The Reality of Driving a Countach

The Reality of Driving a Countach

Author
Discussion

carspath

Original Poster:

834 posts

177 months

Monday 24th May 2021
quotequote all
Almost exactly 20 years ago , my first act after buying Chassis JLA 12399 ( an 88 1/2 5000 QV ) from HR Owen , the UK's then sole official Lamborghini concessionaire , was to ring Mike Pullen and ask him to service the car . For those who might not know , Mike Pullen has serviced Countachs for over 40 years now , and at some point in time has probably looked after just about every Countach in southern England .

Mike has looked after 12399 ever since , and a couple of weeks ago the car was transported up to Haywards Heath for an inspection and treatment session by its longstanding physician . Fortunately little more was needed other than a routine major service : the exhaust back box needed some welding , a clutch hose needed replacement , and we decided that all four brake calipers needed refurbishment .

The car was also running its original , Sant' Agata fitted rear brake pads ( 12399 is also on its original factory clutch ) - so we decided that after 33 years and 34,000 kilometres the time had come to replace them . More about the Countach's aerodynamics later , which partly explains the longevity of the brake pads .

For a multitude of reasons I hadn't driven the car for ages , and I was also missing it ( the service work was done very quickly , but the brake calipers had to be sent off , and there was a long delay before the calipers were sent back to Mike ) after its 2 1/2 week spring holiday chez Pullen , so immediately upon getting the call that 12399 was ready to be collected , I ignored the weather forecast and decided to pick it up myself .

Despite having had the car for over 20 years , and despite having driven it for almost 20,000 kilometres , it was absolutely not the case of jumping back onto the bicycle and gaily wheeling off into the distance . I drove up in my wife's elderly Mercedes CLS , and the contrast between the CLS and the Countach was total . And hence this thread - some owners might recognise a few things , and some enthusiasts might find what follows of interest .

As it was a Saturday , I picked the car up from Mike's home rather than from his garage . As usual Mike had performed his magic , and the car started immediately after the usual ritual - it was cold and raining , so 3 dabs of the accelerator pedal , clutch pedal in , turn the ignition key , and pray .
A slightly different procedure is needed if the car hasn't been started for more than a day , and yet another procedure if the engine is still warm .

12399 is of Mediterranean extraction and abhors the cold . Mike's driveway climbs fairly steeply upwards before intersecting with a very busy but narrow road . Which I had to cross ! Not an auspicious start to a four hour , 160 mile journey , when it is pelting down with rain - especially on a busy Saturday morning . To execute the move onto the opposite side of the narrow road without kerbing the nearside front OZ wheel demanded a 3 point turn .

2nd gear is out of bounds until the transmission oil is warm , so it was a case of using 1st gear and then short-shifting to 3rd . To give you an idea , max speeds in each of the 5 forwards gears are respectively: 60 mph ; 80 mph : 120 : 150 : 178 - or so Sant' Agata says .

To keep up with the Saturday supermarket crowd meant a hooligan like high rev scream in 1st gear , OR a bucking bronco ride in 3rd . Unwanted attention OR shaken and stirred - the driver's choice . What was definitely not yet on the menu was 2nd gear .

The Countach really , really dislikes low revs and low speeds . The drive up in the CLS was so effortless . In contrast the drive back home in the Countach was so full of effort .
One example - the car has no intermittent wiper setting ( cf the CLS with its rain detector facility !! ) , so each time the windscreen got sufficiently speckled to impede vision , you had to take your left hand off the steering wheel and depress the wiper stalk .
And with the huge windscreen set at 21 degrees to the horizontal , the pantograph wipers did an excellent job of clearing the vast majority of the screen but not the peripheral edges - which is unhelpful when there are pedestrians whom you don't want to run down in case they dent the Countach's delicate 1 mm aluminium bodywork .

The Countach's Bizzarrini V12 engine and its 5-speed gearbox carry vast volumes of their respective lubricant , so it takes forever , and many miles , before these fluids warm up , and before 2nd gear can be safely employed .

And right-hand drive Countach's accelerator cables have to negotiate a more convoluted path back to the engine bay than their left-hand drive counterparts , so there is an initial dead spot ( however well lubricated the cable is ) to the accelerator pedal which makes smooth and precise modulation difficult .

