckon.
On paper the mods look subtle and as if they won't amount to much, but the drive all too often tells another, very different story.
Whether a 987.2 Cayman R or Boxster Spyder is worth £??? more than the equivalent S model is a moot point. The R and the Spyder were both produced in limited numbers, and for some, that along with their rarity makes them worth the extra financial investment.
Slippydiff said:
Like all good Porsche models, the 987 Spyder is more than the sum of it parts. Same with the Cayman R, E46 M3 CSL, 964 RS and latterly pretty much every GTS badged 911/Boxster/Cayman Porsche have produced.
On paper the mods look subtle and as if they won't amount to much, but the drive all too often tells another, very different story.
Whether a 987.2 Cayman R or Boxster Spyder is worth £??? more than the equivalent S model is a moot point. The R and the Spyder were both produced in limited numbers, and for some, that along with their rarity makes them worth the extra financial investment.
I'm not sure I'm good enough to really be able to say which is 'better' and I'm sure it's more personal feeling.On paper the mods look subtle and as if they won't amount to much, but the drive all too often tells another, very different story.
Whether a 987.2 Cayman R or Boxster Spyder is worth £??? more than the equivalent S model is a moot point. The R and the Spyder were both produced in limited numbers, and for some, that along with their rarity makes them worth the extra financial investment.
I'd be happy with one I'm sure, but the pricing seems to be a bit too steep for what they are in my humble opinion.
Slippydiff said:
Do tell ...
A fair bit of weight was taken out high in the car, a cut down windscreen and surround, manual lightweight roof, aluminium rear deck, aluminium door skins, lower suspension and carbon bucket seats all helped lower the CoG over the standard Boxster.The Spyder wheels were at the time (and possibly still are?) the lightest wheels that Porsche produced for a road car, in combination with the PCCB's made a fair difference in steering feel IMO.
Big E 118 said:
A fair bit of weight was taken out high in the car, a cut down windscreen and surround, manual lightweight roof, aluminium rear deck, aluminium door skins, lower suspension and carbon bucket seats all helped lower the CoG over the standard Boxster.
The Spyder wheels were at the time (and possibly still are?) the lightest wheels that Porsche produced for a road car, in combination with the PCCB's made a fair difference in steering feel IMO.
The Spyder wheels were at the time (and possibly still are?) the lightest wheels that Porsche produced for a road car, in combination with the PCCB's made a fair difference in steering feel IMO.
Lightest 19" road wheels they'd ever fitted to a road car I think was what they stated.
The difference between the Carrera S II wheels and the Spyder wheels was absolutely minimal however.
If you were lucky enough to own a PCCB equipped car, there was definite reduction in unsprung mass, but it's nothing like as much as Porsche would have you believe. From memory the total reduction between a steel and PCCB equipped car was 6kg across all four corners, granted the front accounted for something like 4kg of that, but it wasn't as big a reduction as many would have you believe.
But a reduction of say 3 -3.5kg in unsprung weigh per front corner would have no doubt made the steering/turn in feel more responsive
johnfm said:
If my car (Manual, PCCBs, PSE, AC) had the buckets it would be perfect.
I cannot justify £7k for a pair...though I did just spend £6.5k on tidying up the underside, new suspension, dinitrol etc etc...
Maybe the seats are the next purshce if I keep the car.
Saw the work you did on your car looked like new after amazing work.I cannot justify £7k for a pair...though I did just spend £6.5k on tidying up the underside, new suspension, dinitrol etc etc...
Maybe the seats are the next purshce if I keep the car.
I know what you mean about the seats 7k is a big amount to pay
Would be the same I guess to swap out the steel brakes for pccb
johnfm said:
If my car (Manual, PCCBs, PSE, AC) had the buckets it would be perfect.
I cannot justify £7k for a pair...though I did just spend £6.5k on tidying up the underside, new suspension, dinitrol etc etc...
Maybe the seats are the next purshce if I keep the car.
Might be worth considering a pair of nicely trimmed Pole positions or similar. I cannot justify £7k for a pair...though I did just spend £6.5k on tidying up the underside, new suspension, dinitrol etc etc...
Maybe the seats are the next purshce if I keep the car.
https://www.recaro-automotive.com/en/classic/class...
Still not cheap, but far cheaper than the Porsche buckets and lighter, to boot.
This thread has got me looking at them and I'd love one in the right spec, carbon seats, manual, apple play, decent exhaust, some mild tuning and proper suspension.
But they're still too expensive, what about the next generation ones? They're supposed to be the real sweet spot, but finding a manual is hard I think?
I've never really paid much attention but a 981 Spyder manual with a good spec is like rocking hose poo.
But they're still too expensive, what about the next generation ones? They're supposed to be the real sweet spot, but finding a manual is hard I think?
I've never really paid much attention but a 981 Spyder manual with a good spec is like rocking hose poo.
harryblue said:
This thread has got me looking at them and I'd love one in the right spec, carbon seats, manual, apple play, decent exhaust, some mild tuning and proper suspension.
But they're still too expensive, what about the next generation ones? They're supposed to be the real sweet spot, but finding a manual is hard I think?
I've never really paid much attention but a 981 Spyder manual with a good spec is like rocking hose poo.
All 981 Spyders/GT4 are manual - PDK only available again in 718 versions.But they're still too expensive, what about the next generation ones? They're supposed to be the real sweet spot, but finding a manual is hard I think?
I've never really paid much attention but a 981 Spyder manual with a good spec is like rocking hose poo.
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