Every day tips for living with a 599
Discussion
The build has not completely stopped.
Customs finally released the exhaust and it has arrived at MDL
For that pure F1 sound I really wanted Fiammenghi 6-1 headers but due to heat management concerns I chose Kline 6-2-1 with full heat shielding. These have the 200 cel race cats and they are positioned where the main (second cats in the system) would be. From an earlier post you'll know that there was so much heat that the engine bay heat shields had been burnt and damaged. Still waiting for Funk Motorsports to deliver the repaired engine bay heat shields.
Customs finally released the exhaust and it has arrived at MDL
For that pure F1 sound I really wanted Fiammenghi 6-1 headers but due to heat management concerns I chose Kline 6-2-1 with full heat shielding. These have the 200 cel race cats and they are positioned where the main (second cats in the system) would be. From an earlier post you'll know that there was so much heat that the engine bay heat shields had been burnt and damaged. Still waiting for Funk Motorsports to deliver the repaired engine bay heat shields.
Funk Motorsports have delivered the repaired engine bay heat shields. Unfortunately I think there's been a slight misunderstanding with what I exactly wanted but it should work. I've ordered some gold heat shield tape from Funk and Lee will cover the damaged sections.
Engine side of the heat shield, you can see the damage where the 'black' has been burnt away to reveal the fibreglass.
Close up of damaged section that wasn't covered
Additional funk heat shield added to the bulkhead side of the heat shield.
With what Funk have done, this should provide much improvement in cabin insulation. After Lee has added the Funk gold tape to the burnt / damaged sections, this should protect the 'backing' from further damage.
The Kline exhaust is also insulated and the cats are moved out of the engine bay, so this should also massively reduce engine bay temperature, providing further protection.
Reusing the Ferrari 'backing plate' will hopefully mean that everything mounts straight up, maybe some spacers will be required as the funk heat shield is between the bulkhead and the backing plate.
Engine side of the heat shield, you can see the damage where the 'black' has been burnt away to reveal the fibreglass.
Close up of damaged section that wasn't covered
Additional funk heat shield added to the bulkhead side of the heat shield.
With what Funk have done, this should provide much improvement in cabin insulation. After Lee has added the Funk gold tape to the burnt / damaged sections, this should protect the 'backing' from further damage.
The Kline exhaust is also insulated and the cats are moved out of the engine bay, so this should also massively reduce engine bay temperature, providing further protection.
Reusing the Ferrari 'backing plate' will hopefully mean that everything mounts straight up, maybe some spacers will be required as the funk heat shield is between the bulkhead and the backing plate.
Things are starting to progress on the engine.
Pistons and rods have been built up and along with the crank and flywheel have been sent for balancing.
While building up the pistons and rods, a little comparison.
The original piston is 432g (including carbon build up)
According to the information I can find on the internet the F140c piston design evolved over the years and later pistons are +/- 15g lighter. Original piston was made by Mahle. Not sure who made the later designs. (Word of caution, Google has occasionally given wrong information and getting this from Ferrari is impossible for me)
Pistons supercede history
The new CP piston is 351g according to the spec sheet.
I wish I could have afforded new CP / Pankl rods https://pankl.com/en/divisions/racing/
but this would have added 10k to the engine rebuild cost.
I probably could have saved a little money and just gone with the original pistons and Total Seal rings.
https://www.totalseal.com/
But the option of going with a newer piston design Vs the time cost to clean up the old ones seems to me to be a better option.
Once the balancing is complete the crank and rods are going to get ISF, isotropic super finished. I wanted to get the cams done as well but there was a concern about removing the variator assembly from the end of the cams and it potentially leaking later (a common issue for Ferrari and Maserati that share this part).
Pistons and rods have been built up and along with the crank and flywheel have been sent for balancing.
While building up the pistons and rods, a little comparison.