But once the car is fully warmed up , and once you have open roads , the Countach transforms from a recalcitrant brat to a thing of joy . This is such an imperfect car - it was imperfect in 1973 , and it is even more imperfect in traffic dense and speed cameras saturated 2021 . It needs wide , clear , unrestricted roads . Anything less and it is a minor nightmare .

It thrives on high revs and even more on high speeds - no , the two are not exactly synonymous .

It is not a car that anyone half sensible would choose to take to the supermarket -- why would you use a jewel encrusted microscalpel for a job that requires a bone-saw .

It was a good hour before I again felt really comfortable driving my old playmate -- so how could anyone reasonably ask a journalist to make a fair assessment of this very atypical car after just a brief half day acquaintance ?

I could go on and on , but what struck me most were the following points :

1) I would never choose to drive a Countach ( or for that matter any car ) for pleasure without first selecting the most quiet time of day and route . On this occasion i broke this cardinal rule , and the drive was hugely less pleasurable than it could have been . On a couple of very , very brief occasions the Countach had the opportunity of showing its mettle - and Wow , simply Wow .

2) This grande dame can still really pick up her skirts and move -- when given the opportunity to do so .

3 ) She is a demanding lover - The Countach wants constant attention at low speed ( to drive it smoothly , and without it screaming like a banshee at 10 mph ) , and it needs total commitment when at the other end of its performance spectrum .

4) The Countach receives so much unjustified criticism for the weight of its steering , clutch pedal , and gear-change . Once moving beyond 5 mph, and especially once the Countach's engine and road speeds are at respectable levels consistent with its 1971 design brief ( the '' ultimate macchina sportive stradale '' ) these barbs carry absolutely no substance . All 3 controls have a delicious mechanical heft , and there is a consistency of effort shared by all 3 controls .

The most pressing limitations to the Countach as a driving tool are its poor outwards visibility and its width .

5) The car's aerodynamics are dire . My wife who was following in the CLS said that for sometime she thought that the Countach's brake lights had failed because she didn't see them light up . In fact all I had to do was employ a modicum of anticipation , and lift off the accelerator pedal , and the car would slow down or come to a stop . The brake pedal is almost redundant - even in heavy traffic . A Cd of 0.42 coupled with a large frontal surface area explains a lot .

6) Driving this old car , with due respect to its age , but also without ignoring its performance potential , is literally life-affirming . I failed it on this occasion by driving it in less than ideal conditions , but in doing so I re-learnt the need to pre-select the timing and route of each drive carefully . The Countach deserves this minimum respect . It remains a very special car to drive , and a very precious ( from a historical perspective ) piece of automotive art .

Edited by carspath on Monday 24th May 18:07

Scrump

21,975 posts

158 months

Monday 24th May 2021
quotequote all
Thanks for taking the time to write that.
I have never driven a Countach or even been a passenger in one, so great to read about the experience.
I can’t believe that it has poor aerodynamics, the one in the poster on my childhood bedroom wall looked like a spaceship!

carspath

Original Poster:

834 posts

177 months

Monday 24th May 2021
quotequote all
Hi Scrump ,
Thanks for replying .
I've just written a book on the Countach and in that I have compiled a list of Cd figures for all its contemporaries , and for the saloon and supercars that pre and post dated the Countach .
The 0.42 figure stands out as being awful even within that list .
And bear in mind that this 0.42 figure was taken from a scale model of the LP500 prototype which was the sleekest of all the Countachs - so the production Countachs almost certainly had a much poorer real-life Cd than even 0.42 !

And in period ( although not compared to today's supercars ) the Countach had a gigantic frontal area , so its CdA was really bad too .

Aerodynamics was the Countach's Achilles heel , and I have devoted a chapter to this topic because it was a major reason why Dallara and Alfieri had to keep refining and updating Stanzani's work just to keep up with the competition .

Gandini's bodywork was a masterwork of haute couture , but it was not aerodynamically efficient .

AinsleyB

246 posts

81 months

Monday 24th May 2021
quotequote all
Brilliant write up. You would never ever get a new car that demanded so much yet gave so much.

r o n n i e

365 posts

176 months

Monday 24th May 2021
quotequote all
Really great write up. Thanks for taking the time to write up.

Ferruccio

1,835 posts

119 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
I love my Countach. It’s alive. It’s the car I’d get buried in.

Indeed I love all the old Lambos.

But, somewhat to my surprise, my acquisition of an AV SV last year has changed my view.
It is an amazing thing. A tour de force. Brutal.
The performance staggering even vs my Murcielago.

