458 search continues

[Durzel]

IME there's next to no discount from main dealers on used approved cars. They are very clued up on what they can get for them.

[PantsFire]

I've been keeping an eye on 458 Spiders but good specs are well over 150k. I think it'll require a 488 replacement that fixes the sound/feel issues, maybe an Naturally Aspirated Hybrid to get the noise while meeting the emissions standards, only that or age will drive down the price of the 458.

[Chris355]

Durzel said:

IME there's next to no discount from main dealers on used approved cars. They are very clued up on what they can get for them.

Yup, found the same. I have looked at several cars from main dealer where they will not move at all on price and a few that will move by a tiny amount.

[Shazbat]

counterpoint:


the 458 sound is no holy grail

nowhere near CS, 355, F50, F12 etc.

plenty of people feel that the 488 actually sounds better than a 458 and is more authentic in tone (albeit not as loud or frenetic)

personally never thought that the 430 or 458 sounded much cop ....

Speciale sounds the worst of the lot ... just terrible


so yeah, would personally never buy the inferior car (in sound department as well) for a measley £30k-40k saving

[Chris355]

I don’t disagree. If money were no object I would buy a 488, but the extra 50k (£150k for 458 v £205k for 488) is too big a jump for me.

[RamboLambo]

458 N/a engine sounds so much better than a 488 turbo. In fact I suggest any normally aspirated car sounds better than a turbo and more and more people seem to be feeling the love for the last of the normally aspirated cars just like the current love for manuals.

Maybe a V12 manual is the car to have in the future

[Shazbat]

Naah. 458 sounds fake and contrived. 488 sounds like a real engine.

There's a bit more too it than just 'noise'. Use your ears, and your brain.

[MingtheMerciless]

Everything is subjective of course. And no-one is wrong as this is a personal preference. But it is probably correct to say the 458 isn't as special sounding as some of the earlier cars. And while I do like the sound of the 488, particularly the Spider, it lacks a crucial 1000 rpm where the best of the 458 is to be found. So the 458 wins for me on sound stakes. The 488 is clearly a better car by a margin in a lot of different ways (particularly on track, your gran could do a sub 8 minute 'Ring time in one) but it isn't, for me, better sounding and it doesn't justify the premium in a driving experience way, and I've driven them a lot. So that's why I'm not getting one. That and the money of course. I'm kind of contemplating a move "backwards" to a Scud. Or staying where I am until the next car comes out. Being marooned in a 458 for a couple of years isn't exactly a horrible problem.

[MDL111]

Just bought a 430 Scud and will report on sound once I see it for the first time / hear it - I suspect it will not be as good as the 355 I had, but probably still ok
Drove the FF for 800km today and do think it is a great sounding car (Italy lots of tunnels) , but so heavy ...

Btw I did always think the 430 and 458 series cars generally sound very contrived / shouty from what I heard on the street, but Porsche does not want to sell me a GT3 so .....

Wait for my report when I will try to get a manual transmission into it in say 12 months once I am fed up with not having a clutch ....

[LA458SP]

MDL111 said:

Just bought a 430 Scud and will report on sound once I see it for the first time / hear it - I suspect it will not be as good as the 355 I had, but probably still ok
Drove the FF for 800km today and do think it is a great sounding car (Italy lots of tunnels) , but so heavy ...

Btw I did always think the 430 and 458 series cars generally sound very contrived / shouty from what I heard on the street, but Porsche does not want to sell me a GT3 so .....

Wait for my report when I will try to get a manual transmission into it in say 12 months once I am fed up with not having a clutch ....

A Manual gear box in a Scud, really?

I doubt you'd get bored of the shifts in the Scud though, the gear box is one of the defining parts of that car - just incredible as standard. Incredible sound again in the Scud although I find the valves do not always open as low down as you may want but are very much linked to the throttle pressure lower down in the rev range. The solution is simple: Just thrash it all the time

[MDL111]

LA458SP said:

MDL111 said:

Just bought a 430 Scud and will report on sound once I see it for the first time / hear it - I suspect it will not be as good as the 355 I had, but probably still ok
Drove the FF for 800km today and do think it is a great sounding car (Italy lots of tunnels) , but so heavy ...

Btw I did always think the 430 and 458 series cars generally sound very contrived / shouty from what I heard on the street, but Porsche does not want to sell me a GT3 so .....

Wait for my report when I will try to get a manual transmission into it in say 12 months once I am fed up with not having a clutch ....

A Manual gear box in a Scud, really?