The original piston is 432g (including carbon build up)
According to the information I can find on the internet the F140c piston design evolved over the years and later pistons are +/- 15g lighter. Original piston was made by Mahle. Not sure who made the later designs. (Word of caution, Google has occasionally given wrong information and getting this from Ferrari is impossible for me)
Pistons supercede history
The new CP piston is 351g according to the spec sheet.
I wish I could have afforded new CP / Pankl rods https://pankl.com/en/divisions/racing/
but this would have added 10k to the engine rebuild cost.
I probably could have saved a little money and just gone with the original pistons and Total Seal rings.
https://www.totalseal.com/
But the option of going with a newer piston design Vs the time cost to clean up the old ones seems to me to be a better option.
Once the balancing is complete the crank and rods are going to get ISF, isotropic super finished. I wanted to get the cams done as well but there was a concern about removing the variator assembly from the end of the cams and it potentially leaking later (a common issue for Ferrari and Maserati that share this part).
I've also gone crazy obsessed with aero for the 599 
Mike from https://formeon.co.uk/ is coming back to scan the whole car in detail.
1. Exterior
2. Underside
3. Wheels
4. Wheel arch with out wheels
5. Engine bay
6. Novitec parts (unmounted and mounted)
Some of the scans are critical for modelling flow not just around and under the car but through it.
I have commissioned Grant from https://premieraerodynamics.com/ to do a CFD analysis.
Grant will put up a YouTube video of it and we're going to have a few parts to the video.
Part 1. Standard car.
Part 2. Suggested ways to improve the car, no crazy time attack stuff. Test the Novitec parts.
> 1. Front splitter
> 2. Front splitter diffuser (into the wheel well)
> 3. Front bumper air curtains / fences
> 4. Front wheel arch vents
> 5. Side skirts
> 6. Rear wheel aero disks
> 7. Rear wheel arch / bumper vents / fences
> 8. Rear diffuser
> 9. Rear boot lip spoiler / duck tail
> 10. Other recommendations
Part 3. Édouard is going to take these purely functional designs and shape them into something beautiful and cohesive.
We'll then test Édouard's design in CFD
I've realised that just adding a duck tail may spoil the aerodynamics as a 'system'.
Ferrari did an XX aero kit for GTO owners. And this is part of the 'mood board' I sent to Édouard.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CsbvGvBNnsJ/?img_index...
Let's see
Mike from https://formeon.co.uk/ is coming back to scan the whole car in detail.
1. Exterior
2. Underside
3. Wheels
4. Wheel arch with out wheels
5. Engine bay
6. Novitec parts (unmounted and mounted)
Some of the scans are critical for modelling flow not just around and under the car but through it.
I have commissioned Grant from https://premieraerodynamics.com/ to do a CFD analysis.
Grant will put up a YouTube video of it and we're going to have a few parts to the video.
Part 1. Standard car.
Part 2. Suggested ways to improve the car, no crazy time attack stuff. Test the Novitec parts.
> 1. Front splitter
> 2. Front splitter diffuser (into the wheel well)
> 3. Front bumper air curtains / fences
> 4. Front wheel arch vents
> 5. Side skirts
> 6. Rear wheel aero disks
> 7. Rear wheel arch / bumper vents / fences
> 8. Rear diffuser
> 9. Rear boot lip spoiler / duck tail
> 10. Other recommendations
Part 3. Édouard is going to take these purely functional designs and shape them into something beautiful and cohesive.
We'll then test Édouard's design in CFD
I've realised that just adding a duck tail may spoil the aerodynamics as a 'system'.
Ferrari did an XX aero kit for GTO owners. And this is part of the 'mood board' I sent to Édouard.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CsbvGvBNnsJ/?img_index...
Let's see
I have also been looking again at wheel and tyre options. I really want to run the Trofero RS. I contacted Pirelli who were very quick to respond to my query.
I then contacted Braid about a set of forged magnesium rims built specifically for the Pirelli tyre. 11k. Ouch. But when I think about a set of Ferrari rims maybe it is not so expensive. The individual rim weights came out at:
For a 20" x 9.5 front = 7.7 kg.
