308/328 Values

[browngt3]

SFTWend said:

Congratulations. Look forward to hearing all about your purchase.

Did you consider the 1980 GTB in Dorset, which I notice has dropped nearly £10K to £60k and has my attention.

Thanks, yes I considered that car but I didn't get the time to look at it. Could be a buy at that price.

[Slippydiff]

browngt3 said:

Rediscovered an iconic article by an iconic writer. Steve Cropley owned a carb 308 back in the 80's and compares it here with the new 328. Interesting how advanced he finds the 328 with his own car. Much faster, refined, better braked, better built etc. He also estimated his 308 put out around 220hp as opposed to the factory claimed 255hp. So, if the quoted output of a GTBi is 214hp their respective performance should be almost the same. Or is the GTBi even more sluggish??

I remember that issue/article well, back then I was still very wet behind the ears regarding all things Ferrari (but as with most, I was oh so smitten with the looks) but Cropley was right, though I think even the 220hp he credited the carb cars with, may have been generous. This, on the basis that the later QV cars were credited with 240hp, albeit whilst the Bosch injection probably meant the car could meet burgeoning emissions regs, it also meant they were strangled power-wise when compared with what the carburettors fitted to the earlier cars.

By the time the later QV was released, one would like to think the figures quoted were something close to the figure the engines actually produced, rather than some figure plucked out of thin air by the marketing department ...

But to answer your question, the GTBi is definitely considered the runt of the litter power-wise, and in reality probably produced 190hp on a very good day ... but as you'll be all too aware, the 308 cars aren't all about power, speed and ultimate grip, they're about old-school engagement, tactility and feedback, and thus are better suited to today's roads than any modern Porsche.

[cgt2]

I've spent a lot of time driving both carb 308 and 328 back to back (I even had both parked next to each other for a time in my garage).

The 308 is slower but far more fun to drive and feels faster. Low budget interior has it's own charming quirks such as the dials next to the door jamb.

The 328 does a great job of being just on the edge of classic and modern.

Seats in the 328 were noticeably higher which made it a less optimal driving position, you sit 'in' the 308, more 'on' the 328.

Both wonderful cars and a completely different experience to anything modern.

[browngt3]

So, finally, I have my gorgeous, long awaited 308GTB QV. How long a wait? Probably more than 40 years! In fact ever since I first set eyes on a red 308 from the back seat of my Dad's BMW 2002tii. So why has it taken so long? One word really - Porsches. I actually nearly bought a QV some years back but bought a Carrera 3.2 instead, which I still have.

So, as a serial Porsche owner here are my impressions of the Ferrari.

I bought it from Rardley Motors back in January and I have to say Mike Wheeler was great, giving me all the time I wanted checking the car over. After reaching a deal we agreed the car would be serviced including cambelts and anything else that needed doing. They kept me informed via WhatsApp updates throughout the service which was certainly interesting as well as building confidence in the work actually being carried out.

Once the car was finished I planned to wait for a nice day and travel up from Cornwall to collect it. Looking forward to a memorable drive home my best laid plans didn't happen. As we all know, we had day after day of rain and then CV19 hit us. What to do? I decided to have the 308 delivered using the services of the excellent Indigo Blue. Though I was robbed of my drive home there's nothing quite like having a lorry turn up with your newly purchased Ferrari inside! After observing social distancing the QV was duly installed in my garage next to the Carrera. Just one year separating the birth of the two rivals.

So what are my impressions of my first Ferrari? In a word, Fantastic! The 308, to my eyes, is one of the most beautiful car designs ever. A true masterpiece by the great Leonardo Fioravanti, designer of so many Pininfarina icons. But she's not just a pretty face. To drive there is charm and charisma in spades. Compared to just about anything modern the 308 is just so engaging. Coming from 911s, steering feel is a big thing for me. Here, the Ferrari doesn't disappoint and I would say is probably as good as the old Carrera. Which is high praise indeed. You do need to spend some time warming up. In fact I love the theatre of starting up and the wait before we can get going. The main reason for this is the gearbox. It's very notchy and reluctant when cold with second gear failing to engage at all. However after a few miles the gear change is transformed into a beautifully tactile open-gated pleasure. Clutch action is smooth but not too light. Although a lot lighter than the earlier carb model I drove. Brakes, however are a little disappointing. Porsche have always been the bench mark and here the 308 must give best.