I now understand why many people go for the latest.

Kyodo

728 posts

124 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
A very interesting write-up of everyone's fave poster car. To a lesser degree, my lasting impression of our (now gone) Modena is the way it transformed from a noisy rattly nail to a supreme opera singer once properly warmed up. I've never had a car like it, I can absolutely believe the Countach is that, then some!

Edited by Kyodo on Tuesday 25th May 10:15

jodypress

1,928 posts

274 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Great write up and very evocative of such an amazing icon.

Any chance of some pictures?

Ferruccio

1,835 posts

119 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all

irish boy

3,533 posts

236 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Great thread thanks for taking the time to post.

Bob the Cop

188 posts

84 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Hi Path, I enjoyed the write up on your recent Countach drive. It brought back memories of bringing back cars from the factory in all types of weather, including snow! Driving a Countach in pouring rain would not be at the top of my list of enjoyable experiences.

I have mentioned this to you before. After this photograph was taken I was pleased to be driving off in the Espada and not the Countach. I still believe that it is a masterpiece of design but boy you have to be at 10/10 to drive this car. My favourite drive from the factory was the Jarama ELB420J now owned by Andy, followed by Walter Wolf's Miura from Switzerland to the factory.

As much as I love the Countach It would not be my first choice of a classic Lamborghini to own. There again I could not afford to own one ! I am just glad that people like you are keeping them going for others to appreciate

.

P5BNij

15,875 posts

106 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Great write up carspath, highly evocative for those of us who've never had the experience! beer

Is the book completely finished now and is there a release date...?


456mgt

2,504 posts

266 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Enjoyed that, and it underlines that even with something familiar you still have to recalibrate yourself if you haven't driven it for a while. I do think though that the challenge you were experiencing could easily apply to other supercars as well. Several cars would be a nightmare to make an uphill entry onto the other side of a heavily trafficked road, or hate stop start progress. If anything it underlines the decision to base yourself in the countryside and get your car back on a transporter. Several years ago now, I drove my 456 down for a service at Joe Macari's in Wandsworth, and even though it was a bright sunny day, it was a nightmare of stop start traffic, buses, taxis and cyclists. It's the only time I ever did it, and it came back on a transporter. These cars are joyful things, but you do need to choose your moments.

rat rod

4,997 posts

65 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
carspath said:
Almost exactly 20 years ago , my first act after buying Chassis JLA 12399 ( an 88 1/2 5000 QV ) from HR Owen , the UK's then sole official Lamborghini concessionaire , was to ring Mike Pullen and ask him to service the car . For those who might not know , Mike Pullen has serviced Countachs for over 40 years now , and at some point in time has probably looked after just about every Countach in southern England .

Mike has looked after 12399 ever since , and a couple of weeks ago the car was transported up to Haywards Heath for an inspection and treatment session by its longstanding physician . Fortunately little more was needed other than a routine major service : the exhaust back box needed some welding , a clutch hose needed replacement , and we decided that all four brake calipers needed refurbishment .

The car was also running its original , Sant' Agata fitted rear brake pads ( 12399 is also on its original factory clutch ) - so we decided that after 33 years and 34,000 kilometres the time had come to replace them . More about the Countach's aerodynamics later , which partly explains the longevity of the brake pads .

For a multitude of reasons I hadn't driven the car for ages , and I was also missing it ( the service work was done very quickly , but the brake calipers had to be sent off , and there was a long delay before the calipers were sent back to Mike ) after its 2 1/2 week spring holiday chez Pullen , so immediately upon getting the call that 12399 was ready to be collected , I ignored the weather forecast and decided to pick it up myself .

Despite having had the car for over 20 years , and despite having driven it for almost 20,000 kilometres , it was absolutely not the case of jumping back onto the bicycle and gaily wheeling off into the distance . I drove up in my wife's elderly Mercedes CLS , and the contrast between the CLS and the Countach was total . And hence this thread - some owners might recognise a few things , and some enthusiasts might find what follows of interest .

As it was a Saturday , I picked the car up from Mike's home rather than from his garage . As usual Mike had performed his magic , and the car started immediately after the usual ritual - it was cold and raining , so 3 dabs of the accelerator pedal , clutch pedal in , turn the ignition key , and pray .
A slightly different procedure is needed if the car hasn't been started for more than a day , and yet another procedure if the engine is still warm .