For a 21" x 11.5" rear = 9.7 kg
About 1.5 kg less than an equivalent carbon barrel with forged aluminium centre from a different manufacturer.
I've also been thinking about the tyre / rim option I am running, particularly the front, as the rear seems good (width wise)
I can see that Ferrari use a 10" rim for a 275 section front tyre and 11.5" rim for a 315 section rear tyre for the F12 TDF. I have a 285 section on a 9.5" which I believe is correct for 599 GTO. However I don't think I am 'optimising' the front tyre.
A quick conversion:
275 mm = 10.8 inch (Ferrari rim >0.8" for F12 TDF)
315 mm = 12.4 inch (Ferrari rim >0.9" for F12 TDF)
According to the linked table https://www.lvvta.org.nz/documents/infosheets/LVVT...
295/30 tyre = 10" - 11" rim (295mm=11.6")
325/30 tyre = 11" - 12.5" rim (325mm=12.8")
This article suggests that a wider rim is more beneficial.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/wheel-w...
Likely I should be running 10.5" on the front, 12" on the rear and to really take advantage drop to a 19" front and rear. Lee at MDL tried a TDF rim (10") on the front of my car and the inside runs very very close to the body and that was with the suspension unloaded and no tyre fitted. A different offset will be required to make everything work properly with good clearance all around. 19" will just not clear the brakes with the GTO cooling ducts and 20" look nicer too.
Another thing to shelve at the moment.
I then contacted Braid about a set of forged magnesium rims built specifically for the Pirelli tyre. 11k. Ouch. But when I think about a set of Ferrari rims maybe it is not so expensive. The individual rim weights came out at:
For a 20" x 9.5 front = 7.7 kg.
For a 21" x 11.5" rear = 9.7 kg
About 1.5 kg less than an equivalent carbon barrel with forged aluminium centre from a different manufacturer.
I've also been thinking about the tyre / rim option I am running, particularly the front, as the rear seems good (width wise)
I can see that Ferrari use a 10" rim for a 275 section front tyre and 11.5" rim for a 315 section rear tyre for the F12 TDF. I have a 285 section on a 9.5" which I believe is correct for 599 GTO. However I don't think I am 'optimising' the front tyre.
A quick conversion:
275 mm = 10.8 inch (Ferrari rim >0.8" for F12 TDF)
315 mm = 12.4 inch (Ferrari rim >0.9" for F12 TDF)
According to the linked table https://www.lvvta.org.nz/documents/infosheets/LVVT...
295/30 tyre = 10" - 11" rim (295mm=11.6")
325/30 tyre = 11" - 12.5" rim (325mm=12.8")
This article suggests that a wider rim is more beneficial.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/wheel-w...
Likely I should be running 10.5" on the front, 12" on the rear and to really take advantage drop to a 19" front and rear. Lee at MDL tried a TDF rim (10") on the front of my car and the inside runs very very close to the body and that was with the suspension unloaded and no tyre fitted. A different offset will be required to make everything work properly with good clearance all around. 19" will just not clear the brakes with the GTO cooling ducts and 20" look nicer too.
Another thing to shelve at the moment.
Edited by cake eater on Friday 24th April 14:06
ANOpax said:
This makes sense. The 9.5J GTO rim has a 38mm offset. The 9.5J F12 rims you're running have a 48mm offset. The 10J TdF/812 rims that Lee tried also have a 48mm offset.
I'm sure you know this but the MPSS K1 285/30 tyre for the GTO is a shaved down and narrower tyre than the spec would suggest.
MPSS MO1 285/30 7.9mm tread depth, 10" width
MPSS K1 285/30 5.6mm tread depth, 9.5" width
I'm always learning with this car and I didn't know about the change to the GTO front tyreI'm sure you know this but the MPSS K1 285/30 tyre for the GTO is a shaved down and narrower tyre than the spec would suggest.