In the post above, Slippydiff mentions the performance of the respective variants. This is something which of course I was keen to find out without the limitations of a dealer test-drive. I'm pleased to say it came as a relief to find out the QV is just as quick as the Carrera. Oddly it doesn't FEEL as quick but this is down to the Porsche being more torquey and I guess having a narrower rev range. The Ferrari revs to 7700 which in the mid 1980's must have seemed stratospheric.

On a twisty road there is a lovely mid-engined fluidity to the handling. Add to that a very compliant ride, feelsome direct steering and the 308 is pure classic joy. The beauty of these classic junior league supercars is you don't need to be doing crazy licence losing speeds to enjoy them. You really do have to drive them. There's no ugly distracting TV screens on the dash. You're not insulated from the performance by sheer technology driven competence. Actually they are the perfect antidote to what has been lost with many modern performance cars.

So it's only been 2 weeks and we are very much in the getting to know you stage. This Corona thing really is not helping and I guess we all have bigger things concerning us now. However, I did manage to enjoy the weekend prior to lockdown. For now, the Ferrari is confined to the garage as the beautiful work if art she is, just to be looked at from time to time. As Car magazine observed back in the day - 'Doyen of exotic car shapes'!

[cgt2]

Great write up. Reminds me of the time I drove a 348 Spider back from Rardley in heavy snow. An interesting exercise in throttle control back in those days of no traction control.

I never had the second gear issue in my 1979 308 after putting Redline gear oil in, it was smooth from cold though obviously came more alive after 15 minutes.

[Jex]

Thanks Browngt3. It reminds me of when I collected my 328 GTS 8 years ago now. I picked it up in Bath and drove home to Cambridge across the Cotswolds with the roof off one spring day. I will never forget that drive. Although it isn't particularly powerful, I recall somewhere near Northampton pulling out of a roundabout on a dual carriageway with a Mercedes outside me. I put my foot down and when I reached 70 looked over my shoulder for the Merc only to find I needed to look in my rearview mirror. The other memorable, but embarrassing moment was near Stow-on-the-Wold. I put the handbrake on at traffic lights and when the lights changed to green, I couldn't get the handbrake off until after the lights had gone red again - as had I. The person behind was very patient , but I can only imagine what he thought. I did consider getting a 308; there are some aspects of the design that I like over the 308, but I wanted ABS having once had an accident that I wouldn't have had if I had had ABS.

I was due to take it for an MoT test and service on 1 April, but that didn't happen. Hopefully this won't last forever and I can start using it again; for various reasons I didn't get to use it much last year. The photo shows it at Goodwood a few years ago.

I hope you enjoy yours - they are lovely cars and at least you won't have to say to people as I do: No it isn't the Magnum one - that was the one before.

[browngt3]

Thanks Jex! Yes, one or two Magnum comments. But it does reveal a certain age! As mine is a GTB I can at least dismiss them slightly, lol! I watched Beverly Hills Cop 2 again recently. I noticed they used an early 308, a QV and incredibly a 328. All masquerading as the same car! Of course, only eagle eyed enthusiasts like us would notice

[browngt3]

Nice picture too, what are they like on track?

Not sure about the TRX tyres on mine as possibly quite aged. Can't seem to find the mfr date on them..

[Jex]

browngt3 said:

Thanks Jex! Yes, one or two Magnum comments. But it does reveal a certain age! As mine is a GTB I can at least dismiss them slightly, lol! I watched Beverly Hills Cop 2 again recently. I noticed they used an early 308, a QV and incredibly a 328. All masquerading as the same car! Of course, only eagle eyed enthusiasts like us would notice

I didn't know they ever used a 328!

[Jex]

browngt3 said:

Nice picture too, what are they like on track?

Not sure about the TRX tyres on mine as possibly quite aged. Can't seem to find the mfr date on them..

On my second visit to Goodwood, I was catching a 458 through the corners, but I later spoke to the driver of the 458 and it was his first time at Goodwood and he had only just got the 458. Nevertheless, my experience in general is that I could keep up with most things in the corners. I got up to 120 on Lavant Straight. On one occasion I went out in front of a 458 Speciale. He overtook me after the first corner and then overtook me again within the 10 minute session! On another occasion I went out behind a 360 when the driver was taking his wife around the circuit. I heard her say: "Don't go too fast - we have two children". He was getting away from me on the straights but I was catching him in the corners, so he sportingly let me through! Great fun.
.