12399 is of Mediterranean extraction and abhors the cold . Mike's driveway climbs fairly steeply upwards before intersecting with a very busy but narrow road . Which I had to cross ! Not an auspicious start to a four hour , 160 mile journey , when it is pelting down with rain - especially on a busy Saturday morning . To execute the move onto the opposite side of the narrow road without kerbing the nearside front OZ wheel demanded a 3 point turn .

2nd gear is out of bounds until the transmission oil is warm , so it was a case of using 1st gear and then short-shifting to 3rd . To give you an idea , max speeds in each of the 5 forwards gears are respectively: 60 mph ; 80 mph : 120 : 150 : 178 - or so Sant' Agata says .

To keep up with the Saturday supermarket crowd meant a hooligan like high rev scream in 1st gear , OR a bucking bronco ride in 3rd . Unwanted attention OR shaken and stirred - the driver's choice . What was definitely not yet on the menu was 2nd gear .

The Countach really , really dislikes low revs and low speeds . The drive up in the CLS was so effortless . In contrast the drive back home in the Countach was so full of effort .
One example - the car has no intermittent wiper setting ( cf the CLS with its rain detector facility !! ) , so each time the windscreen got sufficiently speckled to impede vision , you had to take your left hand off the steering wheel and depress the wiper stalk .
And with the huge windscreen set at 21 degrees to the horizontal , the pantograph wipers did an excellent job of clearing the vast majority of the screen but not the peripheral edges - which is unhelpful when there are pedestrians whom you don't want to run down in case they dent the Countach's delicate 1 mm aluminium bodywork .

The Countach's Bizzarrini V12 engine and its 5-speed gearbox carry vast volumes of their respective lubricant , so it takes forever , and many miles , before these fluids warm up , and before 2nd gear can be safely employed .

And right-hand drive Countach's accelerator cables have to negotiate a more convoluted path back to the engine bay than their left-hand drive counterparts , so there is an initial dead spot ( however well lubricated the cable is ) to the accelerator pedal which makes smooth and precise modulation difficult .

But once the car is fully warmed up , and once you have open roads , the Countach transforms from a recalcitrant brat to a thing of joy . This is such an imperfect car - it was imperfect in 1973 , and it is even more imperfect in traffic dense and speed cameras saturated 2021 . It needs wide , clear , unrestricted roads . Anything less and it is a minor nightmare .

It thrives on high revs and even more on high speeds - no , the two are not exactly synonymous .

It is not a car that anyone half sensible would choose to take to the supermarket -- why would you use a jewel encrusted microscalpel for a job that requires a bone-saw .

It was a good hour before I again felt really comfortable driving my old playmate -- so how could anyone reasonably ask a journalist to make a fair assessment of this very atypical car after just a brief half day acquaintance ?

I could go on and on , but what struck me most were the following points :

1) I would never choose to drive a Countach ( or for that matter any car ) for pleasure without first selecting the most quiet time of day and route . On this occasion i broke this cardinal rule , and the drive was hugely less pleasurable than it could have been . On a couple of very , very brief occasions the Countach had the opportunity of showing its mettle - and Wow , simply Wow .

2) This grande dame can still really pick up her skirts and move -- when given the opportunity to do so .

3 ) She is a demanding lover - The Countach wants constant attention at low speed ( to drive it smoothly , and without it screaming like a banshee at 10 mph ) , and it needs total commitment when at the other end of its performance spectrum .

4) The Countach receives so much unjustified criticism for the weight of its steering , clutch pedal , and gear-change . Once moving beyond 5 mph, and especially once the Countach's engine and road speeds are at respectable levels consistent with its 1971 design brief ( the '' ultimate macchina sportive stradale '' ) these barbs carry absolutely no substance . All 3 controls have a delicious mechanical heft , and there is a consistency of effort shared by all 3 controls .

The most pressing limitations to the Countach as a driving tool are its poor outwards visibility and its width .

5) The car's aerodynamics are dire . My wife who was following in the CLS said that for sometime she thought that the Countach's brake lights had failed because she didn't see them light up . In fact all I had to do was employ a modicum of anticipation , and lift off the accelerator pedal , and the car would slow down or come to a stop . The brake pedal is almost redundant - even in heavy traffic . A Cd of 0.42 coupled with a large frontal surface area explains a lot .