I doubt you'd get bored of the shifts in the Scud though, the gear box is one of the defining parts of that car - just incredible as standard. Incredible sound again in the Scud although I find the valves do not always open as low down as you may want but are very much linked to the throttle pressure lower down in the rev range. The solution is simple: Just thrash it all the time

Yes the gearbox (and the fact I need a mi engined car again) is the reason I bought it - figured that given people rate it very highly, if I don't like this box then all the automated boxes are probably not for me as the double clutch ones don't really do it for me (although in fairness I have only driven the FF one, but somehow doubt faster/more efficient shifts in a newer one will not change my opinion)

Sorry a little off topic

[Durzel]

I've heard early 458s sounded rather differently to later ones, something to do with exhaust changes (obviously). Obviously subjective as said but with the flaps open at full chat... OMG

There is, for me, a weird feeling about turbos.. I loved my R33 & R34 GTRs and never once thought "this could be any engine with stonking great turbos on it", but with the 488.. I dunno... part of me feels like sticking turbos on a Ferrari engine is diminishing the engine somewhat, in the sense that turbos (particularly nowadays) are a shortcut for many manufacturers to improve efficiency, or plug gaps in or otherwise mask an engine's shortcomings, etc.

I wouldn't go as far as to call it cheating, and I'll admit it's not logical when the end product is so accomplished, but there's something about knowing that all of the BHP coming from a 458 engine, or indeed any Ferrari N/A engine, is as a result of pure engineering. With turbos it sortof feels like, well, "any manufacturer could do that", they might even use the same turbos themselves, etc. A Ferrari N/A engine is all Ferrari pedigree.

Anyway that's my stream of consciousness I hope you enjoyed it

Edited by Durzel on Thursday 19th October 11:32

[pocty]

I love my Aston Martin DBS...I love my Porsche 996 GT3 RS...but most of all I love my Ferrari 458.

The noise is unbelievable, the steering, the feel, even the look of the car never fails to put a smile on my face. To be honest before I got one I thought it was a all show no go car because I'd only ever seen them in traffic around the Kings Road. But after 5 mins of driving one I was totally smitten.

Yes the early ones sound louder but to be honest all 458 sound great. I suggest you try one before you cross it off the list.

Cheers
Pocty

[Chris355]

What do people think of the saleability of a low mileage red car that has a limited spec; literally just shields, chromatic mirrors, white stitching and painted callipers. How easy/hard to sell? What kind of price difference to a well specced car?

[pocty]

Chris355 said:

What do people think of the saleability of a low mileage red car that has a limited spec; literally just shields, chromatic mirrors, white stitching and painted callipers. How easy/hard to sell? What kind of price difference to a well specced car?

Hi Chris, 458s are like gunslingers in a western, what I mean is that there will always be a better faster one with a better spec. :-) Just jump in as a basic 458 has everything you'll ever need.

In time you could always add a bit of carbon here or there. It's all about getting the right car.

Cheers
Pocty

[_Leg_]

Durzel said:

I've heard early 458s sounded rather differently to later ones, something to do with exhaust changes (obviously). Obviously subjective as said but with the flaps open at full chat... OMG

Edited by Durzel on Thursday 19th October 11:32

Indeed. Video below of my '14 458 Spider on one of it's many jaunts round Europe that she and I have been on over the last 3 years.

Part 1 of 3 videos of an evening blat up the Brenner and Jaufenpasses (two of my favourites if taken in an evening or at night). I'm not really sure what anyone wants a car to sound like if they don't like the sound this makes?

I will never, ever part with it. It's just, well, enough and we've been to many places and had a great deal of fun together. I would rather sell Mrs Leg (any takers?).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFIDRUOv7AA

[MDL111]

So picked up the Scud today and just got back

Initial impression after c 650km Autobahn - no country roads yet. Gearbox seems more fun than in the FF, clutch worries me as spent an hour in proper stop and go traffic and it smelled rather unhappy towards the end (even with trying to leave gaps/coasting in neutral whenever possible).
I find it a bit annoying that the shifting LEDs are not deactivated in 6th gear - gets a bit annoying at night when you constantly have bright red lights in your eyes. It is loud inside and it does feel quite special
They also had an unregistered Speciale .... for 398k - punchy but supposedly the only one in Europe (unregistered that is). 220km on the clock (Hannover Ferrari in case anyone is interested)
Some insane person overtook me in a Bentley mulsanne in a corner.... while I was doing 250 and thought that's not unaggressive .... if he crashes that car probably keeps rolling into the next country

[MDL111]

Durzel said:

IME there's next to no discount from main dealers on used approved cars. They are very clued up on what they can get for them.

I got 2.9k off - no more, even with winter approaching and high mileage car - and I think they had it for ages as I think I saw it already 9 months ago

[isaldiri]

MDL111 said:

So picked up the Scud today and just got back

clutch worries me as spent an hour in proper stop and go traffic and it smelled rather unhappy towards the end (even with trying to leave gaps/coasting in neutral whenever possible).

Just wait till you try parking in a tight-ish space

congrats btw, the scuderia is a great car.

[MDL111]

isaldiri said:

MDL111 said:

So picked up the Scud today and just got back

clutch worries me as spent an hour in proper stop and go traffic and it smelled rather unhappy towards the end (even with trying to leave gaps/coasting in neutral whenever possible).

Just wait till you try parking in a tight-ish space

congrats btw, the scuderia is a great car.

Yes indeed - my building has an elevator to get the cars down and then rather tight spaces .... - does sound great though in an enclosed 7x2.5m box

Thank you - it certainly left a good first impression