[johnnyreggae]

browngt3 said:

possibly quite aged. Can't seem to find the mfr date on them..

Look for the line that reads something like DOT ???? ??? X 151 nearer the wheel than the tread - the date code is the last 3 or 4 digits: week year

[POORCARDEALER]

my 328 that I had was heavy round town but better the faster you drove it.....mine was a GTB and a bit short on headroom....was super reliable

[ras62]

Enjoyed reading that Tony, sounds like you will have a lot of happy miles in her. Talking to my Ferrari knowledge he suggests your car will have the metric rims with having the TRX tyres. They are not always easy to get and expensive, probably £400 a corner to replace. He said buying the 16 reps from someone like superformance and using more modern 16 inch tyres is a cheaper and better option. The later QV cars came on 16 wheels so still looks standard. Rob

[cgt2]

ras62 said:

Enjoyed reading that Tony, sounds like you will have a lot of happy miles in her. Talking to my Ferrari knowledge he suggests your car will have the metric rims with having the TRX tyres. They are not always easy to get and expensive, probably £400 a corner to replace. He said buying the 16 reps from someone like superformance and using more modern 16 inch tyres is a cheaper and better option. The later QV cars came on 16 wheels so still looks standard. Rob

I did this on mine and the 16"s also gave a vast improvement in handling as I felt far more comfortable pushing on in corners, allowing you to explore the lovely handling balance.

[browngt3]

Jex said:

I didn't know they ever used a 328!

It was a brief appearance. Maybe it was the only Ferrari available for that day's filming from the car rental firm...

[browngt3]

Jex said:

On my second visit to Goodwood, I was catching a 458 through the corners, but I later spoke to the driver of the 458 and it was his first time at Goodwood and he had only just got the 458. Nevertheless, my experience in general is that I could keep up with most things in the corners. I got up to 120 on Lavant Straight. On one occasion I went out in front of a 458 Speciale. He overtook me after the first corner and then overtook me again within the 10 minute session! On another occasion I went out behind a 360 when the driver was taking his wife around the circuit. I heard her say: "Don't go too fast - we have two children". He was getting away from me on the straights but I was catching him in the corners, so he sportingly let me through! Great fun.
.

It's always amazing the huge gap in track performance between the fastest cars of the past and the modern stuff. I have a GT3 which I intended to track this year, not sure I'm brave enough to track the 308 just yet. Will we be doing any track days at all this year I wonder?

[browngt3]

johnnyreggae said:

browngt3 said:

possibly quite aged. Can't seem to find the mfr date on them..

Look for the line that reads something like DOT ???? ??? X 151 nearer the wheel than the tread - the date code is the last 3 or 4 digits: week year

The rears don't show the DOT but have 88W E2 025508. There's also tiny figures near the rim 06-88-01. The fronts also have the 06-88-01 but do have the DOT. One says A5T X 1305. The other A5T X 423.

Either way it would seem they are very old tyres even though they look brand new

[browngt3]

ras62 said:

Enjoyed reading that Tony, sounds like you will have a lot of happy miles in her. Talking to my Ferrari knowledge he suggests your car will have the metric rims with having the TRX tyres. They are not always easy to get and expensive, probably £400 a corner to replace. He said buying the 16 reps from someone like superformance and using more modern 16 inch tyres is a cheaper and better option. The later QV cars came on 16 wheels so still looks standard. Rob

Thanks Rob. Trust you're keeping well in these strange times. How's the 964? I'm considering a new set of 16 inch rims because, as you say, £400 a tyre is a bit excessive.

[browngt3]

cgt2 said:

I did this on mine and the 16"s also gave a vast improvement in handling as I felt far more comfortable pushing on in corners, allowing you to explore the lovely handling balance.

Which tyres did you go for or recommend?

[cgt2]

browngt3 said:

Which tyres did you go for or recommend?

I fitted Toyo Proxes. It handled beautifully on them.

BTW your date codes suggest 2008.

You won't believe the difference new tyres will make, upgrade to 16's or not but I would do it. The car will be transformed and you will enjoy it much more. Similarly mine was on very old tyres when I bought it.

Edited by cgt2 on Tuesday 7th April 21:18