6) Driving this old car , with due respect to its age , but also without ignoring its performance potential , is literally life-affirming . I failed it on this occasion by driving it in less than ideal conditions , but in doing so I re-learnt the need to pre-select the timing and route of each drive carefully . The Countach deserves this minimum respect . It remains a very special car to drive , and a very precious ( from a historical perspective ) piece of automotive art .

Edited by carspath on Monday 24th May 18:07
Mikes driveway isn't the easiest to get out of at the best of times in something normal so reading your

experiences reminded me when i collected my 400 S in the depths of winter,having arrived at Mikes house later than

planned after being held up by a serious accident on route, Already regretting Mikes offer of getting the car transported back home

we arrived with very little light left, By the time we had a cuppa and looked round his beautiful collection of cars

and bikes it was pitch black added to which we failed to notice the heavy drizzle outside , Think you had trouble getting out of the

driveway , try doing it on a dark wet night right in the middle of rush hour not helped by the windows steaming up within seconds.

Got close to changing my mind and reversing back to the house but now with rear visibility none existence that option

soon went out the window. Had to make a dash for it without taking the clutch out and avoiding going sideways

up the road ,Had a awful drive home but didn't have to drive back quite so far as you ,shame really with a month of having walked into

a empty garage i was looking forward to it ,remember being in the garage till gone midnight washing and

polishing. Was nice to have it back in the garage all tucked up.

Edited by rat rod on Tuesday 25th May 16:10

footsoldier

2,258 posts

192 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
First time I drove my 400S also involved an exit from Mike's!
He had inspected it for me, and has looked after it ever since.
Collected late winter afternoon in Hayward's Heath, and ended up in Edinburgh quite a few hours later.
Through heavy traffic to get onto road north, LHD car, in the dark with yellow headlights (or candles..), and pouring rain. The rest of the trip was so memorable that I can't even remember the ramp at his garage as being an issue!

I used to drive mine more, even took it to Bisceter and back one weekend for the Countach get together, but have had a few issues in last year or two, and twice been on recovery trucks, once on the M6 and once closer to home. Had Mike take engine out and go over everything at the end of last year, so hopefully can get back on the road more now. I did have it trailered home last time - must be going soft!

As has been said, it's not what you'd pick for manoeuvres round town, but on the open roads it is a fantastic thing. Putting on P7s also made a big difference, and I'd highly recommend those if not on them already - much more compliant and designed for the car.
Also as mentioned, you can rely on it coming back from Mike Pullen's in great shape and running as well as you could imagine. However, it is true, that about two hours into a fast drive the song from the carbs reaches another pitch, you're on and off the throttle just to hear the overrun and it all makes a lot of sense! (Full Italian tune needed - to max revs, which is not that fast in a 400S...)

PurpleTurtle

6,977 posts

144 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Great write up, thanks for sharing what many of us will never experience.

As a lifetime fan of the Countach I am one of the many reading this who will have had the ubiquitous Athena poster on their bedroom wall in the 1980s, which didn't give a hint of the reality of the driving experience and, even though you spell it out in black and white, I still yearn for one! That reminds me ... £56m on Euromillions tonight!

I've just bought my 6yo lad a 1:64 scale Hot Wheels version - a Matchbox car, to those of us of a certain age. He loves it too. I can't wait to get him up close and personal with a real one at a classic car show, just so he can appreciate it in real life too.

sir humphrey appleby

1,619 posts

222 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
great write up Path, hopefully you remember me, I drove up from Southampton with a 3 am start to take up your generous offer of a passenger ride in your countach. I guess it was a few years back now, 7? Time moves too fast.

I can still remember it to this day, a never forgotten experience!

Cheers, Mark

cgt2

7,099 posts

188 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Amazingly detailed post. Sadly I never got to own one, went to buy one in Wimbledon many years ago but simply did not fit. Even in socks it was impossible for me to drive with size 12 feet!

Ferruccio

1,835 posts

119 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
footsoldier said:
The rest of the trip was so memorable that I can't even remember the ramp at his garage as being an issue!
No ramp at his garage.
Apparently it’s at his house, though I’ve never been there.

footsoldier

2,258 posts

192 months

Tuesday 25th May 2021
quotequote all
Ferruccio said:
No ramp at his garage.
Apparently it’s at his house, though I’ve never been there.
Ah...makes sense
Though I have collected from his house as well, and still don't remember it...clearly not paying attention!