MPSS MO1 285/30 7.9mm tread depth, 10" width
MPSS K1 285/30 5.6mm tread depth, 9.5" width
Braid said they could model the rim / offset etc and ensure that all is good. Something for later.
PRO5T said:
Sorry for selfishly asking for my own benefit but was there a page in this thread that was pertaining to rebuilding the ceramic brakes? Or was it possibly another thread?
My PCCB's were rebuilt by Rebrake by the previous owner. The car had developed an annoying clicking noise and after tearing down the front brakes today I found the culprit-some of the bobbins were fractionally loose on one disc. I nipped them up and solved the issue but really want to tear them all down and double check but I need to know the correct torque setting (I've heard 10nm is).
Obviously that's Porsche and not Ferrari but I might hazard a guess they're all the same.
There's another thread in this forum from an FF owner. There's loads of interesting nerdy stuff about the mounting bolts. He used 10nm.My PCCB's were rebuilt by Rebrake by the previous owner. The car had developed an annoying clicking noise and after tearing down the front brakes today I found the culprit-some of the bobbins were fractionally loose on one disc. I nipped them up and solved the issue but really want to tear them all down and double check but I need to know the correct torque setting (I've heard 10nm is).
Obviously that's Porsche and not Ferrari but I might hazard a guess they're all the same.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I actually checked with Wolfgang at rebrake very recently and he said 8nm
These bolts are single use only and sourcing the correct ones very difficult. You could try rebrake?
It's really concerning that your bolts have come loose. Thread lock recommended I think.
Watching an RE Performance video today. @16:10 this sentiment struck a cord with me.
https://youtu.be/obojYD6WVHc?si=Rf_9iBduTtFAQgzj
Main dealers have been very varied for me in the UK and it's exactly that, cars of my generation (and older) the technicians that were trained on them and worked on them are no longer in the dealership.
That's not to say the guys in the back aren't great at what they do, it just that old cars aren't what they do.
https://youtu.be/obojYD6WVHc?si=Rf_9iBduTtFAQgzj
Main dealers have been very varied for me in the UK and it's exactly that, cars of my generation (and older) the technicians that were trained on them and worked on them are no longer in the dealership.
That's not to say the guys in the back aren't great at what they do, it just that old cars aren't what they do.
PRO5T said:
Superb Cake!
It may be that I dismantle and completely rebuild with thread lock but now I know the noise I ll at least have a heads up. None had gotten so loose as to fall out, the literally needed a nip.
I just need to make sure I do the right amount of nipping!
Good memory on the thread, yes it was an auction bought FF now you ve reminded me.
You're very welcome It may be that I dismantle and completely rebuild with thread lock but now I know the noise I ll at least have a heads up. None had gotten so loose as to fall out, the literally needed a nip.
I just need to make sure I do the right amount of nipping!
Good memory on the thread, yes it was an auction bought FF now you ve reminded me.
I'm sure you have a thread locking compound in mind. Medium strength, High Temperature. In my industry correct application and make up is safety critical, there are some nerdy how to videos on the internet that show how incorrect application can result in incorrect torque being applied in make up.
Brake failure makes me nervous.
https://next.henkel-adhesives.com/us/en/articles/c...
My choice if you can find it because of the additional temperature resistance
https://www.vibra-tite.com/threadlockers/medium-st...
I'm pretty sure, in normal driving blue loctite will be fine.
Lee built up my rebrake discs to 8 nm without loctite.
Edited by cake eater on Saturday 25th April 13:39
Hughesie said:
The biggest problem with the nuts is the mild steel, they rust from the inside out, as I found out braking into Vale on a slow down lap, a
Lap earlier i was doing a lot more !
Took out my Rear CC Disc, Rear Wheel/Tyre and Calliper.
Made a right old mess and proper pee'd off the Corsa Clienti in the next session which was delayed whilst a million bits of CCD were picked up
Very very scary Lap earlier i was doing a lot more !
Took out my Rear CC Disc, Rear Wheel/Tyre and Calliper.
Made a right old mess and proper pee'd off the Corsa Clienti in the next session which was delayed whilst a million bits of CCD were picked up
DeejRC said:
Chaps, Monkey s old 599 is up for sale that one of the outfits has done what looks to be a half decent manual conversion on. For not too much monies. What do we think?
It was his video of buying a 599 that convinced me to get one.Definitely need to test drive it. See just how well the manual conversion has been done.
Let us know how it goes
Ted Maul said:
Hughesie said:
The biggest problem with the nuts is the mild steel, they rust from the inside out, as I found out braking into Vale on a slow down lap, a
Lap earlier i was doing a lot more !
Took out my Rear CC Disc, Rear Wheel/Tyre and Calliper.
Made a right old mess and proper pee'd off the Corsa Clienti in the next session which was delayed whilst a million bits of CCD were picked up
Are you a member of an FOC WhatsApp group? I think I read about that somewhere, scary stuff. Bet it made a right bang when it went.Lap earlier i was doing a lot more !
Took out my Rear CC Disc, Rear Wheel/Tyre and Calliper.
Made a right old mess and proper pee'd off the Corsa Clienti in the next session which was delayed whilst a million bits of CCD were picked up
https://youtu.be/ZChycU5gobg?si=deI866ifUqcKEKbx
Test Fabric has arrived from https://www.ukhide.co.uk/ who are fabric suppliers to Tillett.
The correct Ferrari colour codes for my car are:
Bordeaux 4481
Nero 8500
Both available from UK Hide. Colour match is okay but there is a little more texture, not the same smooth Nappa of OEM. Will hopefully be okay on the seat and not so noticeable in the car.
I have chosen to have the black section as Dinamica (better wear resistance than alcantara) and will make the seat more grippy.
Mounting of the seats we will have see. I contacted https://www.plantedtechnology.com/ for a subframe as I believe that 430 is the same. We'll see once Lee has taken some measurements and I can get back to Planted.
The correct Ferrari colour codes for my car are:
Bordeaux 4481
Nero 8500
Both available from UK Hide. Colour match is okay but there is a little more texture, not the same smooth Nappa of OEM. Will hopefully be okay on the seat and not so noticeable in the car.
I have chosen to have the black section as Dinamica (better wear resistance than alcantara) and will make the seat more grippy.
Mounting of the seats we will have see. I contacted https://www.plantedtechnology.com/ for a subframe as I believe that 430 is the same. We'll see once Lee has taken some measurements and I can get back to Planted.
DeejRC said:
Do they state full or semi aniline on the sample?
Now that I don't know.This is product link on their website, which states:
https://www.ukhide.co.uk/product/basis-nappa-for-f...
Description
Automotive OEM smooth nappa hide.
Something very surprising arrived at MDL Supercars.
The bevel gear from Ferrari! A minimum of two months before the earliest date given by Ferrari.
I'm glad I don't have to have one made but I am also a little nervous that it's an older production with material hardness issue. I will get all the gears including the bevel gear Isotropic Super Finished, so this should help.
The bevel gear from Ferrari! A minimum of two months before the earliest date given by Ferrari.
I'm glad I don't have to have one made but I am also a little nervous that it's an older production with material hardness issue. I will get all the gears including the bevel gear Isotropic Super Finished, so this should help.
leglessAlex said:
cake eater said:
I'm glad I don't have to have one made but I am also a little nervous that it's an older production with material hardness issue. I will get all the gears including the bevel gear Isotropic Super Finished, so this should help.
Do you already have all the drawings/cad files to make one? I wondering if it's worth taking all the relevant measurements from this brand new one in case you ever have to recreate it in future.Great news it's so ahead of schedule!
It's a good idea to get the new one scanned.
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